GDT: Pens 2024 Trade Deadline Thread: Jake Shake Talk here

[Gurglesons]

The coping in here is hilarious.

This is the worst trade we have made in years. Coming after the worst UFA class we’ve seen in years.

Just absolute madness that we gave away the best winger in the Crosby era for literally nothing of value.

 

[Gurglesons]

About all your going to get though... people act like Canes are going to give away their best prospect don't seem to understand NHL trades and one of their top players.

How is this all you are going to get? Elias Lindholm got moved for better scratch off tickets.

Once again.

UFA signing, 2020 2nd, 2021 2nd, 2022 4th, 2024 2nd for Jake Guentzel

 

[rmartin65]

UFA signing, 2020 2nd, 2021 2nd, 2022 4th, 2024 2nd for Jake Guentzel

I mean, if you want to play that game-

UFA signing, 2020 2nd, 2022 2nd, 2022 4th, and 2024 2nd for 2013 3rd.

Looks great that way.

 

[Gurglesons]

I mean, if you want to play that game-

UFA signing, 2020 2nd, 2022 2nd, 2022 4th, and 2024 2nd for 2013 3rd.

Looks great that way.

The 2013 3rd has 20+ goals and is a PPG this season.

 

[rmartin65]

The 2013 3rd has 20+ goals and is a PPG this season.

You were reducing all the other pieces to their draft slot, so I figured you forgot to do it for JG.

This isn't me defending the trade- I am not particularly wild about it, but I am also not going to pretend that I know anything about the Canes prospects. It looks underwhelming, certainly. I just don't like to see intellectually dishonest arguments. Either the draft position matters, or it doesn't.

 

[molon labe]

The coping in here is hilarious.

This is the worst trade we have made in years. Coming after the worst UFA class we’ve seen in years.

Just absolute madness that we gave away the best winger in the Crosby era for literally nothing of value.

Expiring winger, at 30 years old, on IR, who stated he will NOT sign an extension with any team and will test free agency.

There's no coping - there was massive hype and expectations set - then reality.

This is not the worst trade we've made. And to your third bullet - giving away the best winger in the Crosby era? Come on man.... we gave away 2 months of Jake. That's it. Literally that is all. He's not a signed piece we dealt after 2018....he's a UFA and we utterly suck shit. This team sucks. This organization sucks. The coaching staff sucks. Nobody is doing anything about it - so at least this heads in that direction.

I halfway expected them to KEEP Jake on an insane deal just to appease all his social media girls. Granted - I don't think this trade does anything for us but at least it's something. So if that's coping so be it. I'll just state that outside of firing every coach in the system (including the goalie coach who convinced duber to sign Jarry forever) - I want the whole damn team traded away so starting with Jake ain't a bad place to start. Souless loser ass group that have less drive than a low T 90 year old on oxygen.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Yeah, I dunno what happened but Jake seemed pissed. Totally intent on hitting the open market. Maybe the team threw an offer at his agent that he resented. Maybe he just wants to cash out huge on his final big deal of his career. Either way, it was known he was a pure rental and that just f***ed things up.

Still, I can't believe Dubas couldn't do better.

 

[orby]

It's unfortunate that they couldn't get any of Carolina's better prospects but I think people were getting their hopes up too high based on total speculation.

 

[molon labe]

Yeah, I dunno what happened but Jake seemed pissed. Totally intent on hitting the open market. Maybe the team threw an offer at his agent that he resented. Maybe he just wants to cash out huge on his final big deal of his career. Either way, it was known he was a pure rental and that just f***ed things up.

Still, I can't believe Dubas couldn't do better.

He also had trade protections that I'm not sure meant a lick of anything - but possibly.

I'd assume he was willing to take a deal to ANY playoff team - as that is really going to determine his next contract for better or worse I would think...

And as far as speculation is concerned - I'd speculate the Pens were only willing to throw 5-6 year offers on the table and he was expected 8. Based on the influx of scoring in the league he may have missed his chance at the big numbers but will still likely command 8+ so nothing to cry about.

 

[Gurglesons]

Yeah, I dunno what happened but Jake seemed pissed. Totally intent on hitting the open market. Maybe the team threw an offer at his agent that he resented. Maybe he just wants to cash out huge on his final big deal of his career. Either way, it was known he was a pure rental and that just f***ed things up.

Still, I can't believe Dubas couldn't do better.

Nah. Dubas f***ed it up.

 

[Paulie Gualtieri]

It's unfortunate that they couldn't get any of Carolina's better prospects but I think people were getting their hopes up too high based on total speculation.

Absolutely. f***ing clownshow of speculation. Wish people would stop giving these guys a platform.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Nah. Dubas f***ed it up.

Both can be, and are true, imo.

It was well known Jake wasn't open to negotiating until the season was over and was seemingly intent on testing the market, and Dubas seemingly panicked and got a very meh return for the best player available at the TDL. Word is the Rangers offered a better deal but the team refused to send him to NYR. That sucks too, I don't give a shit if Jake's playing for the Flyers if they give up the best return. Make the best trade.

Oh well. Team's trash. Blow it up and fire Sully. (Not confident either happens cuz this is an organization steeped in cowardice, arrogance and dysfunction.)

 

[deakka]

Not a haul. But tbh if the 1st was not conditional it would have been perfectly fine. I think the prospects are still worth their draft spots, and Koivunen migh even be viewed as a late 1st value.

so essentialy its three 2nd rounds and a late 1st (Koivunen).

Bunting is a wash, i, neither see him as having value or negative value

 

[molon labe]

Not a haul. But tbh if the 1st was not conditional it would have been perfectly fine. I think the prospects are still worth their draft spots, and Koivunen migh even be viewed as a late 1st value.

so essentialy its three 2nd rounds and a late 1st (Koivunen).

Bunting is a wash, i, neither see him as having value or negative value

If Bunting replaces Smith at a cheaper cost next year as the 1/2LW, that's not a bad grab. But once again - this org is horrible at using it's cap space to fill out a roster...

Until we get a Kadri to help drive another scoring line and have better depth - we're going to be mediocre. The best we can hope for is an upgraded top 6 playmaker like Kadri and a new coach. Infusing a new system into this roster, drawing more offense from EK/power play...yeah we should make playoffs...but we aren't going anywhere until you utterly revamp the entire squad.

Maybe the defense can stay as-is. Maybe Jarry doesn't suck. But the forward group is shit.

 

[Ryder71]

Jesse seems to like the Russian a bit. Possibly a better version of Blueger he said or words of that nature. Me from the highlights I viewed and with a huge uptick in production I'm liking the Fin more and more.

 

[molon labe]

Ideally (if he's not moved) you want Eller as your 4C.
Bunting - Sid - Rust/Rakell
Geno - *Kadri* - Rust/Rakell
Puus - *** - ***
Bemstrom - Eller - Acciari/DOC


Those asterisks hold up the season. And if DOC + Acciari are both bottom 6 than you need a serious catalyst piece coming in because once again the offense will be non existent.

Get back to 3 scoring lines. Hell 4 if we can. But fire Sullivan into the Fn orbit and bring in someone who can do it. This 1 scoring line and 3 lines of reminisce look at me when I was younger grinder unskilled shit needs to die.

 

[HandshakeLine]

The funny thing is Bunting is the type of player this power play needs - an actual net front presence, or at least something close to it.

Yeah, I wasn’t really kidding there. We tried to use Jake like Hornqvist for far too long. It clearly wasnt working.

Jesse seems to like the Russian a bit. Possibly a better version of Blueger he said or words of that nature. Me from the highlights I viewed and with a huge uptick in production I'm liking the Fin more and more.

Hoorah.

 

[orby]

Posted this on the trade board by accident, so I'm reposting it here...

This is definitely a quantity over quality deal, but to be perfectly honest, it's a reasonable strategy to get as many guys who look like they MIGHT hit as possible. The majority of "blue chip prospects" about whom people on the internet get excited turn out like Eric Tangradi or Joe Morrow.

A UFA winger who has stated he won't sign an in-season extension simply wasn't going to bring back the sun and the moon. I was hoping for Morrow, but ultimately that was just based on Twitter BS from people who didn't know what they were talking about.

A rebuild doesn't happen from trading one guy. It's gonna take time and it's gonna suck for the Pens. But this is the reality of the league and it's not worth frothing at the mouth about it.

 

[HandshakeLine]

The coping in here is hilarious.

This is the worst trade we have made in years. Coming after the worst UFA class we’ve seen in years.

Just absolute madness that we gave away the best winger in the Crosby era for literally nothing of value.

It's up there with the Jágr trade in terms of value gotten back. One of these C+ prospects might hit, but man, those are way longer odds than it had to be.

 

[Ryder71]

Yeah, I wasn’t really kidding there. We tried to use Jake like Hornqvist for far too long. It clearly wasnt working.


Hoorah.

I know, not exciting. But he's not the main piece so...

 

[HandshakeLine]

I know, not exciting. But he's not the main piece so...

No, you're right. I'm just being sardonic on this club being forever cursed with Bluegers and his slightly better versions.

 

[molon labe]

It's up there with the Jágr trade in terms of value gotten back. One of these C+ prospects might hit, but man, those are way longer odds than it had to be.

I mean can we admit Jake shouldn't be in the same conversation as Jagr though? If you two wanna go down that route....

And again...it's 2 months of Jake. That's it. Whether they end up re-signing him or not, that's where we're at. Our season is over and we traded 2 months of Jake and some people wanted more. I agree with the draft capital but outside of that it's worthless speculation what that should have gotten us.

 

[Ryder71]

It's up there with the Jágr trade in terms of value gotten back. One of these C+ prospects might hit, but man, those are way longer odds than it had to be.

I think the Fin is at a higher level than the other pieces. Having a real good year in the finnish elite league almost doubling his production from last season and only 20. Top five in scoring I believe.

 

[HandshakeLine]

I mean can we admit Jake shouldn't be in the same conversation as Jagr though? If you two wanna go down that route....

And again...it's 2 months of Jake. That's it. Whether they end up re-signing him or not, that's where we're at. Our season is over and we traded 2 months of Jake and some people wanted more. I agree with the draft capital but outside of that it's worthless speculation what that should have gotten us.

Of course, they're different situations, but man, just emphasizing that these are really subpar returns. Jake didn't help matters, but hell, that's probably why the club should have traded him last year or early this year when the slide started, but this team was just too married to GCR and Dullivan hockey to make the smart move.

 

[molon labe]

Of course, they're different situations, but man, just emphasizing that these are really subpar returns. Jake didn't help matters, but hell, that's probably why the club should have traded him last year or early this year when the slide started, but this team was just too married to GCR and Dullivan hockey to make the smart move.

Step 1: It's keeping Sullivan 4-5 years past his expiration date, truly.
Step 2: It's running roster decisions through said failed coach.
Step 3: It's trading actual assets and draft capital to meet failed coaches expectations. (Including SEVERAL outbound players who would be great to have)

---

Step 4: Off-the-mark roster construction after several seasons/years of evidence of what this team needs.


Turning it around would have been firing Sully the day Dubas was hired. Not resigning Jarry. And targeting JT Miller over EK. However - I can at least understand dishing out the scraps we did for EK to try and undo some of Hextall - but to keep Sully/Jarry...then whiff on everyone else you signed only to refuse to do any mid-season corrections is just horrendous management.

All I can hope for at this point is a fire sale for assets and to, once again, hope they change course. Fire the coach, get the 1C/2C tweener we've desperately needed for four years now, and start injecting young talent into the roster.


And before we go all wishing for tanking. I'd like to remind everyone that top-dog Boston never bottomed out and that Pasta was 25th overall selection. Their C depth is kinda poo but they get it done. It's all about systems/coaching and management when you've got aging vets. Unfortunately the Penguins' have been utter shit for the better part of a decade now.