Player Discussion: Patrik Laine IVever: a new hope? (Laine out of PAP, trade request still stands)

[Marioesque]

It isn't but it's all stuff we've been told by people who think any negative assessment of Laine is illogical and not based in reality.

I've seen plenty of somewhat negative assessments of aspects of Laine's play go by and agreed with many.

But I can't be expected to respect opinions that are clearly driven by emotion, and in total contradiction of measurable performance. I'm gonna have to go with the measurable performance rather than giving equal weight to someone's feelings and considering it as valid critique.

 

[VT]

It isn't but it's all stuff we've been told by people who think any negative assessment of Laine is illogical and not based in reality.

Because more than once Laine's opinions on a game are based on emotion. Btw this doesn't just apply to those who don't like him.

 

[cbjthrowaway]

It isn't but it's all stuff we've been told by people who think any negative assessment of Laine is illogical and not based in reality.

to be fair, a lot of the negativity around laine on this board is illogical (one poster saying he'd trade laine for a 7th to sign a UFA, another saying chinakhov brings more to the table right now than laine, etc.)

patrik laine is a very productive and talented player who also has flaws in his game. he's not connor mcdavid. he's not going to be a power forward or a two-way force. but he's grown immensely as a playmaker and 5v5 point producer and there's plenty of value in a player who can do what he does.

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

Because more than once Laine's opinions on a game are based on emotion. Btw this doesn't just apply to those who don't like him.

That’s the point. There is some irrationality happening both in support of and in criticism.

 

[Halberdier]

This new 1C Laine is pretty interesting thing, and Laine is definitely excited about the opportunity.

"It was his idea.

“We talked about it already, that we’re going to watch some video (Monday) or (Tuesday) and go over these situations and reads, and just try to learn,” Laine said. “It might not just be my (video). It might be other top centers in the league and just try to learn from them, what they do in certain situations, on faceoffs and all this. It’s tough times, but I’m super excited about this opportunity. I’m willing to learn and just learn new tricks every day.”"

Columbus Blue Jackets experimenting with Patrik Laine at center

Blue Jackets looking at Laine in the middle, playing him at center in loss to Golden Knights: 'I'm willing to learn it'

eu.dispatch.com

Laine is also slowly approaching 1PPG again even when the team is tanking even harder than last season. And the goal/shot/ff/corsi differentials are relatively maybe best he has ever had.

Point totals from all situations (nhl.com), other stats 5-on-5 Natural stat trick, relative and rates. So at least Laine has been worth the money for this season.

 

[Johansen2Foligno]

If we are talking about moving Laine to #1C, I guess we have confirmed the NHL has informed us we won't be winning the lottery.

 

[NotCommitted]

If we are talking about moving Laine to #1C, I guess we have confirmed the NHL has informed us we won't be winning the lottery.

I'd prefer to think they have nothing to lose and lost one of their two proven NHL quality centers in Kuraly, so they are using this opportunity to give Laine an experience he's shown interest for and who knows, maybe at some point he can play center occasionally as an injury replacement even when the games have something on the line. In any case it'll help him develop his game, something he seems pretty keen about. And he'd be far from the first winger to move to center, but if that's ever going to happen I think it's far more likely it'll be a gradual thing rather than him to just moving to C like that.

 

[Marioesque]

This new 1C Laine is pretty interesting thing, and Laine is definitely excited about the opportunity.

"It was his idea.

“We talked about it already, that we’re going to watch some video (Monday) or (Tuesday) and go over these situations and reads, and just try to learn,” Laine said. “It might not just be my (video). It might be other top centers in the league and just try to learn from them, what they do in certain situations, on faceoffs and all this. It’s tough times, but I’m super excited about this opportunity. I’m willing to learn and just learn new tricks every day.”"

Columbus Blue Jackets experimenting with Patrik Laine at center

Blue Jackets looking at Laine in the middle, playing him at center in loss to Golden Knights: 'I'm willing to learn it'

eu.dispatch.com

Laine is also slowly approaching 1PPG again even when the team is tanking even harder than last season. And the goal/shot/ff/corsi differentials are relatively maybe best he has ever had.

Point totals from all situations (nhl.com), other stats 5-on-5 Natural stat trick, relative and rates. So at least Laine has been worth the money for this season.View attachment 672710View attachment 672711View attachment 672712View attachment 672713View attachment 672714

Hard to argue against that. Alone with positive GF% . Also Johnny is noticeably worse without Laine, but Laine has been better without Johnny. Shot creation is well above others too.

 

[Halberdier]

Hard to argue against that. Alone with positive GF% . Also Johnny is noticeably worse without Laine, but Laine has been better without Johnny. Shot creation is well above others too.

There is not much difference on stats for Laine w Johnny versus Laine w/o Johnny. I think it's fair to say Laine has been doing good regardless if he plays with Johnny or not. On the other hand, Johnny has not done well without Laine.

I really, really hope the next season there are 2 decent 1st&2nd lines for CBJ, optimally Jenner leading an excellent 3rd line. For that KJ needs to be used as a C, "Bedard/Fantilli/Carlsson" must be on TOP-6, and who knows if even this "center Laine" evolves into something semi-permanent solution. Marchenko is looking good and one of the rest of the youngsters needs to fill the remaining TOP-6 spot.

 

[BB88]

If we are talking about moving Laine to #1C, I guess we have confirmed the NHL has informed us we won't be winning the lottery.

Just make sure you’re last so you’ll end up with Carlsson

 

[CBJx614]

I'd prefer to think they have nothing to lose and lost one of their two proven NHL quality centers in Kuraly, so they are using this opportunity to give Laine an experience he's shown interest for and who knows, maybe at some point he can play center occasionally as an injury replacement even when the games have something on the line. In any case it'll help him develop his game, something he seems pretty keen about. And he'd be far from the first winger to move to center, but if that's ever going to happen I think it's far more likely it'll be a gradual thing rather than him to just moving to C like that.

We just need to get Laine as many reps at center as humanly possible so we can see if this is just an experiment or if it's something we can truly roll with next season.


Laine already trains with one of the leagues best centers, would be nice to throw in faceoff practice to their routine in the summer

 

[Iron Balls McGinty]

If we are talking about moving Laine to #1C, I guess we have confirmed the NHL has informed us we won't be winning the lottery.

Or maybe we are winning it and now the team is just doing all kinds of stuff to troll us and make sure we don't raise suspicions.



Either the team is desperate to try anything and see if it works like that time we tried a Hall of Fame center as a defenseman or its a crazy enough move that it just might work.

 

[VT]

Or maybe we are winning it and now the team is just doing all kinds of stuff to troll us and make sure we don't raise suspicions.



Either the team is desperate to try anything and see if it works like that time we tried a Hall of Fame center as a defenseman or its a crazy enough move that it just might work.

Fedorov played quite a few games as a defenseman in Detroit as well. I mean PO.

 

[Johansen2Foligno]

I'd prefer to think they have nothing to lose and lost one of their two proven NHL quality centers in Kuraly, so they are using this opportunity to give Laine an experience he's shown interest for and who knows, maybe at some point he can play center occasionally as an injury replacement even when the games have something on the line. In any case it'll help him develop his game, something he seems pretty keen about. And he'd be far from the first winger to move to center, but if that's ever going to happen I think it's far more likely it'll be a gradual thing rather than him to just moving to C like that.

This is too complicated and unrealistic of an explanation.

 

[JacketsDavid]

I thought Hitch was nuts to play Nash on the PP, but you know it taught him to be more responsible.

So maybe playing Laine at C can help him be a bit better in the defensive zone?

Again I don't think it's part of any long-term plan for several reasons - namely the CBJ organization can't see more than about 48 hours out...

 

[Xoggz22]

Not going to lie... First, I have no issue with trying Laine at center. However, if this is development, what does this say about KJ center prospects moving forward. Why not put him at center to evaluate and learn. Just seems like he's destined to be a wing... and that's fine too. And I know I've said he can play wing next year and still move to center. Certainly still an option... However, if you are "trying" things, I would think that's one thing to try. Failure now isn't something that should stick with a player as a bad experience or ruining him. Just seems odd to go to this extreme when you could play KJ, or even Foudy, at center with some prior experience and the prospects of them actually being one moving forward.

 

[CBJx614]

Not going to lie... First, I have no issue with trying Laine at center. However, if this is development, what does this say about KJ center prospects moving forward. Why not put him at center to evaluate and learn. Just seems like he's destined to be a wing... and that's fine too. And I know I've said he can play wing next year and still move to center. Certainly still an option... However, if you are "trying" things, I would think that's one thing to try. Failure now isn't something that should stick with a player as a bad experience or ruining him. Just seems odd to go to this extreme when you could play KJ, or even Foudy, at center with some prior experience and the prospects of them actually being one moving forward.

Honestly I think KJ is going to be dependant on whether we get Bedard or not. KJ and Bedard are close friends and already have a ton of chemistry. Lines next season could end up looking like some combination of

Gaudreau - Bedard - KJ
Jenner - Laine - Marchenko
Danforth - Silly - Texier
Insert depth player - Kuraly - Robinson


I know I'm forgetting someone important in that lineup, but Laine and Bedard at center fixes a big team need.

Having said that we/I am getting way too ahead of ourselves on Laine at center. Realistically, he's probably going back to wing sometime before the end of the season, but it's nice to give us some hope.

 

[LoneFunyan]

In a lost season where a lot of guys are probably mailing it in, a highly-paid player is taking a risk by trying to be more useful to the team and potentially picking up new knowledge, skills and information.

Laine seems committed to becoming a better player, even to the extent of exposing himself to new challenges in real league play when there's nothing to be lost. I have people on my team at work who won't do that for fear of looking foolish (or just fear of leaving their comfort zone). Let alone doing in in front of a few thousand people.

 

[VT]

Not going to lie... First, I have no issue with trying Laine at center. However, if this is development, what does this say about KJ center prospects moving forward. Why not put him at center to evaluate and learn. Just seems like he's destined to be a wing... and that's fine too. And I know I've said he can play wing next year and still move to center. Certainly still an option... However, if you are "trying" things, I would think that's one thing to try. Failure now isn't something that should stick with a player as a bad experience or ruining him. Just seems odd to go to this extreme when you could play KJ, or even Foudy, at center with some prior experience and the prospects of them actually being one moving forward.

They can have some prior experience but where is written they would be better? Also Foudy improve his stats and play when he was moved to LW in his junior team. Johnson doesn't strength yet. If he isn't, I don't thing he could play center.
Simply, future shows. Laine played only one game as a center, although against the strong team, strong d-men.

 

[VT]

Honestly I think KJ is going to be dependant on whether we get Bedard or not. KJ and Bedard are close friends and already have a ton of chemistry. Lines next season could end up looking like some combination of

Gaudreau - Bedard - KJ
Jenner - Laine - Marchenko
Danforth - Silly - Texier
Insert depth player - Kuraly - Robinson


I know I'm forgetting someone important in that lineup, but Laine and Bedard at center fixes a big team need.

Having said that we/I am getting way too ahead of ourselves on Laine at center. Realistically, he's probably going back to wing sometime before the end of the season, but it's nice to give us some hope.

Our schedule in March: Washington, Islanders, Montréal, Rangers, Boston. If he plays all games, it will be real exams for him.

 

[NotCommitted]

Just as I like the Laine experiment, I would love to see KJ play as a center. If they see him as a future C at all, now would be a great time to give it a look. It's not like playing 10 games at the end of the year at the position would be stunting his development or be a move of throwing him to the wolves. I just can't see any negatives about it, the org has a better idea where he's at, the player gets a taste of what the requirements will be and how they need to improve to be successful in the future. Or he does well and you can start him as C with confidence next year. Just give him good wingers and don't drown him in D-zone starts.

 

[majormajor]

Just as I like the Laine experiment, I would love to see KJ play as a center. If they see him as a future C at all, now would be a great time to give it a look. It's not like playing 10 games at the end of the year at the position would be stunting his development or be a move of throwing him to the wolves. I just can't see any negatives about it, the org has a better idea where he's at, the player gets a taste of what the requirements will be and how they need to improve to be successful in the future. Or he does well and you can start him as C with confidence next year. Just give him good wingers and don't drown him in D-zone starts.

I agree but it seems they want to give easier offensive minutes to Laine and of course Sillinger too. Pederson can't play much. Someone has to take the difficult starts and matchups. I personally would just run Laine, KJ, Jenner, and Pederson down the middle, but this team seems fully committed to failing with Sillinger from start to finish.

 

[cbjthrowaway]

q: is patty a center now? is this an argument for positionless hockey at the NHL level? does this trial run make laine better at winger? is it all part of the tank?

a: no one knows what it means, but it's provocative… it gets the people going!

 

[thebus88]

“Mickey Mouse” might actually finally be an acceptable and accurate description at this point.

“Unbelievable” (really it isn’t) that Laine is getting looked at in all these made up positive ways, as if he’s making all these “sacrifices” (or whatever) for the team, and at the same time can’t be looked at as ANY part of the problem why the team is so bad.

There is NOTHING to gain from Laine playing center to end the year. They just lost again 7-2 when he played center. He’s gotta change his priorities and positioning on the ice, him playing poorly at center isn’t going to change all the things he needs to change while playing on the wing. He DOES NOT have the “attributes” for a good center, offensively or defensively.

Not giving looks to Johnson/Foudy/Bemstrom at center, with the same mindset that is being given the Laine at C experiment, IS ASININE.

 

[cbjthrowaway]

Not giving looks to Johnson/Foudy/Bemstrom at center, with the same mindset that is being given the Laine at C experiment, IS ASININE.

i'm also unsure why kj wasn't given another shot there before patrik laine – or why cole sillinger, who has been playing better lately, still hasn't had an opportunity to play with gaudreau.

but liam foudy? emil bemstrom? cmon, man. they haven't even shown that they belong in the NHL yet. i'm not saying patrik laine is a center but he has way more 'center traits' than either of those guys do: size/reach, vision, passing, hands, top six experience/production.

beyond emil bemstrom being listed as a center in EA NHL (a position he's never actually played), what has he (or foudy) shown at the NHL level to indicate that they're a better fit there than laine?