Proposal: NYR-BUF

[smoneil]

He’s easily a 100 point player with a good supporting cast.

Oddly enough, this actually strengthens the Nash trade comparison, as EVERYONE outside of a small group of Rangers fans kept saying that Nash would be good for 50 goals and 80-90 points if only he could escape Columbus. That isn't how it works. Established players don't suddenly add a 20+% bump in scoring just by being traded.

Here's an easy way to figure out whether or not Buffalo/Eichel fans are artificially inflating his performance. Turn this thread into a drinking game:

1 drink every time someone calls Eichel a "top 5 player/center" in the league.
1 drink every time someone offers an excuse (teammates, injuries, coaches, ownership) for the gap between Eichel's rep and his production.
2 drinks every time someone adds a post about "pace" or "average points per game."

If you can make it to page 18 without dying, Eichel might actually be as good as some Buffalo fans think he is. I suspect most fans would get alcohol poisoning somewhere around page 10.

 

[Old Navy Goat]

Oddly enough, this actually strengthens the Nash trade comparison, as EVERYONE outside of a small group of Rangers fans kept saying that Nash would be good for 50 goals and 80-90 points if only he could escape Columbus. That isn't how it works. Established players don't suddenly add a 20+% bump in scoring just by being traded.

Here's an easy way to figure out whether or not Buffalo/Eichel fans are artificially inflating his performance. Turn this thread into a drinking game:

1 drink every time someone calls Eichel a "top 5 player/center" in the league.
1 drink every time someone offers an excuse (teammates, injuries, coaches, ownership) for the gap between Eichel's rep and his production.
2 drinks every time someone adds a post about "pace" or "average points per game."

If you can make it to page 18 without dying, Eichel might actually be as good as some Buffalo fans think he is. I suspect most fans would get alcohol poisoning somewhere around page 10.

It's funny but considering that Eichel gets points on 34% of Buffalo's total goals since coming into the league and Buffalo has only scored 1062 in that timeframe for about 198 goals per season, similar production on a better team would easily boost his numbers. McDavid scores at a 43% pace much better than Eichel, conversely Matthews scores at 27% pace. So McDavid is much better driver of offense but stapled to the Sabres producing 43% means he's down almost 75pts. Now that same 34% would jump Eichel up 65pts. Would it be a linear switch, no but it seems to reason offensive drivers would produce more on higher scoring teams just with added on secondary assists.

 

[smoneil]

It's funny but considering that Eichel gets points on 34% of Buffalo's total goals since coming into the league and Buffalo has only scored 1062 in that timeframe for about 198 goals per season, similar production on a better team would easily boost his numbers. McDavid scores at a 43% pace much better than Eichel, conversely Matthews scores at 27% pace. So McDavid is much better driver of offense but stapled to the Sabres producing 43% means he's down almost 75pts. Now that same 34% would jump Eichel up 65pts. Would it be a linear switch, no but it seems to reason offensive drivers would produce more on higher scoring teams just with added on secondary assists.

Or, instead of doing a hypothetical math problem, you could just look at high scoring players who went from bad teams to good ones and see that--in most cases--established players' production rates tend to stay reasonably close to what they were on their previous "bad" team.

The vast majority of posters on this site insisted that Nash would score 50+ and put up 80-90 points solely by moving from Columbus to the Rangers. In the three seasons on either side of the trade, Nash scored about 10 points shy of a point per game. His production rate remained thoroughly within the range of variation where it had been throughout his time at Columbus.

 

[Old Navy Goat]

Or, instead of doing a hypothetical math problem, you could just look at high scoring players who went from bad teams to good ones and see that--in most cases--established players' production rates tend to stay reasonably close to what they were on their previous "bad" team.

The vast majority of posters on this site insisted that Nash would score 50+ and put up 80-90 points solely by moving from Columbus to the Rangers. In the three seasons on either side of the trade, Nash scored about 10 points shy of a point per game. His production rate remained thoroughly within the range of variation where it had been throughout his time at Columbus.

You're misconstruing production rate and ppg. Bad teams aren't all alike, you can have a team that scores a lot but gives up more so has a losing record, compared to a bad team that can't score. If production rate stays the same ie Eichel's 34%, moving from a low to high scoring team would increase his points. Now if ppg stays relatively the same it doesn't matter what kind of team the player is on, as your Nash example

 

[sandybridge]

Who said Tkachuk +++ ?? If I was building a team, I build around a 1C over a winger. Maybe we see a blockbuster type of trade with Eichel / Reinhart going to the Flames for Tkachuk, Monahan plus....

Tkachuk is too old, and Monahan way too old to be of much interest. If we move Eichel, it is to build around Dahlin as the remaining core, so the players coming back need to be around his age or younger.

 

[Beerz]

To New York:
Jack Eichel (6 years left @ 10 Million)

To Buffalo:
Filip Chytil (1 year left @ 894,166)
Kaapo Kakko (2 years left @ 925,000)
Ryan Strome (2 years left @ 4.5 Million)

New York’s Rationale:
Addresses the most glaring hole in their lineup at C with one the league’s premier talent with 6 years left on his contract. The Rangers look almost ready to contend and adding Eichel is a gigantic step forward.

Buffalo’s Rationale:
Puts Eichel out of his misery while recouping some valuable and young assets that will be apart of their core long term. If they can flip Hall with a plus for a decent young defensemen or a D prospect, their core will be pretty solid.

Does this at least get the conversation started between Buffalo and New York? Who adds or subtracts?

*I purposely did not include picks in the package going back to Buffalo because they don’t draft too well.

EDIT: Please provide feedback rather than just saying easy no from whichever side. I actually want to understand where I went wrong.

EDIT 2: Initially included Kravstov as wellbut removed because others said it was an overpayment.

This is a garbage offer and would rather Eichel play in Russia than take this.

 

[EK392000]

This is a garbage offer and would rather Eichel play in Russia than take this.

I can tell you haven’t done any further research beyond looking at point totals.

 

[Captain Controversy]

Columbus should offer Laine + Jones for Eichel.

 

[Groo]

Columbus should offer Laine + Jones for Eichel.

Would Buffalo be the best place for a known pouter in Laine?

 

[Beerz]

I can tell you haven’t done any further research beyond looking at point totals.

I didn't even look at point totals. Shows what you know.

 

[Captain Controversy]

Maybe ? I mean there is no pressure there to perform and Ralph would baby him.

 

[Beerz]

Maybe ? I mean there is no pressure there to perform and Ralph would baby him.

Yeah..baby him like Jeff Skinner

 

[Captain Controversy]

Yeah..baby him like Jeff Skinner

lol I wouldn't compare Laine with Skinner.
Skinner should be compared to Lucic, Neal, Eriksson.

 

[EK392000]

I didn't even look at point totals. Shows what you know.

You didn’t even bother to do that? So what are you basing you evaluation off of? Your Buffalo bias or Eichel bias, or is it a bit of both? If you think what I offered is underwhelming to not even warrant serious consideration from Buffalo, you don’t know hockey.

 

[is the answer jesus]

You didn’t even bother to do that? So what are you basing you evaluation off of? Your Buffalo bias or Eichel bias, or is it a bit of both? If you think what I offered is underwhelming to not even warrant serious consideration from Buffalo, you don’t know hockey.

It's underwhelming, I wouldn't consider it. I do know hockey. People can disagree on valuations.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Who said it had to be just prospects?? That’s an assumption. From the Flames it would start with Tkachuk. Canadiens it would be Suzuki. Sharks it would be Hertl.... Truly doubt Sabres are looking to tear it down. What does a prospect pool matter if teams don’t want to give up their good prospects. Lol. Ducks won’t trade Zegras, Rangers apparently won’t trade Laf. So doubt it becomes a prospect trade unless it’s with the Kings.

How can you seriously suggest that the Sabres wouldn't be looking to tear it down by trading Eichel? You guys are a bottom 10 team in the league with Eichel, arguably bottom 5. There's no way you are getting better by trading Eichel. That means you guys are at least a bottom 5 team without Eichel. What territory do you think that puts you in? Do you want to be bottom 5 with Eichel without tearing it down to say you aren't tearing it down?

 

[ICanMotteBelieveIt]

Oddly enough, this actually strengthens the Nash trade comparison, as EVERYONE outside of a small group of Rangers fans kept saying that Nash would be good for 50 goals and 80-90 points if only he could escape Columbus. That isn't how it works. Established players don't suddenly add a 20+% bump in scoring just by being traded.

Here's an easy way to figure out whether or not Buffalo/Eichel fans are artificially inflating his performance. Turn this thread into a drinking game:

1 drink every time someone calls Eichel a "top 5 player/center" in the league.
1 drink every time someone offers an excuse (teammates, injuries, coaches, ownership) for the gap between Eichel's rep and his production.
2 drinks every time someone adds a post about "pace" or "average points per game."

If you can make it to page 18 without dying, Eichel might actually be as good as some Buffalo fans think he is. I suspect most fans would get alcohol poisoning somewhere around page 10.

Savage.

 

[Team Cozens]

How can you seriously suggest that the Sabres wouldn't be looking to tear it down by trading Eichel? You guys are a bottom 10 team in the league with Eichel, arguably bottom 5. There's no way you are getting better by trading Eichel. That means you guys are at least a bottom 5 team without Eichel. What territory do you think that puts you in? Do you want to be bottom 5 with Eichel without tearing it down to say you aren't tearing it down?

By all indications Jack won't be traded till the deadline next year so lots of time between now, this years trade deadline, the draft, a UFA summer and next years deadline. Marty Biron suggested the Sabres will want to see Jack and next years team with their new coach before he would be traded. A lot more teams will have cap space, prospects from the 2021 draft and 1st round picks available for the 2022 draft. Makes sense to me so that the Sabres will make an educated trade.

 

[sabremike]

How is Roswell Park supposed to rid the world of cancer when all these Rangers fans keep creating more of it with their neverending trolling bullshit in these threads?

 

[TheBloodyNine]

We give up 2 centers AND Kakko? Nope.

 

[2 others]

Pretty sure the NYR social media department got an order from above, that is to troll the shit out of this subforum to try and lower the price for Eichel.
Does it work? I'm not sure, the proposals are too lopsided. Take care, or you'll end up a meme ala "Halak, Ryder and a 2nd".

 

[YP44]

Tkachuk is too old, and Monahan way too old to be of much interest. If we move Eichel, it is to build around Dahlin as the remaining core, so the players coming back need to be around his age or younger.

23 is too old? damn

 

[Kupo]

Pretty sure the NYR social media department got an order from above, that is to troll the shit out of this subforum to try and lower the price for Eichel.

OP is not a Rangers fan. But you keep doing you if it helps you sleep at night.

 

[EK392000]

OP is not a Rangers fan. But you keep doing you if it helps you sleep at night.

Don’t think they were talking about me. Probably talking about the people like the Rangers fan who have been trying to undervalue Jack by citing his point totals in seasons where he didn’t play all 82 games, and when told about the injuries that were the reason for Jack’s shortened seasons, argued that his durability decreased his trade value.

 

[Kupo]

Don’t think they were talking about me. Probably talking about the people like the Rangers fan who have been trying to undervalue Jack by citing his point totals in seasons where he didn’t play all 82 games, and when told about the injuries that were the reason for Jack’s shortened seasons, argued that his durability decreased his trade value.

Anyone who thinks that a players value will be affected by what’s being discussed on HFBoards is likely batshit crazy.