Confirmed Signing with Link: [NYR] G Igor Shesterkin signs extension with the Rangers (8 years, $11.5m AAV)

[WarriorofTime]

He’s a top 10 player making best player in the world type money++

Draisaitl signed for $2.5 million more and he isn't even the best player in the world...

 

[JaegerDice]

Right, so you'd let him walk. Which is a risk in and of itself as well.

I wouldn't let him walk. I'd trade him to a team willing to sign him, take back a goalie that could give me at least league average, and leverage any other assets gained plus the cap space to improve my team.

 

[SoundAndFury]

Draisaitl signed for $2.5 million more and he isn't even the best player in the world...

That argument is so bad... Like, Tavares got more in the UFA even all those years ago.

 

[Mike C]

He is still paid 2 mil less than Matthews and similar contracts in the 14 million range will come to Marner, Rantanen and such. So what are we talking about here?

We're talking about Connor McDavid circa 2026

 

[TheNumber4]

He is still paid 2 mil less than Matthews and similar contracts in the 14 million range will come to Marner, Rantanen and such. So what are we talking about here?

Well I’m sticking with the position to make a like comparison. He hasn’t hit top 10 GSAx this year or last. Helly has. And a bunch of random 2M-4M goalies. Shows you how volatile the position is and how much value there can be by finding a hot hand.

Draisaitl signed for $2.5 million more and he isn't even the best player in the world...

Stick the same position. Forwards and goalies can’t be compared.

 

[Bouboumaster]

lol, get f***ed Rangers!!

At least you were able to get rid of Troudouche, so it's not a complete disaster of a day

 

[WarriorofTime]

Scoring is literally higher than it's been since the early 90s, and your position is 'it's the guys that STOP goals that are more valuable!'

It means a GOOD, and GREAT goaltender are more valuable because you can't just hope for any ol' guy to be good enough unless your team is ELITE defensively. Your aforementioned Avs no longer have as good a defense as they did three years ago, and look at that, they're desperate for goaltending because they can't hide one now and it's really messing up their season despite the fact that they still have players like MacKinnon, Makar and Rantanen.

 

[dirtydanglez]

its a lot but he's among the best in the league

 

[1989]

The worst take in sports is that the goalie is the most important player on a team.

Ask the Colorado Avalanche and Vegas Golden Knights (and their fans or media) to rank their most important players, see how high up the list their goalies are.

Do the same for the Blackhawks or the Penguins.

The Red Wings before them.

I could go back to the 80s Oilers.

Ask the fans of those same teams how much they bitch about the average/sub-par goaltenders they have been getting now, and how often they feel like the team won in spite of the goaltending, both in regular and postseason.

Pittsburgh fans feel like Fleury didn't show up in the postseason enough. Avalanche have desperately been trying to trade for a solution. The Oilers likely would have a Cup or two in the McDavid era if they had competent goalies by now.

 

[Jersey Fresh]

Yeah. Shesterkin is the best goalie in the league. Similar cap % to Bob’s deal back in the day. He deserves every penny and if the Rangers didn’t want to pay him that, multiple other clubs would have moved things around to make it work.

Their problem is they just saved Trouba’s money and turned it around and handed it to Shesterkin. And it’s pretty much universally agreed that skater core is winning them nothing.

I agree they had to do it because he’s the only reason they’re competitive, but ultimately all they’ve achieved is the exact same lack of maneuverability to actually improve the team they had yesterday.

 

[Jared Dunn]

This feels very similar to Price and the Habs... bad contract right away, but literally what are you going to do?

 

[Tob]

The Rangers can sign him to 15 million a year contract with no move clause and there will be a California team that will bail them out when the time comes to put Igor out to pasture. The Kings are next.

they need to stop with bad players. A team of avg players n no bad cont. or piss players they can meybe sqeeze out a win in the po

 

[JaegerDice]

Ask the fans of those same teams how much they bitch about the average/sub-par goaltenders they have been getting now, and how often they feel like the team won in spite of the goaltending, both in regular and postseason.

....But it's bullshit. It's not like the goalie is the only thing that has changed since the Avs won the cup. Likewise for Vegas.

My argument is not 'hey, not only is goaltending overrated, but go ahead and disassemble other key pieces of your cup-winning teams'.

 

[Antropovsky]

I use kickers cause they're involved in so many of the points scored over the course of a season, but sure, running backs work too.

The point is, the gap between the absolute best goalie in the league and a league average goalie is not worth the gap in price.

I agree and disagree. I think the elite goalies can make a significant difference.

Montreal probably doesn't go to the finals in 2021 with anyone other than Price in net.

Some teams struggle for decades to even find average goaltending and suffer underachieving in the playoffs as a result. Vancouver teams with Cloutier, come to mind.

Leafs had 32-35 year old Cujo.
Then 37-39 year old Belfour
Then a bunch of crappy goalies between then and now...which is about 20 years of very sub par goaltending.

Those crappy goalies likely cost the Leafs decent playoff runs recently.

It's pretty exciting as a Leaf fan to have 26 year old Joseph Woll right now and looking like the 1st legit top level goalie.

 

[SoundAndFury]

Well I’m sticking with the position to make a like comparison. He hasn’t hit top 10 GSAx this year or last. Helly has. And a bunch of random 2M-4M goalies. Shows you how volatile the position is and how much value there can be by finding a hot hand.

Then we are back to the same argument. This is the Bobrovsky contract adjusted for rising cap. Same cap percentage, same age at expiration, etc. Bobrovsky also hasn't been an amazing goalie for Florida but are they happy to have him as opposed to some gamble on some other guy? Of course, they are because they had a chance to lock him up, they did, and now they have Stanley Cup rings plugging their ears.

It gives them stability in goal, stability in terms of long-term planning, etc. As opposed to all those teams scrambling for a goalie every few years. Your Colorados and Edmontons that would be consistent contenders otherwise.

 

[JaegerDice]

I agree and disagree. I think the elite goalies can make a significant difference.

Montreal probably doesn't go to the finals in 2021 with anyone other than Price in net.

Some teams struggle for decades to even find average goaltending and suffer underachieving in the playoffs as a result. Vancouver teams with Cloutier, come to mind.

Leafs had 32-35 year old Cujo.
Then 37-39 year old Belfour
Then a bunch of crappy goalies between then and now...which is about 20 years of very sub par goaltending.

Those crappy goalies likely cost the Leafs decent playoff runs recently.

It's pretty exciting as a Leaf fan to have 26 year old Joseph Woll right now and looking like the 1st legit top level goalie.

That 2021 Canadiens team doesn't go to the Finals in any year other than the COVID fake divisions year either. The Canadian division was trash.

I honestly don't think the Leafs goaltending has cost them in the playoffs lately, it's been their stars disappearing. The Leafs aren't built around goaltending, but they are imbalanced in their cap usage. They spend a lot of money on offensive players that don't perform in the playoffs.

I think Joseph Woll is a good young goalie that will find exactly as much success as the run support provided by several double-digit cap hit forwards provide for him.

It means a GOOD, and GREAT goaltender are more valuable because you can't just hope for any ol' guy to be good enough unless your team is ELITE defensively. Your aforementioned Avs no longer have as good a defense as they did three years ago, and look at that, they're desperate for goaltending because they can't hide one now and it's really messing up their season despite the fact that they still have players like MacKinnon, Makar and Rantanen.

Sooooo.... if I'm the Avalanche, why would I spend the cap I have on a goalie instead of trying to build up my defense?

 

[WarriorofTime]

Shows you how volatile the position is and how much value there can be by finding a hot hand.

Yeah, we know, that's what the Leafs and Oilers have been trying for years. Right now, it looks like the Leafs may have found a "hot hand", we'll see if it lasts. Stuart Skinner looked like a "hot hand" for a bit there too and now they're back to scrambling to hope that whomever they have come postseason is good enough. These "hot hands" come and go, while Shesterkin will remain because he's not a "hot hand", he's just good.

Sooooo.... if I'm the Avalanche, why would I spend the cap I have on a goalie instead of trying to build up my defense?

because "just acquire an elite defense, bro" isn't as straightforward as that would seem

 

[1989]

....But it's bullshit. It's not like the goalie is the only thing that has changed since the Avs won the cup. Likewise for Vegas.

My argument is not 'hey, not only is goaltending overrated, but go ahead and disassemble other key pieces of your cup-winning teams'.

Steady, solid goalies tend to get kept by every team willing to retain them. They rarely walk in UFA and they don't get traded, while even top defencemen and wingers are let go even in the offseasons immediately after a Stanley Cup win.

Great goalies steal games in ways that no other player position can, on a more regular basis than any other position. They can make a bad defence look good and a mediocre team make the playoffs. I think you (and any fan on this site) knows this already, so I don't know why you want to try to devalue the position.

In other words, goaltending is much more important to the GMs and how they build their teams. Whether one wants to pay the top performing goalies top player prices vs average 1A/1B platoon goalie prices is subjective in team building and cap management strategy.

 

[The don godfather]

So basically lose trouba to overpay huge to shesty. Love it from a bruins fan perspective.

 

[Antropovsky]

That 2021 Canadiens team doesn't go to the Finals in any year other than the COVID fake divisions year either. The Canadian division was trash.

I honestly don't think the Leafs goaltending has cost them in the playoffs lately, it's been their stars disappearing. The Leafs aren't built around goaltending, but they are imbalanced in their cap usage. They spend a lot of money on offensive players that don't perform in the playoffs.

I think Joseph Woll is a good young goalie that will find exactly as much success as the run support provided by several double-digit cap hit forwards provide for him.

I agree... but Samsonov and Campbell are bad goalies, borderline backups IMO. Poor positional goalies with bad rebound control.

 

[WarriorofTime]

Generalized logic amounts to "I wouldn't overpay goal scorers, it's like one day this guy scores 50 goals, the next year, this other guy does, it's just too volatile, I'd rather just stick a random guy on the top 6 and hope he gets hot"

 

[JaegerDice]

Yeah, we know, that's what the Leafs and Oilers have been trying for years. Right now, it looks like the Leafs may have found a "hot hand", we'll see if it lasts. Stuart Skinner looked like a "hot hand" for a bit there too and now they're back to scrambling to hope that whomever they have come postseason is good enough. These "hot hands" come and go, while Shesterkin will remain because he's not a "hot hand", he's just good.


because "just acquire an elite defense, bro" isn't as straightforward as that would seem

Right. But it's proveably way more predictable than 'find an elite goalie and pay him millions over 8 years'.

 

[Vergil]

How long before the Rangers regret this move? They act like they're a contender...

Unless they acquire Tkachuk for nothing... I just don't see it. This signing will just get worse with time. Even if the salary cap goes up exponentially.

 

[JaegerDice]

Steady, solid goalies tend to get kept by every team willing to retain them. They rarely walk in UFA and they don't get traded, while even top defencemen and wingers are let go even in the offseasons immediately after a Stanley Cup win.

Great goalies steal games in ways that no other player position can, on a more regular basis than any other position. They can make a bad defence look good and a mediocre team make the playoffs. I think you (and any fan on this site) knows this already, so I don't know why you want to try to devalue the position.

In other words, goaltending is much more important to the GMs and how they build their teams. Whether one wants to pay the top performing goalies top player prices vs average 1A/1B platoon goalie prices is subjective in team building and cap management strategy.

But they don't. That's the problem. GMs allocate cap space to goalies like they can predictably rely on them to 'steal' games, but they never win on that bet.

 

[TheNumber4]

Yeah, we know, that's what the Leafs and Oilers have been trying for years. Right now, it looks like the Leafs may have found a "hot hand", we'll see if it lasts. Stuart Skinner looked like a "hot hand" for a bit there too and now they're back to scrambling to hope that whomever they have come postseason is good enough. These "hot hands" come and go, while Shesterkin will remain because he's not a "hot hand", he's just good.


because "just acquire an elite defense, bro" isn't as straightforward as that would seem

Don’t forget the Avs and the Knights constantly swapping to find a hot hand. But yeh you’re paying for consistency and reliability with Shesty. I just dont think that’s worth nearly 12M and it’s not like Shesty is putting up a consistant .940+ every year. He himself isn’t a sure fire bet.