Player Discussion: Patrik Laine IVever: a new hope? (Laine out of PAP, trade request still stands)

[majormajor]

If the Jackets find themselves in a cap bind here are always trades, buyouts, LTIR ways out of the jam.

I missed this part earlier, but it is kind of important. If Laine doesn't get a NMC then I might be persuaded to accept something above $9m per.

 

[LJ7]

Secondly I don't see any other 8 to 9 million dollar guy currently on the roster. Maybe KJ becomes that but I'll take the under on that one.

Allow me to take the over

As for Laine I don't think starting at $8.2 was unreasonable. I want to see him signed here for $9 million for 5 years but we'll see what they come up with. Neither side really benefits from signing soon either so patience will be key for us as fans.

 

[Vapaatunnus]

Anyway, personally I am not worried and I am pretty sure that we will see Patty in CBJ next season. That is of course only my feeling.

 

[BB88]

It's definitely not a problem short term. If we were just talking short term deals that would be different. We would like to build a cup winner so let's think about what we want that cap structure to look like five years from now.



Who knows, but I'm starting to think it will be the over.

At that point atleast 9M will be a regular money in this league.

It won’t be that superstars get that money anymore, it will be that every 1st line guy will be making that money.

But the point stands they can’t overpay too many guys

 

[Xoggz22]

I don't know what Laine is worth except he is worth what ever a team is willing to pay. As I look at the Jackets salary cap situation I just don't see any reason to be concerned about a million dollars in Laine's deal.

First off Jake and his 8.5 mm are most likely gone in 2 years. That pays for all but 1 mm of a 9.5 mm deal for Laine.

Secondly I don't see any other 8 to 9 million dollar guy currently on the roster. Maybe KJ becomes that but I'll take the under on that one. In any case all of he young guys have one RFA deal before the serious stuff becomes a reality.

If the Jackets find themselves in a cap bind here are always trades, buyouts, LTIR ways out of the jam.

That's why, to me, a 5 or 6 year deal would seem to be a good spot for this team. Players like KJ, Sillinger and whomever comes out of this draft or recent drafts that pop won't get that kind of money for another 3-5 years down the road. All depends on how you approach them. I'm a proponent of bridge deals, especially as you build. Not everyone but if you don't know (ie. Jack Roslovic) you can give nice raises but not break bank until you know. It might cost a little more at times but it's also possible that as they build a winner, players will WANT to stay and take something fair. We're not there yet so a little higher on Laine but a little less term would be OK with me.

 

[EspenK]

The other thing to consider if the deal is an 8 year, 9.5mm one is that in 8 years the cap will likely rise by 8 million dollars. Granted salries in general will rise but i just can't see Laine's deal becoming an albatross strictly from a cap perspective.

 

[5th Line Fanatic]

He might as well, IF all he cares about is the money. I think there is the potential that some team would pay him that much, but probably a bad one that is taking a huge risk. Jarmo is not wrong that we have to think about having the money leftover to get more good players. If Patrik Laine is your one good forward then your team is average at best. I'm looking at the two teams on my screen right now, each with a few players that are unambiguously better that Laine, and yet Laine would be making more $$ than all of them. Many of those guys could have left to make more money elsewhere but they were persuaded that they were a part of something that could be great, and they left money for their teammates. We had to overpay Werenski to stop the bleeding, but I'm not doing that again. At some point you have to say that we have a chance to build something great here, do you want to be a part of it or not? I'd trade Laine if we can't get him under $9.6m. I don't think you can build a winner paying that much.

It's not just about the money, it's about what the money says. Money is how they keep score. NHL players are elite athletes and most of them have a pretty large ego or they likely wouldn't have had the drive to become elite to begin with. Patrik Laine knows he's the best player on this team. We can debate wether that's true or not, but Laine for sure believes it. He knows we are well under the cap. He knows we can afford to pay him like the best player on the team. While he wants to be here and will take less than Marner got, it will be highly offensive to him to take less than another player on a mediocre team.

Don't blame Laine, blame Jarmo for overpaying Werenski.

 

[Finner]

9.5M dont care. Laine is star, star who brings CBJ up in NHL social media, highlight reels. His shirts are selling high. If he can perform point per game its a victory. Capspace will rise, Voraceks deal ends in 2years. We have no problem about paying him 9.5M just make it 7-8years cause Laine will be valuable still after 6years

 

[VT]

9.5M dont care. Laine is star, star who brings CBJ up in NHL social media, highlight reels. His shirts are selling high. If he can perform point per game its a victory. Capspace will rise, Voraceks deal ends in 2years. We have no problem about paying him 9.5M just make it 7-8years cause Laine will be valuable still after 6years

Honestly. Elvis is popular among Columbus and Latvia fans, but others don't care too much. If at all. Bjorkie, while excellent as a player, is uninteresting for media and fans other teams too. Same goes for Werenski. Chinakhov and Sillinger are admittedly popular, especially among teenegers. But again, in Columbus. Although Cole has potential not only here. Right now, only Laine has the potential to be not only a hockey star, but also a media star in Columbus/Ohio. It's just that the club needs to capitalize on it.

 

[stevo61]

Honestly. Elvis is popular among Columbus and Latvia fans, but others don't care too much. If at all. Bjorkie, while excellent as a player, is uninteresting for media and fans other teams too. Same goes for Werenski. Chinakhov and Sillinger are admittedly popular, especially among teenegers. But again, in Columbus. Although Cole has potential not only here. Right now, only Laine has the potential to be not only a hockey star, but also a media star in Columbus/Ohio. It's just that the club needs to capitalize on it.

You know what gets peoples attention? Winning. Jarmo needs to decide at what number Laine becomes no longer worth it when it comes to the real goal but I dont doubt it gets done. Also I think you are very wrong on Elvis and Johnson can definitely be that guy on the ice that makes kids want to buy his jerseys

 

[VT]

You know what gets peoples attention? Winning. Jarmo needs to decide at what number Laine becomes no longer worth it when it comes to the real goal but I dont doubt it gets done. Also I think you are very wrong on Elvis and Johnson can definitely be that guy on the ice that makes kids want to buy his jerseys

Do you really think Elvis is interesting for NHL fans? Now is the time when you have to be interesting, have charisma, be able to attract fans even with words. Elvis can wear hats and such, but that's it. Laine, on the other hand, will say what he thinks. And his suits are more interesting. Just look at the popularity of glasses.
Or look at Kyle Connor. He's an excelent player but he isn't such popular in other towns. Look at Ovechkin, his popularity although Malkin (if only about Russians) weren't worse. Who is more popular, Josi or Makar?
I understand victories are the most important that's why we can't give him the big salary more than $9.500.000 (I count with bigger salary cap and salaries later, remember Aho) but we must think about it too. And we're the team what needs to be more popular.

 

[Monk]

Do you really think Elvis is interesting for NHL fans?

Yes

 

[VT]

Yes

In my opinion, this is just wishful thinking. Because we're not just talking about the big NHL fans, but also the ones who watch it now and then. And there's certainly not a guy who's going to win over new fans like Ovechkin. Admittedly, in this case, I'm not sure Laine could do it either.

 

[BB88]

Yes

I think Laine by far attracts the most media attention from Columbus.

He’s been a rock start in the eyes of NHL media since draft year

 

[Monk]

In my opinion, this is just wishful thinking. Because we're not just talking about the big NHL fans, but also the ones who watch it now and then. And there's certainly not a guy who's going to win over new fans like Ovechkin. Admittedly, in this case, I'm not sure Laine could do it either.

Yeah if Ovi is the standard, we're screwed.

When it comes to charisma, though, Elvis > Laine.

Laine is sort of old news to the average NHL fan if you ask me. They probably think of him as a disappointment or just don't think about him at all.

And I don't mean this as a negative to Laine, mostly I think you're selling Elvis short in your comparison. I like them both.

I think Laine by far attracts the most media attention from Columbus.

He’s been a rock start in the eyes of NHL media since draft year

I mean I guess he's polarizing from what I can see on this forum. I don't see him in the media any more than anyone else on the team. If anything Elvis has been more so since the accident.

 

[Xoggz22]

To

Do you really think Elvis is interesting for NHL fans? Now is the time when you have to be interesting, have charisma, be able to attract fans even with words. Elvis can wear hats and such, but that's it. Laine, on the other hand, will say what he thinks. And his suits are more interesting. Just look at the popularity of glasses.
Or look at Kyle Connor. He's an excelent player but he isn't such popular in other towns. Look at Ovechkin, his popularity although Malkin (if only about Russians) weren't worse. Who is more popular, Josi or Makar?
I understand victories are the most important that's why we can't give him the big salary more than $9.500.000 (I count with bigger salary cap and salaries later, remember Aho) but we must think about it too. And we're the team what needs to be more popular.

To @stevo61 point, if the CBJ is winning, and Elvis is playing well too. He absolutely has the personality people would pay attention to outside of Columbus. Why? Because if they win and get some national attention, Elvis would be a big part of the show. He has personality. Personality will only get you so far if you play on a loser. So I'll second the fact that Columbus needs to win, first and foremost, then worry about national attention. It WILL follow, even for Columbus.

 

[BB88]

Yeah if Ovi is the standard, we're screwed.

When it comes to charisma, though, Elvis > Laine.

Laine is sort of old news to the average NHL fan if you ask me. They probably think of him as a disappointment or just don't think about him at all.

And I don't mean this as a negative to Laine, mostly I think you're selling Elvis short in your comparison. I like them both.



I mean I guess he's polarizing from what I can see on this forum. I don't see him in the media any more than anyone else on the team. If anything Elvis has been more so since the accident.

I follow lot of different teams games and follow a lot what happens in the NHL.

I don’t see Elvis anywhere in the superstar tier in media draw.

Maybe it changes but right now& what has been in the past Laine is the media guy bar none.
Johnson has potential to get hype around him based on his skill

 

[Monk]

I follow lot of different teams games and follow a lot what happens in the NHL.

I don’t see Elvis anywhere in the superstar tier in media draw.

Maybe it changes but right now& what has been in the past Laine is the media guy bar none.
Johnson has potential to get hype around him based on his skill

I agree. I'm saying I don't see Laine there either (anymore).

If all we're really saying, going back to VT's post, is that we see more pictures of Laine with outlandish outfits than anyone else on the team, then I guess that's true.

 

[DougKnowsBest]

Somehow the coverage of liane feels very big time and very connected to the city. Much More so then bread. I think everyone but us knew he was just passing through. Something about laine just fits the city. It’s completely irrational but laine just need the chip on his shoulder polished up a little more, a little more grit coming through. And he is a cbus boy

 

[majormajor]

9.5M dont care. Laine is star, star who brings CBJ up in NHL social media, highlight reels. His shirts are selling high. If he can perform point per game its a victory. Capspace will rise, Voraceks deal ends in 2years. We have no problem about paying him 9.5M just make it 7-8years cause Laine will be valuable still after 6years

How much money do you think the Jackets make on shirts? Six-figures maybe?

Really, if we don't build a winner, then there is no saving grace in shirts.

At that point atleast 9M will be a regular money in this league.

It won’t be that superstars get that money anymore, it will be that every 1st line guy will be making that money.

But the point stands they can’t overpay too many guys

We've got another recession coming, I wouldn't bet on the cap ceiling going up by more than a million per year. $9m now will be about as meaningful as $9m 5 years from now.

 

[stevo61]

How much money do you think the Jackets make on shirts? Six-figures maybe?

Really, if we don't build a winner, then there is no saving grace in shirts.



We've got another recession coming, I wouldn't bet on the cap ceiling going up by more than a million per year. $9m now will be about as meaningful as $9m 5 years from now.

Its a gamble Toronto took and look at them now. Cant operate under assumptions and I think Jarmo is pretty good at looking at more than right now.
There is some talk that there will be a year that the cap is expected to see a big jump all at once. I think it was Chris Johnson (but dont hold me to it) saying expect a bunch of new contracts to all end on the same year whenever that will be

 

[thebus88]

Fascinating how much people focus on everything else regarding Elvis and Laine other than how good they are at actually winning meaningful NHL hockey games….

Winning hockey games should be more important than dressing well.

Should trade both guys.

IMO.

 

[VT]

Yeah if Ovi is the standard, we're screwed.

When it comes to charisma, though, Elvis > Laine.

Laine is sort of old news to the average NHL fan if you ask me. They probably think of him as a disappointment or just don't think about him at all.

And I don't mean this as a negative to Laine, mostly I think you're selling Elvis short in your comparison. I like them both.



I mean I guess he's polarizing from what I can see on this forum. I don't see him in the media any more than anyone else on the team. If anything Elvis has been more so since the accident.

It is said that time heals. Fans of the other teams have probably forgotten the tragedy.
Vasilevsky is the best goalie in the world, but you can't call him charismatic. The same goes for Shesterkin. Compare them to Lehner.
How many defensemen are better than Subban, but who is more interesting to fans?
You find Elvis charismatic because you like him, but do other NHL fans? You say that if we win and Elvis plays well, his popularity will increase. And that if Laine can start to fulfill his potential, you haven't thought about that?
Btw, I think Sillinger and maybe Boqvist can gain popularity as well.
Whether you like Ovechkin or not, he's popular with the fans, which helps Capitals. Compare Caps without him, even when they were playing in the finals and then.

 

[Monk]

It is said that time heals. Fans of the other teams have probably forgotten the tragedy.
Vasilevsky is the best goalie in the world, but you can't call him charismatic. The same goes for Shesterkin. Compare them to Lehner.
How many defensemen are better than Subban, but who is more interesting to fans?
You find Elvis charismatic because you like him, but do other NHL fans? You say that if we win and Elvis plays well, his popularity will increase. And that if Laine can start to fulfill his potential, you haven't thought about that?
Btw, I think Sillinger and maybe Boqvist can gain popularity as well.
Whether you like Ovechkin or not, he's popular with the fans, which helps Capitals. Compare Caps without him, even when they were playing in the finals and then.

Let me put it a different way - I don't live in Columbus and I've never see either of them in the news. I see them each occasionally in online media. Maybe it's different in Columbus/Ohio.

Laine hasn't raised the profile of the CBJ in national media any more than Elvis has.

EDIT: I agree that Laine's on-ice performance could become a bigger draw. All this charisma stuff is mostly nonsense and not doing anything to draw fans. If he scores a lot and helps them win a lot, sure.

 

[VT]

Let me put it a different way - I don't live in Columbus and I've never see either of them in the news. I see them each occasionally in online media. Maybe it's different in Columbus/Ohio.

Laine hasn't raised the profile of the CBJ in national media any more than Elvis has.

EDIT: I agree that Laine's on-ice performance could become a bigger draw. All this charisma stuff is mostly nonsense and not doing anything to draw fans. If he scores a lot and helps them win a lot, sure.

I'm not talking about the situation now, but about the future. Elvis says the right things, Laine has, as we say, a sharp tongue. Except when it comes to dressing. Besides, I mentioned NHL fans. And I clearly wrote that I don't have much faith that Laine can win fans of other sports over to Columbus, like Ovechkin.
But it's important for the club to advertise to the players on the internet, social networks and so on. And not only to them. When I compare it to others, after all, even Carolina has a better one.