Off-season thread

[Satan]

how do we convince Phoenix to trade us Victor Soderstrom

 

[Troy McClure]

how do we convince Phoenix to trade us Victor Soderstrom

Gaglardi could offer to finance a new arena for them.

 

[Smelling Salt]

Hellebuyck is probably going for almost nothing soon. Get him out of the division already, please.

Chevy will sit on Helly for as long as he can. He is a major sloth when it comes to trades. Took him four years to trade Kane when Kane asked for a trade every season haha. Though a Helly trade is a pretty serious organizational move to be fair so he's gonna maximize the offer...but he only has up to the trade deadline to do it.

 

[piqued]

Had to double check that my Denis Gurianov news alert was set up correctly.

 

[Johno]

Nils has to play games this year. He's waivers eligible now so he'll be eating hotdogs if he's not in the lineup

Maybe he should. Dude needs some mass.
Besides it’s working out well for three time champ Phil the Thrill

 

[BG44]

I wasn't including Bay on the roster, and with him off arent we sitting around 1.3ish? Maybe I'm wrong on that number

I'm assuming Dellandrea signs somewhere between 1.5-2, and Jim Nill likes his wiggle room

Unless we only carry 12 forwards and 6 D, what am I missing here?

You're the cap doctor and know alot more then I do with this stuff lol

Dellandrea hasn't done anything to earn between $1.5 and $2. He's going to come in between $775 and $1 million, and my guess is it's on a 1 year deal. If they go 2 years then it probably does go over $1 million.

That will still give them about as much cap space as they operated with last year. I think it's a mistake. They were dangerously on the edge of playing games down men early last year, and that same thing could/would likely actually happen given they're due for some injuries.

That's the way they operate though. They don't bank $1 million plus going into a year.

Should they move out some cap space? Yes. Do they need to? No. Nill doesn't back himself into a corner where a contract is going to force him to make a trade. He's too meticulous. Dallas plans well for RFAs always. Janko the cap guru is excellent at his job when it comes to contracts.

It's a double-edged sword. If you aren't willing to be a little dangerous with the cap, you're not getting Duchene. In my perfect world, they'd have at least the league minimum contract in cap space, but they (like a lot of teams to be fair) live on the edge of the cap. It's why every year you have teams playing with less than 18 skaters at some point.

 

[FirstRowUpperDeck]

I think they think Delly deserves at least $1.4 Mil. Signing a contract for the same or lesser value as your entry level pay is a slap shot in the face and Nill doesn't do that to players he wants to keep around, and I think they like his "character." Plus, he wasn't as bad as some here say, but we always find a lower line scapegoat around here. Maybe they do see him as good trade bait, and that is why he isn't signed.

Dellandrea signed a 3 year, $4,387,500 contract with Dallas in 2018. The contract has a cap hit of $863,333, a base salary of $832,500, and an AAV of about $1.4Mil already when including his $537,500 performance bonus, which he has earned all three years. For what, I don't know.

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[BG44]

Dellandrea's ELC wasn't a $1.4 million contract. It had A bonuses he didn't even earn. That's normal. Dellandrea only made $832,500 last year. I don't expect him to make less than that. It's just easy to say league minimum as the floor.

But yeah ... A bonuses and B bonuses (He didn't have B bonuses ... technically I can't say that with certainty ... but I'm virtually certain. Teams rarely use them unless you're talking the upper echelon of the draft or top undrafted free agents) mean virtually nothing if you don't even earn them. It's not a slap in the face. His QO doesn't even factor them in.

He didn't earn a single performance bonus though. I can tell you that without any doubt whatsoever. A bonuses basically are scoring 20 plus goals, 50/60 points IIRC (I"m not going to look it up exactly), Top 6 in TOI, etc.

 

[BG44]

BTW ... B bonuses are league awards like the Conn Smythe or the Hart Trophy. That's why teams don't hand them out a ton and players don't tend to expect them.

You'll notice Wyatt doesn't even have A bonuses in his contract because of where he was drafted. Once you get out of the teens, you don't see too many players getting those A bonuses.

Another BTW ... Harley and Lundqvist both absolutely could earn some or all of their A bonuses this coming year. I think the goal threshold is only something like 10 and the points come down to 35 or 40. I don't think both will earn them, but one of them has a shot at 2nd PP duty, and that unit has a chance to put up some points.

 

[BG44]

There's 1 contract I hadn't seen yet that could push Dellandrea to $1.5 million (it'll have nothing to do with performance bonuses on an ELC) is Fabian Zetterlund. His deal averages $1.45.

Rafael Harvey-Pinard and Nils Hoglander were contracts I was thinking about as 2-year comps that come in at $1.1 each. Dellandrea would likely be slightly north of those guys if he gets multiple years.

2 years makes the most sense, but I get the feeling they go 1 year to keep the cost down. That's the only reason I'm saying in that league minimum to $1 million range. I think he's probably in that $1.2 million range if they go 2 years.

Joel Kiviranta is actually the best Dallas comparable and he was $1.05. Dallas would be on the hook for more and possibly pushing $2 had he played center this season, but thankfully he didn't.

 

[Ghost of Kyiv]

There's 1 contract I hadn't seen yet that could push Dellandrea to $1.5 million (it'll have nothing to do with performance bonuses on an ELC) is Fabian Zetterlund. His deal averages $1.45.

Rafael Harvey-Pinard and Nils Hoglander were contracts I was thinking about as 2-year comps that come in at $1.1 each. Dellandrea would likely be slightly north of those guys if he gets multiple years.

2 years makes the most sense, but I get the feeling they go 1 year to keep the cost down. That's the only reason I'm saying in that league minimum to $1 million range. I think he's probably in that $1.2 million range if they go 2 years.

Joel Kiviranta is actually the best Dallas comparable and he was $1.05. Dallas would be on the hook for more and possibly pushing $2 had he played center this season, but thankfully he didn't.

I really disagree here, Dellandrea has a lot of comparable in the $1.5 million and even above range.

Rasmussen
Zetterlund
Hagel
Luosterainen
Texier
Hayton
Lundstrom

Some of those guys have improved since signing their bridge deals but at the time of signing their production and usages were really close to Dellandea's

 

[eartotheground]

1) peak offseason is @BG44 dropping back to back cap posts for us
2) delly is SO underrated here. dude is a normal decent prospect. will carve out a solid nhl career. not every youngin is WJ. very few are.

 

[BG44]

I'm assuming no one is nearly as interested in A and B bonuses as I am, but I did go ahead and dig up the numbers.

MOST contracts have 4 A bonuses which means you have to hit 4 things from the list below to earn the full bonus. For example, if a guy scores 20 goals and picks up 40 assists, he's earned all his possible A bonuses as a forward because he reached on Goals, Assists, Points, and Points per game. Even if he also happens to be in the Top 6 in TOI ... he doesn't get an extra bonus.

You have leeway on A bonuses though. Even though the max is $212,500 per A bonus ($850K is the max overall), you don't have to offer the full amount just like Dallas did with Dellandrea.

With B bonuses ... like I said those are basically league awards and very rarely earned.

A bonuses are important this year because Dallas legitimately could have someone earn them, and they will definitely have a bonus overage already because of Pavelski.

Forwards

-20 goals

-35 assists

-60 points

-Top six in Time on Ice among forwards (in total and/or per game) on team (minimum 42 games)

-Top three in +/- among forwards on team (minimum 42 games)

-0.73 points per game (minimum 42 games)

-End-of Season All Rookie Team

-All Star Selection

-All Star MVP

Defensemen

-10 goals

-25 assists

-40 points

-Top four in Time on Ice among Defensemen (in total and/or per game) on team (minimum 42 games)

-Top three in +/- among defensemen on team (minimum 42 games)

-0.49 points per game (minimum 42 games)

-Top two among defensemen on team in blocked shocks

-End-of Season All Rookie Team

-All Star Selection

-All Star MVP

 

[BG44]

1) peak offseason is @BG44 dropping back to back cap posts for us
2) delly is SO underrated here. dude is a normal decent prospect. will carve out a solid nhl career. not every youngin is WJ. very few are.

Using his production as a winger to predict his contract value has nothing to do with valuing him as a player. I guarantee you Nill loves the player (I love what he brings in his role as well), but he's going to have Janko boil him down to his stats and use comparables. It's the way contracts in the NHL work. They're fairly predictable.

 

[BG44]

I really disagree here, Dellandrea has a lot of comparable in the $1.5 million and even above range.

Rasmussen
Zetterlund
Hagel
Luosterainen
Texier
Hayton
Lundstrom

Some of those guys have improved since signing their bridge deals but at the time of signing their production and usages were really close to Dellandea's

Rasmussen and Hagel are 3-year deals, and Lundestrom wasn't coming off his ELC.

The others can be decent comps, but like I said, I don't think he's probably getting 2 years. My gut/guess is they go 1 year and kick the can down the line when they have a bit more money to deal with.

I definitely was reacting more to the $2 million number though ... he's just not in that range.

 

[Zapp]

Rasmussen and Hagel are 3-year deals, and Lundestrom wasn't coming off his ELC.

The others can be decent comps, but like I said, I don't think he's probably getting 2 years. My gut/guess is they go 1 year and kick the can down the line when they have a bit more money to deal with.

I definitely was reacting more to the $2 million number though ... he's just not in that range.

Texier and Luostarinen are bad comps too because they’re both far more offensively gifted than Dellandrea. Not to mention Texier is an enigma right now. It was weird seeing stretches of him being definitively the best CBJ player on the ice, to disappearing and getting injured a lot. Then, because of covid, he didn’t get to see his family for a long time so decided to go back to Europe last season just to be closer to them. Who knows what he’s worth.

 

[Kcb12345]

 

[Ghost of Kyiv]

Texier and Luostarinen are bad comps too because they’re both far more offensively gifted than Dellandrea. Not to mention Texier is an enigma right now. It was weird seeing stretches of him being definitively the best CBJ player on the ice, to disappearing and getting injured a lot. Then, because of covid, he didn’t get to see his family for a long time so decided to go back to Europe last season just to be closer to them. Who knows what he’s worth.

They didn't really prove it at the time of signing though right. And that's what is important.

Texier - put up 15 points in 49 games the year before signing his deal. 13 points in 36 games the year before that.

Luostarinen - 26 points in 78 games the year before signing his deal (added 2 more in 10 playoff games. 8 more points in 44 games the year before that.

Just because the players had breakouts after signing the bridge deals, doesn't make deals not good comparables. You're really just buying a resume when it comes to RFA year, potential doesn't mean as much.

I'm sure Dallas will get Dellandea signed, I'm not worried about it. I just think it's fair to say Dellandrea has decent comps.

 

[Ghost of Kyiv]

I'm betting Dallas doesn't make any more significant moves and Dellandrea signs for a $1.25 million AAV on a 2 year deal just before camp opens. I think Dellandrea has good comparables but zero leverage, the extra year gives a bit of security even if it might lower his earning potential slightly.

 

[Zapp]

Marchment to Philly


U heard it here 1st boyz

 

[BG44]

I'm betting Dallas doesn't make any more significant moves and Dellandrea signs for a $1.25 million AAV on a 2 year deal just before camp opens. I think Dellandrea has good comparables but zero leverage, the extra year gives a bit of security even if it might lower his earning potential slightly.

If he signs for 2 years, that's a reasonable guess I'd say.

 

[eartotheground]

Marchment to Philly


U heard it here 1st boyz

makes sense from a culture perspective.

who's coming back?

 

[The Tourist]

That 2 goal game in the playoffs has changed how Dellandrea is viewed. The guy is still a 4th liner who was eating healthy scratches in the postseason.

I thought he got worse as the season went on. I agree with BG on the contract.

 

[eartotheground]

That 2 goal game in the playoffs has changed how Dellandrea is viewed. The guy is still a 4th liner who was eating healthy scratches in the postseason.

I thought he got worse as the season went on. I agree with BG on the contract.

for me at least, nah.
been watching him grow and flourish in the ahl*, now he's a baby in the bigs. i'm not arguing for a dollar amount one way or the other, i just think we greatly underestimate his value. he's a solid bottom 9 prospect. let him grow into it and be a cheap, quality player over the next few years.



*also he scored a hatty last baby stars game i was at, so i might be a tad biased.

 

[FirstRowUpperDeck]

He was always viewed as a Faksa replacement from day 1. He is still that. I think this contract will be over a Mil, and his next one will be similar to Faksa's now.....wort a bit less with inflation. JMHO