Ovechkin milestone thread - 850 and Beyond!

[Nsjohnson]

Professional hockey is professional hockey. The goalpost is right where I left it.

Why don't you create a separate thread for 'professional hockey records'.

This thread seems mostly concerned with his NHL records, and for good reason.

 

[Nsjohnson]

The stats don't reveal this at all though.

Alex Ovechkin Stats, Height, Weight, Position, Salary, Title | Hockey-Reference.com

Checkout the latest stats of Alex Ovechkin. Get info about his position, age, height, weight, trade, draft, salary and more on Hockey-Reference.com

www.hockey-reference.com

but maybe he was hitting guys more softly than MJ remembers?

It extremely obvious that Ovi had his 3 year peak from 08-10 then it's been a mixed bag since then.

*mixed bag for Ovechkin

*not for an NHL player

*his peak started with his first season, 2005-10. Five years.

*since then, he's the best goals scorer STILL on average year to year, up until recently.

 

[KoozNetsOff 92]

*mixed bag for Ovechkin

*not for an NHL player

*his peak started with his first season, 2005-10. Five years.

*since then, he's the best goals scorer STILL on average year to year, up until recently.

There is no point responding to that poster when it comes to OV. Don't waste your time.

 

[Sentinel]

Why don't you create a separate thread for 'professional hockey records'.

This thread seems mostly concerned with his NHL records, and for good reason.

"Mostly." Not "exclusively." There is nothing in the title that excludes his (or other players') other records.

The only reason is that NHL did not and does not want to validate competition. Doesn't mean we should kowtow to it.

 

[Alexander the Gr8]

Who cares about other leagues? The WHA existed for all of 7 years, 50 years ago. No other professional hockey league has come close to competing against the NHL. Everything else is irrelevant.

 

[Sentinel]

Who cares about other leagues? The WHA existed for all of 7 years, 50 years ago. No other professional hockey league has come close to competing against the NHL. Everything else is irrelevant.

Because Gordie Howe scored 202 goals there and Gretzky scored 56 goals there.

Just because you (and NHL) don't care for them, doesn't mean they shouldn't be counted.

 

[Alexander the Gr8]

Because Gordie Howe scored 202 goals there and Gretzky scored 56 goals there.

Just because you (and NHL) don't care for them, doesn't mean they shouldn't be counted.

No, seems more like grasping at straws to invalidate what Ovechkin is doing here.

Are we going to go through the entire record book to see which records would change if we included WHA stats?

 

[CupInSIX]

Because Gordie Howe scored 202 goals there and Gretzky scored 56 goals there.

Just because you (and NHL) don't care for them, doesn't mean they shouldn't be counted.

There's an alternate universe where Howe stayed in the NHL and kept playing until he reached 900 goals, left the bench and immediately retired.

Gretzky realized he was getting close to breaking Howe's 900 goals and played another year with the Rangers until he (reluctantly, because he's a nice Canadian boy that didn't want to beat his idol) hit 901.

So Ovechkin is trying to chase Gretz's 901 goals.

 

[Sentinel]

No, seems more like grasping at straws to invalidate what Ovechkin is doing here.

Are we going to go through the entire record book to see which records would change if we included WHA stats?

Paranoid much? How is that invalidating ANYTHING?

Yes, we should do that. That's why (for the nth time), Gretzky stayed in NHL until he beat Howe's TOTAL GOAL SCORING RECORD. Ovechkin can be held to the same standard.

I am perfectly fine with including 57 goals that Ovechkin scored for Dynamo in the KHL.

There's an alternate universe where Howe stayed in the NHL and kept playing until he reached 900 goals, left the bench and immediately retired.

Gretzky realized he was getting close to breaking Howe's 900 goals and played another year with the Rangers until he (reluctantly, because he's a nice Canadian boy that didn't want to beat his idol) hit 901.

So Ovechkin is trying to chase Gretz's 901 goals.

Precisely. Except even in our universe, Gretzky scored 1072 goals (NHL + WHA, including playoffs) and Howe scored, I believe, 1071.

 

[kaiser matias]

Paranoid much? How is that invalidating ANYTHING?

Yes, we should do that. That's why (for the nth time), Gretzky stayed in NHL until he beat Howe's TOTAL GOAL SCORING RECORD. Ovechkin can be held to the same standard.

I am perfectly fine with including 57 goals that Ovechkin scored for Dynamo in the KHL.


Precisely. Except even in our universe, Gretzky scored 1072 goals (NHL + WHA, including playoffs) and Howe scored, I believe 1071.

Do you have anything to prove this is the specific reason Gretzky played until he did, and didn't retire because at 38 he was notably declining, and it being a very normal age for players to retire at, and not just a fortunate coincidence that he managed to score goal 1072?

 

[Sentinel]

Do you have anything to prove this is the specific reason Gretzky played until he did, and didn't retire because at 38 he was notably declining, and it being a very normal age for players to retire at, and not just a fortunate coincidence that he managed to score goal 1072?

That's one hell of a coincidence: to retire exactly after beating Howe's total number of goals and not a season earlier. He was still #4 in the league in points that season btw.

 

[CupInSIX]

Paranoid much? How is that invalidating ANYTHING?

Yes, we should do that. That's why (for the nth time), Gretzky stayed in NHL until he beat Howe's TOTAL GOAL SCORING RECORD. Ovechkin can be held to the same standard.

I am perfectly fine with including 57 goals that Ovechkin scored for Dynamo in the KHL.


Precisely. Except even in our universe, Gretzky scored 1072 goals (NHL + WHA, including playoffs) and Howe scored, I believe, 1071.

Interesting. This is the 1st time I've ever heard this. Makes sense though.

edit: wait wasn't Wayne 17 in the WHA? Oh, Gretz, you cheater.

 

[M2Beezy]

My goodness the strange distraction arguments in this thread to try and minimize Ovechkins goal scoring superiority. To help clarify for those still confused: he is on pace to be the greatest goal scorer in NHL history. The NHL being the best hockey league in the world..

 

[norrisnick]

That's one hell of a coincidence: to retire exactly after beating Howe's total number of goals and not a season earlier. He was still #4 in the league in points that season btw.

He was 33rd.

 

[kaiser matias]

That's one hell of a coincidence: to retire exactly after beating Howe's total number of goals and not a season earlier. He was still #4 in the league in points that season btw.

So no proof then?

And as noted, he was tied for 33rd in 1998-99; it was 1997-98 that he was t-3rd in scoring with 90.

 

[Alexander the Gr8]

Paranoid much? How is that invalidating ANYTHING?

Yes, we should do that. That's why (for the nth time), Gretzky stayed in NHL until he beat Howe's TOTAL GOAL SCORING RECORD. Ovechkin can be held to the same standard.

I am perfectly fine with including 57 goals that Ovechkin scored for Dynamo in the KHL.

Paranoid? No, I would be fine even if Ovi retired tomorrow, he’s exceeded all my expectations.

Gretzky’s goal totals being higher by 1 including WHA stats seems more like a coincidence than anything. His goal scoring tapered off a lot in the 2nd half of his career, and he was far ahead of Howe in points.

He didn’t have the same kind of celebration for his final NHL goal as he did when he scored 802. They literally paused the game and had a ceremony for it. This was the mark to beat, not 1071 or whatever it is.

 

[CupInSIX]

So no proof then?

And as noted, he was tied for 33rd in 1998-99; it was 1997-98 that he was t-3rd in scoring with 90.

Apparently he's right. MSG put it up on the scoreboard and everything.

 

[M2Beezy]

 

[kaiser matias]

Apparently he's right. MSG put it up on the scoreboard and everything.

The goal setting the record is well-known, and was indeed the last one Gretzky scored. But the question is did Gretzky specifically say he was retiring now that he had this "record" (in quotations because I don't believe it had ever come up until Gretzky passed it).

 

[M2Beezy]

Paranoid? No, I would be fine even if Ovi retired tomorrow, he’s exceeded all my expectations.

Gretzky’s goal totals being higher by 1 including WHA stats seems more like a coincidence than anything. His goal scoring tapered off a lot in the 2nd half of his career, and he was far ahead of Howe in points.

He didn’t have the same kind of celebration for his final NHL goal as he did when he scored 802. They literally paused the game and had a ceremony for it. This was the mark to beat, not 1071 or whatever it is.

I think you just officially owned that guy

 

[Demandedace]

This is a record that may never be broken

 

[TJHKY]

 

[M2Beezy]

On a pace to score 44 goals so far this year...

 

[TJHKY]

 

[Kalv]

Natural habitat of a Coyote is in Ovis highlight reel