McKenzie: Oilers in on Barrie? (Part II)

[EscapedGoat]

Can you prove that the bolded is true or speculation? Just like the comment about Frei saying Roy said Barrie is a #5 D. We will never know the truth.......

oh for the love of god. As has been said multiple times in this thread (did you bother even to read the previous page?) Frei NEVER said he thinks Roy sees Barrie as a number 5. Never. Roy was never mentioned. At all. Ever. Get it? Frei said that FREI sees Barrie as a number 5. One more time, FREI sees Barrie as a number 5. Not "I think Roy sees Barrie as a 5" or "I heard that Roy sees Barrie as a 5". Is this sinking it?

You can comprehend it any way you like. What I'm saying is that because anyone stating either side is fact has no relation to those involved there is no definite answer. I find it hard to believe that Frei would just come out of the woodwork and randomly make up ********. At the same time it's possible that he phrased it differently or has taken what was said out of context. Who really knows? For the record Canadian media isn't nearly has bad as the US. Normally when content is picked up from the US there is more basis then what a blogger typed.

If you guys want to talk in absolutes like you were there when the discussion took place then there isn't much more to discuss here.

Ughhhh. You are still not getting this. As I said to the guy above, FREI said FREI sees Barrie as a number 5. There's no speculation. Frei made nothing up. Nothing was taken out of context. Frei posted a blog where he said HE sees Barrie as a number 5. You can spin this any way you want, but you're failing. You talk about speaking in absolutes like this isn't an absolute. It IS an absolute. Frei ABSOLUTELY posted a blog where he stated he sees Barrie as a 5. Frei ABSOLUTELY at no point mentioned Roys name and he ABSOLUTELY did not say that Roy sees Barrie as a 5. There's no discussion to be had, there's no "out of context" and there's no "making stuff up".

I'm really struggling to word this simpler. IF Frei had said "I think Roy sees Barrie as a number 5", then there would be a discussion and you would have a leg to stand on. But this wasn't said. A writer gave his opinion of a player and you are attributing that opinion to the coach of the team. It's simply not right or fair.

 

[NOTENOUGHJTCGOALS]

Reminds me of when Canadian media member Kelly Hrudey said RNH is a third liner or maybe second.

That's something he clearly made up on his own and he in no way has any sources like former teammates or others close to the Oilers.

At this point the guy is more American media than Canadian anyways.

The old saying where there is smoke there is fire. I think the majority of people in the know (not people on a message board) can see Barrie is an offensive specialist. Calling him a #5 was probably an exaggeration but he's not the type you give top pairing minutes to. That's why a trade hasn't happened. Sakic is going to take this kid to the cleaners in arbitration.

The Aves employ a legitimate card carrying accountant as their assistant GM. Barrie on the other hand probably doesn't even own a calculator.

 

[Homesick]

Reminds me of when Canadian media member Kelly Hrudey said RNH is a third liner or maybe second.

That's something he clearly made up on his own and he in no way has any sources like former teammates or others close to the Oilers.

At this point the guy is more American media than Canadian anyways.

The old saying where there is smoke there is fire. I think the majority of people in the know (not people on a message board) can see Barrie is an offensive specialist. Calling him a #5 was probably an exaggeration but he's not the type you give top pairing minutes to. That's why a trade hasn't happened. Sakic is going to take this kid to the cleaners in arbitration.

The Aves employ a legitimate card carrying accountant as their assistant GM. Barrie on the other hand probably doesn't even own a calculator.

Kelly Hrudey hates the Oilers ever since he was a back up in 83. The Oilers have made him look bad in his career so it's I guess natural that he hates them

 

[Limekiller]

Reminds me of when Canadian media member Kelly Hrudey said RNH is a third liner or maybe second.

That's something he clearly made up on his own and he in no way has any sources like former teammates or others close to the Oilers.

At this point the guy is more American media than Canadian anyways.

The old saying where there is smoke there is fire. I think the majority of people in the know (not people on a message board) can see Barrie is an offensive specialist. Calling him a #5 was probably an exaggeration but he's not the type you give top pairing minutes to. That's why a trade hasn't happened. Sakic is going to take this kid to the cleaners in arbitration.

The Aves employ a legitimate card carrying accountant as their assistant GM. Barrie on the other hand probably doesn't even own a calculator.

Well, is it exactly a brilliant strategy to be as hard-assed as possible when negotiating with your young players that are currently RFAs? If you make them mad enough by "taking him to the cleaners", why would they want to stay in the organization once they have the chance to leave? There is a definite monetary benefit involved with keeping their players happy to be there, and building up loyalty to the team. That way they STAY there, rather than bolting the instant they become a UFA, and will often even give a home town discount to do so.

Yeah, if Sakic wants to play hardball now and "take him to the cleaners", he might get Barrie signed for a little cheaper. But Sakic and the team might well regret doing so a couple years down the road if he splits town for nothing because of resentment of how he was treated in these negotiations.

 

[Avenger*]

oh for the love of god. As has been said multiple times in this thread (did you bother even to read the previous page?) Frei NEVER said he thinks Roy sees Barrie as a number 5. Never. Roy was never mentioned. At all. Ever. Get it? Frei said that FREI sees Barrie as a number 5. One more time, FREI sees Barrie as a number 5. Not "I think Roy sees Barrie as a 5" or "I heard that Roy sees Barrie as a 5". Is this sinking it?




Ughhhh. You are still not getting this. As I said to the guy above, FREI said FREI sees Barrie as a number 5. There's no speculation. Frei made nothing up. Nothing was taken out of context. Frei posted a blog where he said HE sees Barrie as a number 5. You can spin this any way you want, but you're failing. You talk about speaking in absolutes like this isn't an absolute. It IS an absolute. Frei ABSOLUTELY posted a blog where he stated he sees Barrie as a 5. Frei ABSOLUTELY at no point mentioned Roys name and he ABSOLUTELY did not say that Roy sees Barrie as a 5. There's no discussion to be had, there's no "out of context" and there's no "making stuff up".

I'm really struggling to word this simpler. IF Frei had said "I think Roy sees Barrie as a number 5", then there would be a discussion and you would have a leg to stand on. But this wasn't said. A writer gave his opinion of a player and you are attributing that opinion to the coach of the team. It's simply not right or fair.

Explain to me how it went from Frei's personal opinion to it being quoted as something that Roy said himself?

 

[Don Corleone]

C'mon only a fool would even consider that any member of the Avs staff or any sane person thinks that Barrie is a number 5 D.

 

[JonSnow]

Did someone say fries?

Mmmmmmmmmmmmmm...........

Fries!

Barrie is a PP QB and a #2-3 dman

 

[Don Corleone]

Barrie sure seems like he would be money on the pp but he is just decent.

2013-14 38 points 10 on the pp
2014-15 53 points 16 on the pp
2015-16 49 points 21 on the pp

 

[zar]

Barrie sure seems like he would be money on the pp but he is just decent.

2013-14 38 points 10 on the pp
2014-15 53 points 16 on the pp
2015-16 49 points 21 on the pp

All of the Oiler's D combined
2013-14 111 points 26 on the pp
2014-15 111 points 22 on the pp
2015-16 102 points 26 on the pp


Anyways, I can't believe that some people are saying Barrie could be a #5 D, regardless or who says it.

If you average his last 3 seasons and pro-rate, projecting into an 82 game season
82 GP
14G + 38A = 52 P (17 PP P)
TOI = 19:33 ES + :30 SH + 3:07 PP = 23:11 TOI/GP

Last year he ranked 29th in the NHL for TOI, 31st for giveaways and 39th of takeaways. So his giveaways (GA) and takeaways (TA) were average for his TOI... comparables for GA/TA were Hjarlmsson, Trouba, McDonaugh, Ekholm, Kulikov.

He is not physical.

I would say he is above average offensively and average defensively... he is a top half #3 at worst, maybe even a low end #2. For the record I count someone as a #2 if I see him as a Top 60 overall Dman in the NHL and a #3 Dman if I see him as a Top 90 overall Dman in the NHL. He wouldn't play on most team's first pairing but he would play on almost every team's second pairing, barring some deep D teams on the right side.

That is why I say his value from the Oilers is RNH + Davidson (or Reinhart)... very slight over payment but we can't protect everyone in the Expansion draft anyways.

 

[Don Corleone]

Oh wow that is so bad I feel for you Edmonton fans.

 

[cgf]

Kelly Hrudey hates the Oilers ever since he was a back up in 83. The Oilers have made him look bad in his career so it's I guess natural that he hates them

This is sounding like a 'he said, she said' situation.

Nobody's giving up a top 3 dman for a middle-6 tweener.

Explain to me how it went from Frei's personal opinion to it being quoted as something that Roy said himself?

Cause you are stubbornly trying to remain ignorant on this subject?

 

[tempest2i]

This is sounding like a 'he said, she said' situation.

Nobody's giving up a top 3 dman for a middle-6 tweener.

Calling him a middle-6 tweener shows your ignorance on the topic.

 

[Lonewolfe2015]

Can you prove that the bolded is true or speculation? Just like the comment about Frei saying Roy said Barrie is a #5 D. We will never know the truth.......

Im glad you feel this way. KEEP HIM

I don't have the time to find 2+ year old quotes from the guy. But around the time of signing his last deal it came to light that he took a bridge contract because he knew he would prove he was worth more money than the long term contracts the Avs were offering.

Barrie has always had a high level of self confidence and wants to be paid a value relative to how he perceives his play. Since he's pretty darn good it's understandable, I also think that kind of attitude has served him well in becoming as good as he is.

I still peg his ideal worth in the 5.5mil territory, but 6-6.5mil long term wouldn't hurt and would be the cost of doing business.

 

[cgf]

Calling him a middle-6 tweener shows your ignorance on the topic.

 

[tempest2i]

So... you were intentionally flaming Oilers fans by calling him a middle-6 tweener?

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

I guess that's where we're different. I don't take government policy as definitve of anything since lies, corruption and money fuel policies.

So, you don't believe one of the tenets of our judicial system because lies and money fuel policy, but you take a hack journalist's opinion as evidence that Roy might have said something? Because no journalist has ever made things up to try to drive traffic to his site to increase revenue, right?

 

[JLo217]

So... you were intentionally flaming Oilers fans by calling him a middle-6 tweener?

Welcome to every Avs trade proposal or rumor post on HF.

Leafs fans used to do it with Staz. Buff fans did it with ROR. Oilers fans are doing the same with Barrie in terms of value.

Avalanche fans just have a certain level of sarcasm at this point about the whole scenario... and sometimes it might appear to be trolling... but its hard not to at this point.

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

In Chicago or Nashville, yes. Depends how deep the d-core is obviously. Most teams he's a 2/3.

But apparently every d-man is now worth their weight in gold since a single one off deal where Edmonton moved One player and brought in three took place.

And, in Chicago or Nashville, Barrie is also a 4D. Most teams, he's a 2/3. But, apparently, he's really just a 5D because one hack journalist expressed his opinion.

And, apparently every player in Colorado now hates the organization and is trying to get traded because of a one off situation where the previous front office tried to play hardball with a stubborn/proud RFA and it led to that player getting traded several years later.

And, apparently the Avs front office is cheap and unwilling to pay anyone, because they refused to give ROR $8m a year and decided to trade him for a good package of futures.

We're also apparently assuming that every RFA who elected for arbitration is going to actually have a hearing, even though 22 of 23 arbitration filings last year never actually reached a hearing.

 

[JLo217]

And, in Chicago or Nashville, Barrie is also a 4D. Most teams, he's a 2/3. But, apparently, he's really just a 5D because one hack journalist expressed his opinion.

And, apparently every player in Colorado now hates the organization and is trying to get traded because of a one off situation where the previous front office tried to play hardball with a stubborn/proud RFA and it led to that player getting traded several years later.

And, apparently the Avs front office is cheap and unwilling to pay anyone, because they refused to give ROR $8m a year and decided to trade him for a good package of futures.

We're also apparently assuming that every RFA who elected for arbitration is going to actually have a hearing, even though 22 of 23 arbitration filings last year never actually reached a hearing.

Oilers fans though. And Stauffer is never wrong.

 

[rosemount289]

The problem with ..........???

Oilers fans though. And Stauffer is never wrong.

The problem with Stauffer is that he throws out a hundred names and like spaghetti....one is bound to stick.

Plus his memory is like a one way street.........he only remembers when he is right and never remembers when he is wrong.

 

[Avs44]

So... you were intentionally flaming Oilers fans by calling him a middle-6 tweener?

Following that logic a solid third or so of your fanbase is guilty of flaming Avs fans by calling Barrie a #5, powerplay specialist defensman.

 

[Draiskull]

Following that logic a solid third or so of your fanbase is guilty of flaming Avs fans by calling Barrie a #5, powerplay specialist defensman.

pretty sure there are more than 9 Oilers fans here.
Show me more than 3 posters that claimed Barrie to be a #5 or declare yourself a BSer.

 

[tempest2i]

Following that logic a solid third or so of your fanbase is guilty of flaming Avs fans by calling Barrie a #5, powerplay specialist defensman.

Call them out for it. Report them. Ignore them. Don't stoop to the level of the lowest users around here. All that does it create flaming train wrecks like this thread.

I don't really give a **** whether or not Roy has privately called Barrie a #5 Dman. I really don't. But that's completely dominated this thread because there's a few users around here that can't drop it.

I'm more interested in whether this gets to arbitration or if Godfather McKenzie is correct when he thinks Barrie will get traded.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

Still no date set for arbitration?

 

[pockets]

Still no date set for arbitration?

July 29th