Injury Report: Pacioretty ruptures his Achilles again - placed on season ending IR

[Navin R Slavin]

If I have learned nothing in the past few years reading crap on the internet more than I did in my earlier years, there are waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay more individuals out there lacking in basic cognitive reasoning, intellect, intelligence, vision, basic comprehension of the nhl rule book, etc. than I ever thought possible before..

In a general sense I always knew there were idiots and homers and blind stupid people in the world. I avoided engaging in stupid pointless back and forth with someone hiding behind their belief that they were anonymous on the internet. I figured a good chunk of people couldn't really be that stupid and were just trying to be a $hit disturber due to some perverted sense of entertainment they got from posting inflammatory idiotic things on the internet.... but I was wrong... there really are a lot more morons than I originally thought... I may be one of them when it comes to certain topics or situations... I sure hope not but I at least have to acknowledge the possibility and try to be better educated so I don't show my a$$ or say something just as moronic from time to time.....

Entirely too many people should take to heart the advice "if you dont have anything nice to say then maybe you shouldn't say anything at all" or "better to be thought an idiot then open your mouth and remove all doubt".... large chunks of certain fan bases would be better served taking those tidbits onboard.....

/end philosophic examination for today...

but u suk tho lol looser

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Yea, but Boston fans are...well Boston fans. They're definitely high up there on the "dish it but can't take it" scale...I mean they were practically calling for Tro's head after the Prius vs Lambo thing and going nuts over that.

I get and agree with your point though, I just find those vocal folks to be the outliers and not worthy of the time/attention.

Repeat offenders just get a lot less leeway for a reason...they're masters of "technicalities" and "accidently (on purpose)". Like James Neal all those years ago making runs at Schenn & Giroux (I think) with 100% full intention of blowing their heads off. But they were able to mostly avoid the hits and he got like a 1 game suspension for hurting one of them, but it should have been more given the intent of those hits. Trouba's elbow came flying UP and out as he made the hit, that gives a much worse intent

I pretty much agree with everything you wrote with the exception of the bold, if you are referring to the Jarvis hit. Go back and look at the link I posted above with still frames a fraction of a second before the hit and at moment of impact.

EDIT: For convenience, I posted them here instead:

A second before the hit: Elbow tucked

The moment of the hit, elbow tucked and both skates on the ice.

There is head contact, but by the NHL rulebook, it's not an illegal check to the head. The rule states that 1) The head has to be the main point of contact. That's not the case here as he's hitting his shoulder/chest simultaneously. 2) Contact with the head was avoidable. By avoidable the rule says "whether the player attempted to hit squarely through the opponent's body and the head was not "picked" as a result of poor timing, poor angle of approach or unnecessary extension of the body upward or outward". I don't see him "picking" the head here.

So IMO, by the NHL rulebook, this is not an illegal hit.

That's not to say that Trouba's Elbow hasn't come flying up on other hits (or even misses like in the TB series). I even made a joke about him leading with his elbow in the thread about his captaincy. I'm only referring to this specific hit on Jarvis. I do think it falls into the "predatory" category like AA said above.

Anyhow, that's water under the bridge now and deviating from my initial post before the Trouba discussion. Like when Aho got a concussion from Giordano early on in his career, hopefully Jarvis learned a lesson and yet will still be willing to go to the dirty areas like he has been. If he continues to play the way he did, I expect big things from him this year.

 

[cptjeff]

I don't understand how anyone can possibly look at that second shot and say that the head is not the primary point of contact. Trouba's shoulder is deeply compressed, showing it made contact before any other part of his body, and the point of the shoulder is directly in the middle of Jarvis's head. Any contact he's making to the shoulder and chest is follow through, and significantly less forceful. You see in the first image just how far out ahead his shoulder is from the rest of his body, and in the second shot you can see how that shoulder hit nothing but Jarvis's head. It's a direct headshot that should have resulted in a major suspension.

 

[AhosDatsyukian]

aside from Tourba I'm still pissed about losing to the f***ing rags. what a lousy letdown of a season, the rags aren't even remotely good just lucky. oh well next year ain't too far off and we weren't beating Colorado anyways

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

I don't understand how anyone can possibly look at that second shot and say that the head is not the primary point of contact. Trouba's shoulder is deeply compressed, showing it made contact before any other part of his body, and the point of the shoulder is directly in the middle of Jarvis's head. Any contact he's making to the shoulder and chest is follow through, and significantly less forceful. You see in the first image just how far out ahead his shoulder is from the rest of his body, and in the second shot you can see how that shoulder hit nothing but Jarvis's head. It's a direct headshot that should have resulted in a major suspension.

Let’s just say we disagree and leave it at that.

 

[Canes]

I hated the hit when it happened and still hate Trouba regardless but as @Boom Boom Apathy shows this was a clean hit that was unfortunately mostly a result of height differences. If Jarvis is a similar size as Trouba, it would have been shoulder to shoulder textbook hit and more clearly a clean hit. But as always I eventually get more pissed at the lack of response from our players every. single. time. Just like I get mad that posters on here don't agree to a duel in a Bojangles parking lot to settle differences.

 

[Stickpucker]

I pretty much agree with everything you wrote with the exception of the bold, if you are referring to the Jarvis hit. Go back and look at the link I posted above with still frames a fraction of a second before the hit and at moment of impact.

EDIT: For convenience, I posted them here instead:

A second before the hit: Elbow tucked

The moment of the hit, elbow tucked and both skates on the ice.

There is head contact, but by the NHL rulebook, it's not an illegal check to the head. The rule states that 1) The head has to be the main point of contact. That's not the case here as he's hitting his shoulder/chest simultaneously. 2) Contact with the head was avoidable. By avoidable the rule says "whether the player attempted to hit squarely through the opponent's body and the head was not "picked" as a result of poor timing, poor angle of approach or unnecessary extension of the body upward or outward". I don't see him "picking" the head here.

So IMO, by the NHL rulebook, this is not an illegal hit.

That's not to say that Trouba's Elbow hasn't come flying up on other hits (or even misses like in the TB series). I even made a joke about him leading with his elbow in the thread about his captaincy. I'm only referring to this specific hit on Jarvis. I do think it falls into the "predatory" category like AA said above.

Anyhow, that's water under the bridge now and deviating from my initial post before the Trouba discussion. Like when Aho got a concussion from Giordano early on in his career, hopefully Jarvis learned a lesson and yet will still be willing to go to the dirty areas like he has been. If he continues to play the way he did, I expect big things from him this yeaLPS?

Looking at your pictures I don't see the puck anywhere on screen?

It's been a bit but I don't recall Trouba hitting Jarvis on screen during live because the puck was so far from where it happened.

If I recall we lost track of where he was and why we were called for too many men until another camera showed him crawling to the bench and then another camera showed the hit.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Looking at your pictures I don't see the puck anywhere on screen?

It's been a bit but I don't recall Trouba hitting Jarvis on screen during live because the puck was so far from where it happened.

If I recall we lost track of where he was and why we were called for too many men until another camera showed him crawling to the bench and then another camera showed the hit.

These still photos are better for the puck position.

Picture one is when Jarvis just releases the puck at 1s of the clip.
Picture two is when contact occurs at 2s of the clip and you can see where the puck is at the time after Jarvis has passed it. So essentially 1s elapsed between Jarvis releasing the puck and getting hit.

Does 1s of time (or maybe 1.5s of time) when playing at full speed constitute hitting a player without the puck and an interference penalty? I don't know. Maybe by the strict letter of the law, but the NHL always allows some amount of time in that scenario. Against us, often guys dump the puck into our zone and a second or 2 later, one of our defensemen slightly impedes his progress into the zone even though the puck was released. I see many hits in the NHL a second after the puck is released never called. I guess there is some judgement the refs use.

Anyhow, I only posted these because you asked where the puck was and I wanted to show it, not to try to convince or persuade anyone into one position or another as that debated is beaten to death.

 

[Stickpucker]

These still photos are better for the puck position.

Picture one is when Jarvis just releases the puck at 1s of the clip.
Picture two is when contact occurs at 2s of the clip and you can see where the puck is at the time after Jarvis has passed it. So essentially 1s elapsed between Jarvis releasing the puck and getting hit.

Does 1s of time (or maybe 1.5s of time) when playing at full speed constitute hitting a player without the puck and an interference penalty? I don't know. Maybe by the strict letter of the law, but the NHL always allows some amount of time in that scenario. Against us, often guys dump the puck into our zone and a second or 2 later, one of our defensemen slightly impedes his progress into the zone even though the puck was released. I see many hits in the NHL a second after the puck is released never called. I guess there is some judgement the refs use.

Anyhow, I only posted these because you asked where the puck was and I wanted to show it, not to try to convince or persuade anyone into one position or another as that debated is beaten to death.

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Understood and I appreciate how thorough you are trying to share the facts of what happened.

I think for me there are a couple things:
1. Someone on the Rongos posted before the earlier game how they were going out there to hurt people and tried to get Domi. They were clearly being predatory. I don't say that as a moral statement just the style they wanted to play.
2. Hockey is a physical game and we're between old and new school. Rod has said how he wants to keep play between the whistles. It's a little funny to me because he wasn't the most physical player in his era but he did whip some ass.
3. I think you need to do what works in the NHL. I don't think you need to go NO saints and put bounties on people but I think you need to play with an edge....which Carolina did vs Boston but fell off vs NYR. In my mind NYR won our series and the Pitts series heavily through toughness...mental and physical as well as the pp.

I'm saying I wish HCRBA was a bit more realistic and told the boys to go win on the scoreboard and after the whistles. I don't want someone out there getting suspended repeatedly on our team but I want people who play closer to the line as it is at least a part of winning in the NHL still. I don't like Rod coaching that out of our players.

 

[Aurinko]

Max was skating and in the interview said he is 100% (before the injury ofc).

Good shot to fix pp in the playoffs, but other than that not a player I like. Considering how slow of a player he is, I would say that the injury is a blessing in disguise, since he won't be eating away minutes from younger players that are ready to work for it. I would argue that younger players are NOT too happy when an older player with fat contract just floats around and takes their pp time.

 

[WreckingCrew]

Max was skating and in the interview said he is 100% (before the injury ofc).

Good shot to fix pp in the playoffs, but other than that not a player I like. Considering how slow of a player he is, I would say that the injury is a blessing in disguise, since he won't be eating away minutes from younger players that are ready to work for it. I would argue that younger players are NOT too happy when an older player with fat contract just floats around and takes their pp time.

Literally our whole team on the PP the last 1/3 of the season + playoffs...didn't matter age or contract, they were all doing it

 

[raynman]

Max was skating and in the interview said he is 100% (before the injury ofc).

Good shot to fix pp in the playoffs, but other than that not a player I like. Considering how slow of a player he is, I would say that the injury is a blessing in disguise, since he won't be eating away minutes from younger players that are ready to work for it. I would argue that younger players are NOT too happy when an older player with fat contract just floats around and takes their pp time.

For a slow floater he certainly seems to produce points at a decent rate.

 

[LakeLivin]

Max was skating and in the interview said he is 100% (before the injury ofc).

Good shot to fix pp in the playoffs, but other than that not a player I like. Considering how slow of a player he is, I would say that the injury is a blessing in disguise, since he won't be eating away minutes from younger players that are ready to work for it. I would argue that younger players are NOT too happy when an older player with fat contract just floats around and takes their pp time.

I don't think that's all that big a risk given that Brind'Amour is the coach and he's established a team culture that's contradictory to that.

 

[Aurinko]

I don't think that's all that big a risk given that Brind'Amour is the coach and he's established a team culture that's contradictory to that.

Remains to be seen, but with Max's speed there are limits on how useful he can be outside pp.

 

[Svechhammer]

Remains to be seen, but with Max's speed there are limits on how useful he can be outside pp.

Not bad for a guy who has been a point per game player since the beginning of the 2019 season

158 games, 154 points

 

[Lempo]

Remains to be seen, but with Max's speed there are limits on how useful he can be outside pp.

Max speed is not enough?

 

[Chrispy]

Max speed is not enough?

Well, you see Jordan goes up to 11.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Well, you see Jordan goes up to 11.

It just takes him the full length of the rink to get there.

 

[raynman]

That gronk speed just hits different

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

We talked about Jarvis taking a step forward this year. I read somewhat obscure fact from Cory today.

Since the 2010-11 season, only two rookies have played fewer minutes and put up more points than Jarvis’ 40 points in 943:30 minutes last season — Connor McDavid (48 points in 849:42 minutes in 2015-16) and Jason Robertson (45 points in 861:13 minutes in 2020-21). McDavid followed his rookie season with 100 points, and Robertson exploded for 41 goals and 79 points last year.

 

[Anton Dubinchuk]

We talked about Jarvis taking a step forward this year. I read somewhat obscure fact from Cory today.

Since the 2010-11 season, only two rookies have played fewer minutes and put up more points than Jarvis’ 40 points in 943:30 minutes last season — Connor McDavid (48 points in 849:42 minutes in 2015-16) and Jason Robertson (45 points in 861:13 minutes in 2020-21). McDavid followed his rookie season with 100 points, and Robertson exploded for 41 goals and 79 points last year.

Out of the two, I’m guessing Jarvis is going to track closer to a Connor McDavid type.

 

[Stickpucker]

You heard it here first! BBA said ol' man Jarvis going to have a 110 pt sophomore season!!

 

[Wolfpuck]

You heard it here first! BBA said ol' man Jarvis going to have a 110 pt sophomore season!!

Are you suggesting otherwise my good man?

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

You heard it here first! Ol’ man BBA said ol' manJarvis going to have a 110 pt sophomore season!!

Fixed it for you.

 

[raynman]

We talked about Jarvis taking a step forward this year. I read somewhat obscure fact from Cory today.

Since the 2010-11 season, only two rookies have played fewer minutes and put up more points than Jarvis’ 40 points in 943:30 minutes last season — Connor McDavid (48 points in 849:42 minutes in 2015-16) and Jason Robertson (45 points in 861:13 minutes in 2020-21). McDavid followed his rookie season with 100 points, and Robertson exploded for 41 goals and 79 points last year.

Between Jarvis and Morrow we are certainly blessed as fans of the Carolina Hurricanes.