Speculation: Nylander Discussion - Part IV

[Znith]

Nylander 2 first seasons in Nhl is close to identical to Tavares 2 first seasons. ,

Can people stop repeating this lie?

Nylander draft + 1: 21 GP SHL - 20 pts -> 37gp AHL 32 pts
Tavares draft + 1: 82 GP NHL 54 pts

Nylander draft + 2: 38 GP AHL - 45 pts --> 22 GP NHL 13 pts
Tavares draft + 2: 79gp NHL 67 pts

Nylander draft + 3: 81gp NHL - 61 pts (winger)
Tavares draft + 3: 82 GP NHL - 81 pts (center)

Yeah, Nylander is a good player but he is NOT ON JOHN TAVARES DEVELOPMENT CURVE!!

Sorry for going off, I just have seen this repeated over and over, and its blatantly not true.

 

[Hunter368]

Bill Ny has got no leverage. Work it out and get on the ice, pretty boy. We've got cups to win.

Just both agree to a bridge and play hockey

 

[varano]

but we don't have doogie howser as our gm and a hockey executive who signed an offersheet when he played then asks current players to take a hometown discounts.

I highly suggest you look at chevys track record. Its pathetic. The fact that he has a job is miraculous.

You exclusively have the Jets Scouts, and Wadell/Dudley to thank for the team you have now. Chevy did Nothing.

 

[Cotton]

Ok. So are all agreed that Nylander is a worse players (not a center, fewer points, not elite on the dot like Leon, not as good at ES, fewer goals, same age, etc) than Draisaitl and doesn't deserve the same kind of money? The only people who do are Nylander and his agent.

I need to bookmark this post/thread for future reference when some idiot starts a Nylander vs. Draisaitl thread.

Y'know... with the money saved from the Tavares signing... you'd think that extra $2M/yr could go to Nylander

JC, Vegas bandwagoners from Florida throwing shade, lol. Why am I not surprised your trolling is limp wristed.

 

[McOvechking]

I haven't really looked into this much until now, but I saw the TSN article that the Nylander camp is asking for $8M. What in the world has Nylander, a 22 year old 60 point winger, done to deserve $8M per year?

I also don't understand the Draisaitl comparable. A 77 point center should not be a valid comparison for a 61 point winger.

 

[Dekes For Days]

Nylander was drafted as a center, he's never gotten a fair shake at playing that position. He's been the guy who has played off his natural position to help the team, and he probably thinks he'd put up better numbers by playing his true position. But the team wants to pay him like a winger, and they'll probably want him to play center at some point in the future (after Kadri's gone) while he's paid like a winger.

Lots of people are drafted as centers, because that's where high-end players can make the most impact when they are a significant step ahead of their peers. He has been tried at center, and did not look as good. It is far from a guarantee that he would do better or put up more points as a center, especially on a significantly worse, less offensive team. We are paying him like a winger because that's what he is.

Kadri is here for at least another 4 years, which would be anywhere from half to the majority of his contract. Why would Nylander, an offensive player, on a team with Matthews and Tavares, take over the 3rd line checking center role, after 6 years playing with Matthews?

So he's supposed to take a long term deal at a team friendly number for a team that hasn't done him any favors yet? Can't blame the guy for holding out. Hope he gets to play somewhere they'll appreciate him more

He has hugely benefited by being on the Leafs, and has had endless offensive opportunities and chances to develop and raise his value from the start of his career, playing with one of the best centers in the league.

He was better positioned than most young players in the league. He is lucky, and he should be grateful.

 

[ffh]

I highly suggest you look at chevys track record. Its pathetic. The fact that he has a job is miraculous.

You exclusively have the Jets Scouts, and Wadell/Dudley to thank for the team you have now. Chevy did Nothing.

what. wadell/dudley

 

[voxel]

JC, Vegas bandwagoners from Florida throwing shade, lol. Why am I not surprised your trolling is limp wristed.

Speaking the truth hurts? Nylander is a 60pt winger. We all know that. Of course asking for $8M/yr is crazy. If Leaf fans agreed that he was better than Draisaitl they'd have no problem paying him $8M/yr. Pure logic. No speculation. No trolling. Just truth.

 

[JetsHomer]

I highly suggest you look at chevys track record. Its pathetic. The fact that he has a job is miraculous.

You exclusively have the Jets Scouts, and Wadell/Dudley to thank for the team you have now. Chevy did Nothing.

Lol

 

[57special]

I haven't really looked into this much until now, but I saw the TSN article that the Nylander camp is asking for $8M. What in the world has Nylander, a 22 year old 60 point winger, done to deserve $8M per year?

I also don't understand the Draisaitl comparable. A 77 point center should not be a valid comparison for a 61 point winger.

You're right, LD is worth more, but you can't ignore that the salary cap and landscape has changed since LD signed.

 

[varano]

what. wadell/dudley

Yes...
Where do you think Wheeler and Buff came from? Also, Look into Wheelers history before you knock on Shanahan. He f***ed over arizona pretty good.

 

[McClelland]

Tavares has won things his whole life. I think what you mean to say is "the Islanders management hasn't shown to be a winner".

Could be a combination of not being a franchise winner also! Lundy took a Ranger team without any stars to the finals 2014 and has 11 playoffs to show. Ek65 took a pretty ugly Senator team to game 7 of the conference final.

Tavares when winning OG was a no show 4 gp 4 0 0 0p Wc cup 6 gp 1 3 4p, just saying that nothing in his cv points out that he take his teams to great hights!

Giving up a back to back 60 p C/W to sign Tavares could easily obstruct the Tml in the near future.

William Nylander has shown that he can be the Mvp at Wc, a 20 years old key player in the goldwinning Swedish team, thats showing impact when it matters!

 

[ffh]

Yes...
Where do you think Wheeler and Buff came from? Also, Look into Wheelers history before you knock on Shanahan. He ****ed over arizona pretty good.

virtually every player starting on the jets was drafted by chevy. what does what happened in Arizona with wheeler have to do with shanahan. wheeler did what the cba said he had a right to do. so he didn't screw anybody over. its hypocritical of shanahan to say a player should take a hometown discount when he signed an offersheet for more money instead of staying in n.j. how are they sinular

 

[Dekes For Days]

Third contract but only his third season in the Nhl and it also included his first full nhl season with like 37 points , so the leafs should bridge nylander imo if they haven't offered that already

Still, a third contract has a different set of expectations and gives the RFA different leverage and rights, and it requires the buying of more UFA years (as does an 8 year contract), which costs more. And he had more time in the NHL than Nylander (a full year), any way you want to look at it, and showed that he could be significantly better than anything Nylander has shown, once given similar opportunities.

A bridge deal doesn't work for either side. 1 year lumps all the big contracts together. 2 and 4 years carry significant risk of going into a lockout with no contract. 3 years hands Nylander all of the leverage and arbitration rights to UFA, which would probably result in him pricing himself off the team if this is his strategy now. Any of these number of years also carry significant financial risk for Nylander, and significant team building risk for the Leafs.

 

[Cotton]

Speaking the truth hurts? Nylander is a 60pt winger. We all know that. Of course asking for $8M/yr is crazy. If Leaf fans agreed that he was better than Draisaitl they'd have no problem paying him $8M/yr. Pure logic. No speculation. No trolling. Just truth.

...and whos saying he's better than Draisaitl?

 

[bernmeister]

Do you know of any RDs that might be tradeable for Nylander's scoring touch ?
...

RDs esp that caliber, are few and far between
If you don't want to go F, your best bet is LD and like I said, since Rangers have prospect LDs, so I could see Skeji.
If you insist on RD, there are Canes but I don't see someone like Pesce. I see they go with Faulk +, but do you want that?

not seeing matches exacerbated by supply + demand

 

[Dr Pepper]

...and whos saying he's better than Draisaitl?

Nylander appears to think he's worth as much, or close to it.

That's the issue. Most Leafs fans I've seen can at least accept the fact that he doesn't deserve anything close to that amount.

 

[135ace]

Leafs fans when it comes to Nylanders contract- He's just a 60 point winger. That's not that impressive. He's not worth more than 6MM.

Leafs fans when it comes to trading Nylander for a Dman- He's one of the best young players in the league. He's developing at the same pace as Tavares. Players of his caliber return young #1Dmen. We wouldn't trade him for anything less than a #1D.

 

[Elias GOATtersson]

Always great when the 3 or 4 leafs fans with massive victim mentalities come and meta post trying to police the thread.

 

[McOvechking]

You're right, LD is worth more, but you can't ignore that the salary cap and landscape has changed since LD signed.

Even factoring in inflation, I don't think Nylander is worth anywhere near $8M. I mean, he might be in a couple years, so wouldn't a 2x$5M bridge deal make sense? Or would a bridge deal be even less money than that?

Long term, for what Nylander has proven, I can't see how he is worth over $7M. If I was Dubas, I'd be thinking mid-high $6s.

 

[voxel]

Nylander appears to think he's worth as much, or close to it.

That's the issue. Most Leafs fans I've seen can at least accept the fact that he doesn't deserve anything close to that amount.

Exactly. He and his agent should be looking for Ehlers money.

I hope to never see blog posts like this again:

2014 re-draft: Could William Nylander go 1st overall?

 

[Michel Beauchamp]

I specifically remember Joseph taking 6M in Detroit when he was offered 8M in Toronto but left for a chance at the cup pre-cap.

So I dont think Shanny is wrong here. Detroit had a budget and it looks like players took less to get a good team to contend for the cup.

False.

 

[danfromwaterloo]

If I were the Leafs, I'd put a final offer on the table at 6.5M x 3 (or whatever) and give him a deadline, or else they'll pursue a trade.

 

[Sky04]

Can people stop repeating this lie?

Nylander draft + 1: 21 GP SHL - 20 pts -> 37gp AHL 32 pts
Tavares draft + 1: 82 GP NHL 54 pts

Nylander draft + 2: 38 GP AHL - 45 pts --> 22 GP NHL 13 pts
Tavares draft + 2: 79gp NHL 67 pts

Nylander draft + 3: 81gp NHL - 61 pts (winger)
Tavares draft + 3: 82 GP NHL - 81 pts (center)

Yeah, Nylander is a good player but he is NOT ON JOHN TAVARES DEVELOPMENT CURVE!!

Sorry for going off, I just have seen this repeated over and over, and its blatantly not true.

It's not a lie, you just can't read. It clearly states "Nylander's first 2 seasons in the NHL" not his draft + seasons, you just got annoyed at yourself.

 

[Sky04]

This is too funny, after the leafs fans hyping him up the last 2 years with ridiculous hyperbole they now have to downplay his game because they're too cheap to pay him