Nikita Kucherov is the clear favorite for the Art Ross Trophy

[Master P]

How is it garbage? Connor was a PP merchant last year with the same % of points on the PP.
Has the narrative changed?


Yea and now that the team has lost many of their 2 way players, they are being exposed.
So yea, they USED TO, but not anymore.

What narrative? Who was calling McDavid a pp merchant last season? lol

Kucherov is the only reason Tampa has any offense at all. He's scored or assisted on 50% of all goals scored this season. He's probably over that now after last night.

 

[Coffey]

Who was calling McDavid a pp merchant last season? lol

Damn bruh, did you avoid the main boards last season?

 

[Master P]

Damn bruh, did you avoid the main boards last season?

Yes actually, but not because of my own free will.

 

[innitfam]

That’s a strange tie breaker for #3

Yeah, a much better one would be GWG or % factored team's offense. First goal of the season should be like last resort tiebreaker.

 

[Coffey]

Yes actually, but not because of my own free will.

Ah damn, well I hope everything was ok.

But ya, there was like a 200 page thread on McDavid during his 150+ season and most detractors were just calling him a PP merchant all year long.

It was probably Pens and Leafs fans then.

 

[Master P]

Ah damn, well I hope everything was ok.

But ya, there was like a 200 page thread on McDavid during his 150+ season and most detractors were just calling him a PP merchant all year long.

It was probably Pens and Leafs fans then.

Oh everything was good on my end. It was site related. Thats all I can say lol.

 

[Coffey]

Oh everything was good on my end. It was site related. Thats all I can say lol.

OHH I get ya.

 

[Seanaconda]

No doubt 23-25 year old crosby scores 150 in this era. He had 66 in 40 in 2011 in a far lower scoring league. I mean these guys have the same stats which tells you everything you need to know

..... Crosby didn't dominate rosses like McDavid did so why does that tell us everything we need to know lol

 

[authentic]

..... Crosby didn't dominate rosses like McDavid did so why does that tell us everything we need to know lol

Because of health, not ability.

 

[hamzarocks]

Because of health, not ability.

B/c of both

Croaby choked 2015 (even if you use ppg, his season was barely ahead of anyone else vs Mcdavid who usually is significantly ahead) , 2016 and 2017 ross races

Should have won 2 out of 3 of those. His inability showed he wasn't as consistently dominant as Mcdavid

He would have won 2011, 2012 and 2013 if he was healtby

 

[authentic]

B/c of both

Croaby choked 2015 (even if you use ppg, his season was barely ahead of anyone else vs Mcdavid who usually is significantly ahead) , 2016 and 2017 ross races

Should have won 2 out of 3 of those. His inability showed he wasn't as consistently dominant as Mcdavid

He would have won 2011, 2012 and 2013 if he was healtby

Crosby would’ve already had 5 Art Rosses by that time frame you’re referencing though, that was my point.

 

[hamzarocks]

Crosby would’ve already had 5 Art Rosses by that time frame you’re referencing though, that was my point.

Ah okay my bad then, your right he would have 5 by year 9 ending

Issue was year 10-14 he didnt produce as much as he should have

Mcdavid probably doesnt win the ross this year so he will have 5 in 9 years too

 

[WalterLundy]

..... Crosby didn't dominate rosses like McDavid did so why does that tell us everything we need to know lol

If we take when goals per game dipped below 2.8 in 2010-11 and stayed that way until the end of 2016-17 while comparing that to 2017-18 to now we get this:

2010-11 to 2016-17 G/GP average: 2.74

2017-18 to present G/GP average: 3.06


Top 10 PPG of 10/11 to 16/17:

Crosby: 1.27
Malkin: 1.14
Kane: 1.05
Stamkos: 1.04
St. Louis: .98
Ovechkin: .96
Backstrom: .96
Tavares: .96
Getzlaf: .95
Benn: .95

Top 10 PPG of 17/18 to present:

McDavid: 1.59
Kucherov: 1.41
MacKinnon: 1.38
Draisaitl: 1.34
Panarin: 1.21
Pastrnak: 1.20
Matthews: 1.19
Rantanen: 1.18
Marchand:1.16
Crosby: 1.16

2005-06 to 2009-10 saw Crosby and Ovechkin in a battle for number 1 for points per game during that span with 1.36 to 1.34 in favor of Crosby. A lot of people believe Ovechkin was better in this span as this was his peak and the goals disparity is what does it. 2010-11 is where Crosby’s peak was starting but was cut short to injuries. In any event he still won the bulk of his hardware in this 2011-2017 range and made his legacy here. 2017-18 to now puts McDavid’s era in view and in comparison to Crosby’s time that was also lower scoring.

If we use the difference in scoring levels for these two periods and make a combined top 10 for everyone as if they were all playing in the 2017-18 to now environment then here’s what it looks like:

McDavid: 1.59
Crosby: 1.41
Kucherov: 1.41
MacKinnon: 1.38
Draisaitl: 1.34
Malkin: 1.27
Panarin: 1.21
Pastrnak: 1.20
Matthews: 1.19
Rantanen: 1.18

We always hear about lower scoring as an excuse to boost numbers but when you look only two players from 2011-17 enter the combined top 10. Maybe it is higher scoring because the league is better than it was then even after considering other factors that inflate it a tad. Crosby and Kucherov end up tied behind McDavid and while Crosby’s 2011 in this “era” would be worth mid 140s in 82 games for pace it still wouldn’t be better than McDavid’s level even if the closest for a season. Especially if we take an arbitrary small sample size to match Crosby’s 10-11 like 2022-23 for McDavid’s first 37 games in which he had 72 points and was pacing for 160. A number in which he has topped in 82 consecutive games before.

This style of comparison also really speaks to how good Kucherov is. Crosby also could have won the ross from 2011 to 2013 and I believe he would have but he also had opportunities in his prime after that and couldn’t in 2015-2017.

 

[Voight]

That’s a strange tie breaker for #3

It's pretty unfair too. Some teams play multiple games before others play their first. Look at this season for example - Chicago played 2 games before Washington played their first.

Because of health, not ability.

He lost the Art Ross race in his prime to Jamie Benn.

 

[Voight]

If the Olympics ever decides to add mental gymnastics, you might win the Gold

Post of the year

 

[PaulD]

What narrative? Who was calling McDavid a pp merchant last season? lol

Kucherov is the only reason Tampa has any offense at all. He's scored or assisted on 50% of all goals scored this season. He's probably over that now after last night.

He is on a tear ..... but Point Stamps and Hedman aren't ready for the bone yard. Hell of a powerplay , ran by Kucherov.

 

[authentic]

It's pretty unfair too. Some teams play multiple games before others play their first. Look at this season for example - Chicago played 2 games before Washington played their first.



He lost the Art Ross race in his prime to Jamie Benn.

He would’ve had 5 Art Ross by that point though, the same as McDavid right now

Was also beat by .01 by 65 goal Ovechkin the season he had his high ankle sprain, could’ve very easily been 6.

 

[kp61c]

He is on a tear ..... but Point Stamps and Hedman aren't ready for the bone yard. Hell of a powerplay , ran by Kucherov.

Kuch has 25-point lead on Point. That number speaks for itself.

 

[PaulD]

Kuch has 25-point lead on Point. That number speaks for itself.

he's leading the league the entire league His 25 point lead on his winger means what Point sucks ?
Keep learning buddy .....

cheers

 

[Voight]

He would’ve had 5 Art Ross by that point though, the same as McDavid right now

Was also beat by .01 by 65 goal Ovechkin the season he had his high ankle sprain, could’ve very easily been 6.

That's entirely speculative and debatable.

He might've been "on pace" to win those three but he missed a significant amount of games. 2013 is the only one where there's a somewhat of an argument since he still finished 4 points behind MSL.

 

[kp61c]

he's leading the league the entire league His 25 point lead on his winger means what Point sucks ?
Keep learning buddy .....

cheers

The whole team sucks, except for Kucherov.

 

[PaulD]

The whole team sucks, except for Kucherov.

lol

 

[Stammertime91]

Anybody calling McDoodle a PP merchant is out to lunch, envious, or delusional. Seriously, get your head checked. You might not like him for whatever reason but the guy doesn't need me or anybody to market his style, he's amazing. On the flip side, calling Kucherov a PP merchant is delusional. The guy is doing things 5v5 that are unreal. He's played with postseason determination the first half of the year and if he keeps it up, he definitely has a shot at the Art Ross. This will be three huge contracts, three big time players, and three HOF guys going at it in their prime. Let's not be the new reiteration of the shit posting Crosby vs Ovechkin fan boys and miss what these guys are doing.

 

[RegDunlop]

Anybody calling McDoodle a PP merchant is out to lunch, envious, or delusional. Seriously, get your head checked. You might not like him for whatever reason but the guy doesn't need me or anybody to market his style, he's amazing. On the flip side, calling Kucherov a PP merchant is delusional. The guy is doing things 5v5 that are unreal. He's played with postseason determination the first half of the year and if he keeps it up, he definitely has a shot at the Art Ross. This will be three huge contracts, three big time players, and three HOF guys going at it in their prime. Let's not be the new reiteration of the shit posting Crosby vs Ovechkin fan boys and miss what these guys are doing.

Nice post

 

[authentic]

That's entirely speculative and debatable.

He might've been "on pace" to win those three but he missed a significant amount of games. 2013 is the only one where there's a somewhat of an argument since he still finished 4 points behind MSL.

Yes, he missed a significant amount of games because of injury, which brings us back to my point that injury stopped him from racking up scoring titles rather than lack of offensive ability.