Post-Game Talk: No defense for this loss

[Howard Chuck]

As for accountability, there is enough to go around. The players have to hold themselves accountable, the leadership on the team has accountability, and the coaches have the ability bench or split up players.

It's never all one thing, but I do think the coach has ultimate responsibility. If he can't motivate his team, then what is he doing?

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

He’s likely too good for the AHL, but hasn’t established himself as an effective NHL’er yet. I question if he’ll ever be more than a bottom 6 player, but time will tell. I think Chevy and PoMo want him to gain that experience to one day be an effective contributor as a complementary piece - in a pp and pk role as well. I think having him be our #2 C, eventually replacing Little, is a few years down the road if at all.

So some growing pains now with him for sure. I just haven’t seen him take meaningful positive strides yet. He’s played with Little and a quality winger for awhile now, month or two, but has only contributed a little bit on the pp2 and that seems to have dried up for now.

He was expendable at the deadline for me in the right deal. A mid-20’s impact player either with term on his deal or willing to sign here. But that deal didn’t happen. If the Jets are able to re-sign Hayes, then Roslovic looks like a bottom 3 winger to me or trade bait to get a quality young dman.

Though the more I look at our line up for next couple of years and our cap situation, having Roslovic on 3rd line with Lowry and maybe Vesalainen, appeals to me too. He’s cost controlled and could maybe play that speedy, defensively aware role on that line possibly replacing a too expensive Tanev.

I don't see any sign of the positives you are hoping for. Doesn't mean it won't happen, but there is no reason to expect it either.

 

[Positive]

The lack of drive, killer instinct, urgency, whatever you call it, was disturbing in the last 10 minutes. The overpassing. I recall an analyst saying that it can be indicative of a lack of confidence. You don't want the puck. You don't want to have the responsibility of taking the shot. So you don't shoot, you don't drive the play, you just get rid of it like a hot potato.

That's what I'm seeing. Tentativeness. Where's the scoring instinct? Puck is on your stick. Win the game. Forget this pass-it-off-to-your-buddy-and-hope-he-shoots-it garbage.

Same reason I hate this passive zone defense garbage. Let's all collapse and hope our tender can bail us out. Let's give up 37-40 shots a game. It's crap. Go get the puck. Go win the game.

Frustrating.

 

[HannuJ]

guys guys guys,
Hendricks is like a cold sore. takes a while for it to take root once it presents itself.
give him a week and he'll rub off on everyone.

 

[Ducky10]

He’s likely too good for the AHL, but hasn’t established himself as an effective NHL’er yet. I question if he’ll ever be more than a bottom 6 player, but time will tell. I think Chevy and PoMo want him to gain that experience to one day be an effective contributor as a complementary piece - in a pp and pk role as well. I think having him be our #2 C, eventually replacing Little, is a few years down the road if at all.

So some growing pains now with him for sure. I just haven’t seen him take meaningful positive strides yet. He’s played with Little and a quality winger for awhile now, month or two, but has only contributed a little bit on the pp2 and that seems to have dried up for now.

He was expendable at the deadline for me in the right deal. A mid-20’s impact player either with term on his deal or willing to sign here. But that deal didn’t happen. If the Jets are able to re-sign Hayes, then Roslovic looks like a bottom 3 winger to me or trade bait to get a quality young dman.

Though the more I look at our line up for next couple of years and our cap situation, having Roslovic on 3rd line with Lowry and maybe Vesalainen, appeals to me too. He’s cost controlled and could maybe play that speedy, defensively aware role on that line possibly replacing a too expensive Tanev.

He could play that speedy, defensively aware role, but that would require him becoming more defensively aware, which he really isn't at the moment. He has more offensive upside than that though, but you're right, he really hasn't shown it enough yet.

 

[Jetfaninflorida]

It's not that simple a question. I also didn't say coaching isn't an issue at all. I'm not sure how you go through these topics as it's either A or B and there's no room in between. The stretch you make from "it's not just coaching" to " coaching isn't an issue at all" is half the reason you get into these heated debates about it.

They are playing like a .500 team, partly because of coaching and partly because of the players playing way below the level that we've seen them be capable of playing at.

So, no, I don't believe that the issue is only coaching, and no, I don't believe that this is a .500 calibre roster.

We are in agreement. Let me say again. It's not all on the coach. It is never (or hardly ever) only one thing. But coaching on this team is an issue in my opinion. Any many others here have the same opinion.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Holy overreactions! Didn't think they looked bad until the end of the third. Think they have played worse plenty of games this season and won.

Maybe that's the problem. They've been winning easy all season and have developed bad habits.

 

[Ducky10]

The lack of drive, killer instinct, urgency, whatever you call it, was disturbing in the last 10 minutes. The overpassing. I recall an analyst saying that it can be indicative of a lack of confidence. You don't want the puck. You don't want to have the responsibility of taking the shot. So you don't shoot, you don't drive the play, you just get rid of it like a hot potato.

That's what I'm seeing. Tentativeness. Where's the scoring instinct? Puck is on your stick. Win the game. Forget this pass-it-off-to-your-buddy-and-hope-he-shoots-it garbage.

Same reason I hate this passive zone defense garbage. Let's all collapse and hope our tender can bail us out. Let's give up 37-40 shots a game. It's crap. Go get the puck. Go win the game.

Frustrating.

This, so much this. It's exactly how the Jets have been playing for awhile now, no responsibility at all. Guys are conctantly putting their teammates in tough situations because they don't want to take responsibility for making something happen. I lose count how many times one of them puts it on the oter to make the play instead of themselves, they cycle the puck to nowhere, throw ridiculous low percentage passes to one another, to rid themselves of responsibility and generally play a game of whack f*** in their own end.

Some of them need to get it together and play with some assertiveness.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Shots are irrelevant and they certainly did not out work us

Shots are irrelevant? OK. Then we're golden.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I think they win this game with Buff and Morrissey.

Unless the Wild also have Koivu and Dumba.

 

[CaptainChef]

Nothing to add about the last few minutes last night — it was ugly, but it’s not like it’s new for this year. 2016-17 throwback.

I’d sit Myers and/or Kuli and plug Bogdan and/or Poolman in to calm things down on the back end and get 55/26 under 20 mins a game and off the PK, esp with Hayes in the lineup. He’s a rental, let’s get value out of him. PoMo needs to take back the reigns, and soon.

Yep, becoming more apparent as the season goes on that PoMo really has no control over the room. Letting Scheif & Wheels do what they want for as long as they want just screams of no control.

 

[CaptainChef]

Come back Buffy

Jets need you!!!!


Losing your top 2 defenseman for looong stretches is insane !!!!!!!



Not many teams can survive that.

Well it makes for a convenient excuse anyway. When we're constantly bleeding 40+ shots regardless of who we have in there for defence, its clear it not a couple injuries that is why this team is currently struggling. Can't believe I'm saying this, but it appears like it may be time to get a real leader out there on the ice -- Hendricks.

 

[CaptainChef]

What I don't understand is why Hayes was playing with Perreault and Ehlers. If he was brought in as a number 2 center, he needed either Connor or Laine on his other wing. There aren't a lot of games left before the playoffs to build chemistry.

Yup, one square peg in the whole offensive structure last night. You get a fresh new face that really wants to show what he's got, and you saddle him with our coldest winger.

 

[CaptainChef]

Have we ever heard Maurices rationale for that Pk? Maybe Hayes will take over eventually....idk. It does seem weird.

Sometimes I think the only time PoMo rationalizes stuff is when he's behind a mike. When he's on the bench or setting his lineup, he entirely on auto-mode, letting his vets dictate where & when they play, and only making necessary switches in the lineup when injuries dictate he has to. Its just so damn frustrating!!!!

 

[CaptainChef]

There is clearly a sense of frustration in a number of players, whether that has to do with their own performance, their teammates performance (or lack thereof), or the message they keep receiving is hard to tell. Something seems amiss though, they just don't seem as driven.

Totally agree & if I had to bet, its frustration with the coaching that is driving this 'malaise'

 

[Keystone]

Here's a poll question. Will Wheeler or Little post a single 20 goal season during their extensions? I'm thinking no.

If they played on the same line I think Little would...maybe both....so no.

 

[CaptainChef]

I think they win this game with Buff and Morrissey.

Maybe, but we've had those guys in many games where we've looked a lot worse. Its a team malaise, and if they don't soon figure out what the underlying reasons are, we'll be booted in the first round.

 

[Positive]

This, so much this. It's exactly how the Jets have been playing for awhile now, no responsibility at all. Guys are conctantly putting their teammates in tough situations because they don't want to take responsibility for making something happen. I lose count how many times one of them puts it on the oter to make the play instead of themselves, they cycle the puck to nowhere, throw ridiculous low percentage passes to one another, to rid themselves of responsibility and generally play a game of whack **** in their own end.

Some of them need to get it together and play with some assertiveness.

Me, I'd rather take a low-percentage shot than try for a low-percentage pass. But the team has been afraid to shoot, or heck even possess the puck, for two months now. IMHO, the best players want the puck on their stick when the game is on the line. They want to be the guy pulling the trigger. They drive to the net. And they are in the opposition's face when defending. These are the guys who break open the game.

This team? You can see the mentality whenever they cross a blue line. Either our own, or the opponents. Oh, I'll just chip it out now and hope someone else gets it. Hope we can last this shift without being scored on. Neutral zone is just fine. Did I just enter the offensive zone? I'll put on the brakes and curl back and look for a trailer. Maybe a D-Man I can dump it off to, or the center coming down the middle. Anyone but me, I don't want this grenade. Even better, I'm hoping if I look over my shoulder I can make a cute little drop pass to someone behind me. Anyone but me! And if they score I'll come out looking like a great team player.

(and in the meantime, the opposing goaltender has setup, and the rest of the opposing team has everyone covered)

Of course, I'm reading way too much the psyche here but you get my meaning. I'd sum up the team's play as: Tentative, afraid, too cute. Uninspiring. Reactionary. Observers instead of drivers. It might not be a conscious thing; they're just doing this subconsciously from an inner lack of confidence or desire, that they don't even admit to themselves. This team needs a shrink.

 

[Flair Hay]

Sometimes I think the only time PoMo rationalizes stuff is when he's behind a mike. When he's on the bench or setting his lineup, he entirely on auto-mode, letting his vets dictate where & when they play, and only making necessary switches in the lineup when injuries dictate he has to. Its just so damn frustrating!!!!

That's kind of the job description. The best ones can keep a cool head all the time. Some get wrapped into the emotion too much sometimes.

Not sure where Maurice falls compared to other coaches in this regard. But it's part of what makes the job so tough. Making split second decisions when you dont have much time to react in a crazy environment.

I thought he did a good job in the playoffs until the Vegas series.

That's my take on things, not specifically aimed at you Chef. I just get rattled when every PGT is nothing but crying over spilled milk.

Vegas PGT was at 3 pages, this one is at 9 by noon after game day.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Am I alone?

I liked this team more when it was bad - but getting better - and trying hard.

Of course expectations were lower and that is part of it. But not all of it.

This team is no longer A Band of Brothers. It is no longer A Pack of Wolves. It is no longer lovable.

 

[GeorgeJETson]

guys guys guys,
Hendricks is like a cold sore. takes a while for it to take root once it presents itself.
give him a week and he'll rub off on everyone.

Hendricks is like a cold sore. Nice.

 

[robertocarlos]

Laine has scored 4 goals in 3 games, so I'm good.

I'm not. He was too lazy to get the easy 5th goal.

Hayes won't be back next year without big changes. Looks like peak Jets was last year.

 

[nobody imp0rtant]

Am I alone?

I liked this team more when it was bad - but getting better - and trying hard.

Of course expectations were lower and that is part of it. But not all of it.

This team is no longer A Band of Brothers. It is no longer A Pack of Wolves. It is no longer lovable.

You aren't alone. On the bright side, next year they will probably be back to being bad, and the love can flow again.

 

[Positive]

Am I alone?

I liked this team more when it was bad - but getting better - and trying hard.

Of course expectations were lower and that is part of it. But not all of it.

This team is no longer A Band of Brothers. It is no longer A Pack of Wolves. It is no longer lovable.

I've said this many times. For me it's not so much about the losses. It's the way they are losing. It's uninspiring, passive hockey that isn't even enjoyable to watch right now. Having no possession, letting their goaltenders get lit up for 40 shots a night with zone D and no one is driving the play.

 

[surixon]

The Jets are not surprising anyone this year, last year they did. There wasn't much of a book on them last season, especially with so many young players. Injuries over the last couple months to very key players haven't helped matters and the talent downgrade on D with the departure of Enstrom (43 games is not insignificant people), is getting more evident. Ben Chiarot simply cannot log top 4 minutes for any team that wants to call itself a contender, especially in the absence of the guy who is responsible for making him even look like a passable player.

Certain players performance has to improve, it has not been as consistent as last season and collectively this team does not seem as committed and disciplined in playing the game that worked so well for them last season. The sample seems to be growing with the number of times we've seen indifferent play from some of our key players and I have to admit I'm wondering why more often than previously. Teams have adjusted to the Jets, it's pretty obvious, yet they don't seem to be making many adjustments themselves or at least be as committed to what it is they are already being asked to do. Maurice is a great talker, but I've always thought he's just really good in non specifics, he can talk around something without ever really saying much of substance. Now, a lot of that is by design, I obviously don't expect the guy to get overly specific about what it is the Jets are trying to do and where they are failing, but his consistent explanation that they just need to play faster and look a certain way just fall flat with me. You wonder whether it's starting to fall flat with the players as well.

There is clearly a sense of frustration in a number of players, whether that has to do with their own performance, their teammates performance (or lack thereof), or the message they keep receiving is hard to tell. Something seems amiss though, they just don't seem as driven.

Very well stated. While there is an issue with execution and consistiency with a number of players I am of the mind set that the game plan didn't get adjusted heading into this season.

As you mentioned teams will make a book on you and game plan against you. As with the best players that need to continually adjust their game to stay ahead of other teams the best coaches will continually tweak and nuance their systems to keep other teams off balance.

I also feel that we haven't seen any of that this season, this team is measurably worse in moat metrics and there is very little in the way of adjustments to correct it. I felt Maurice and the org was full marks last season for doing their analytic deep dive and implementing a system that made sense for the roster. Whether it's true or not it appears as though they thought they would be able to run over teams with the same system and it hasn't worked.

There just seems to be a giant disconnect somewhere on the team this year. Maybe the players aren't listening and buying in but in the end it all leads to the same place. I remember a post by I think Guerzy that stated that once things and off the rails Maurice in his past positions was never able to get them back on. I guess we will see over the next 20 games if he can get this team refocused and engaged. This also falls on our leadership group to galvanize the room as well.