NHL to Atlanta odds just increased significantly

[Section 104]

If, a big if, it does happen you need an owner who is dedicated to make it appealing to fans..both the hardcore hockey fans and the casuals. Build up youth programs. Get kids interested…reward high school students and they will nag their parents into taking them. You can’t just open the doors and expect 17,000 to show up every night. You have to promote.

I don’t worry about “talent pool is too thin”…I heard that when there were 12 teams (of course the vast majority of players were Canadian then). But in a few years American and European players came in followed by Russians in the 1990s. Besides to a lot of people NCAA football and basketball are big stuff they follow religiously and that should be diluted with so many schools.

But I’d like to see Quebec get another shot too. Perhaps the Salt Lake City, Houston, Atlanta and Quebec four team expansion someone suggested will happen..maybe spread over 3 years or so.

 

[JAK]

Didn’t QC build or renovate a new arena to NHL standards, and has been waiting in the wings for ages?

Quebec City is that guy the hot girl leads on forever and ever.

 

[GreeningOil]

Ridiculous, this city have already fails twice with the NHL, give a chance to Houston or even Salt Lake City. Even Quebec would be a better option right now.

Yes but shamelessly accepting money is what they’re in the business of

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

I'm guessing you weren't around then. Fans of other teams made the same spurious arguments. You realize they weren't allowed to keep most of their players? Most of the NHL wanted all their rights honoured and wanted to force the WHA teams to start over in the draft. For the most part they did. Blaire McDonald was a rising star on Gretzky's wing that first year. You remember "BJ", right? right?

It was exactly the same thing. The NHL already expanded to 16 teams and now they were taking on for more small market teams with the same pool. How many of those teams are still in the same city now? Yours.

you didn't even address my point of a rival league having NHL talent playing it...so again I ask, how is the WHA argument even close to expansion today?

 

[3074326]

Same ol bad arguments. The talent is not going to be diluted. We just had two expansion teams prove that wrong. Adding two more teams isn't going to change much about our viewing experience, it will bring in new fans and hopefully give the teams more money to spend. I really see no downsides.

I also don't think Atlanta will fail if they have competent ownership/location. Not sure they've had both of those simultaneously. Hopefully this is it.

 

[TheNumber4]

They should go with the Atlanta Stampede for the name.

Steal Calgary's City Heritage and History like Calgary stole theirs.

 

[Nasti]

Houston and Atlanta are the two largest markets without NHL teams. There is no way the league isn’t going to keep trying.

 

[LuckyDay]

you didn't even address my point of a rival league having NHL talent playing it...so again I ask, how is the WHA argument even close to expansion today?

Because more teams further "dilutes" the league by your logic no matter how many players bring in. This simply did not happen.

And the fact of the matter is, expansion has repeatedly turned out to be very, very good for the league. If you watch the 1977 WHA All Star Game you can already see that "80's style hockey" was being played in the 1970's and is the chief reason Edmonton still has a team.

There's no dilution of talent with expansion - it just causes the game to grow as the sport is further expanded. In fact, it prevents it. Look at these giants that play in the league now. They would have had to turn to basketball if they could or even tennis or volleyball if they are looking for a pro sports career. or construction since a pro sports job wouldn't pay the bills.

The league expanded from 6 teams to 16 in a few short years while competing with a rival league. (Basketball was expanding so hockey had to as well).

We have a 32 team league now. Is the sport worse off? It can handle three more teams.

 

[dj4aces]

Quebec City is that guy the hot girl leads on forever and ever.

It's also a city in the category of "has failed twice". So, if having lost two NHL franchises is the limit, like so many fans seem to believe it is, they too are off the table, no matter how much I'd like to see a team back there too.

Fortunately for both Atlanta and Quebec City, sports leagues don't operate on the same illogical ideas as fans seem to in an attempt to make something seem more exclusive than it really is. Chicago had two NBA teams - the Stags and the Packers - before the Bulls finally stuck. DC had two MLB teams fail before the Expos moved there to become the Nationals. If these places can get a third team, so can Atlanta and QC.

And really, who knows how many attempts to make the NFL work LA has had, but it's more than three.

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

Because more teams further "dilutes" the league by your logic no matter how many players bring in. This simply did not happen.

And the fact of the matter is, expansion has repeatedly turned out to be very, very good for the league. If you watch the 1977 WHA All Star Game you can already see that "80's style hockey" was being played in the 1970's and is the chief reason Edmonton still has a team.

There's no dilution of talent with expansion - it just causes the game to grow as the sport is further expanded. In fact, it prevents it. Look at these giants that play in the league now. They would have had to turn to basketball if they could or even tennis or volleyball if they are looking for a pro sports career. or construction since a pro sports job wouldn't pay the bills.

The league expanded from 6 teams to 16 in a few short years while competing with a rival league. (Basketball was expanding so hockey had to as well).

We have a 32 team league now. Is the sport worse off? It can handle three more teams.

You're argument is "the NHL can handle it"? I mean, sure...the NHL can handle 6 more teams...but when is enough?
the NFL, NBA and MLB can handle more team too, you don't them expanding do you?

 

[dj4aces]

You're argument is "the NHL can handle it"? I mean, sure...the NHL can handle 6 more teams...but when is enough?
the NFL, NBA and MLB can handle more team too, you don't them expanding do you?

NBA: Seattle and Vegas likely to receive franchises. In searching for articles, I saw both "soon" and "in the near future" both used in reference to this subject.
MLB: That talk is brewing just a bit. "We have to fix Oakland and Tampa first". Sounds like a familiar refrain, doesn't it? It begins at 5:10 and ends at 5:45 of the linked video. I should note, Oakland is set to move to Las Vegas in 2025. I'm unsure about the status of Tampa, as I don't pay a lot of attention to baseball outside of the Tigers.
NFL: The only mention of expansion appears to be in the context of international play. The linked article mentions games taking place in Madrid, Rio de Janeiro, and Sao Paulo, so no new teams coming to the NFL in the near future.

So, of the three sports leagues listed, two are at least discussing new teams, with one making plans towards that goal. So while they haven't actually expanded yet, it's coming.

 

[HTFN]

Wooooooo

Make Atlanta Skate Again

 

[TheKingPin]

Just looking at the map, Forsyth County is on the far Northeast edge of the Atlanta Metro. It's 25 miles from downtown to the entertainment district.

Yes previous teams suffered from being inaccessible to some fans, being in downtown meant being far from the NE burbs. But this district is also far from downtown and far from most of suburban Atlanta.

The problem in Atlanta is that the whole thing is just too sprawly, not enough density to support some big city amenities.

I’m guessing you don’t live here. It’s South Forsyth fyi. There are so many people and families in this area. You can drive forever with well do homes and businesses. I moved from the suburbs of Philly and there are more hockey fans in these suburbs than Philly. I’ll be buying season tickets asap. I really think success is the only outcome.

 

[LuckyDay]

You're argument is "the NHL can handle it"? I mean, sure...the NHL can handle 6 more teams...but when is enough?
the NFL, NBA and MLB can handle more team too, you don't them expanding do you?

These leagues are in most of the large markets (and are very successful in some small ones like Green Bay) in the United States already. Some of them are trying to grow their games in foreign markets even.
It wasn't always so though. All four leagues have now surpassed Boxing, Horse Racing, and Sailboat Racing in popularity now and are very wary about the growth of e-sports. The NBA itself was on the verge of collapse and battled hockey in the US as the #3 and nearly became a goon league to try and match hockey's growth. It wasn't expansion that saved it but profit sharing.
Tennis is growing the sport of pickleball with some success and everyone has their eye on soccer growing in NA. Also, Nascar. Formula 1 has moved into the US.

 

[MessierII]

They’ll be in Quebec within 15 years

 

[rojac]

I'm guessing you weren't around then. Fans of other teams made the same spurious arguments. You realize they weren't allowed to keep most of their players? Most of the NHL wanted all their rights honoured and wanted to force the WHA teams to start over in the draft. For the most part they did. Blaire McDonald was a rising star on Gretzky's wing that first year. You remember "BJ", right? right?

It was exactly the same thing. The NHL already expanded to 16 teams and now they were taking on for more small market teams with the same pool. How many of those teams are still in the same city now? Yours.

The NHL had expanded to 18 then contracted t o 17 when the Cleveland Barons merged with North Stars.

 

[LuckyDay]

The NHL had expanded to 18 then contracted t o 17 when the Cleveland Barons merged with North Stars.

that's why I'm confused my 9 year old self knew it was a 16 team league that suddenly became a 21 team league.

 

[rojac]

These leagues are in most of the large markets (and are very successful in some small ones like Green Bay) in the United States already. Some of them are trying to grow their games in foreign markets even.
It wasn't always so though. All four leagues have now surpassed Boxing, Horse Racing, and Sailboat Racing in popularity now and are very wary about the growth of e-sports. The NBA itself was on the verge of collapse and battled hockey in the US as the #3 and nearly became a goon league to try and match hockey's growth. It wasn't expansion that saved it but profit sharing.
Tennis is growing the sport of pickleball with some success and everyone has their eye on soccer growing in NA. Also, Nascar. Formula 1 has moved into the US.

Both MLB and the NBA will probably expand in the next several years.

I've heard some people express the idea that th3 NHL can support more teams than the NBA, MLB, and NFL because the NHL is viable in smaller Canadian cities like Ottawa, Edmontn, Calgary, and Wnnipeg.

 

[VivaLasVegas]

Didn’t QC build or renovate a new arena to NHL standards, and has been waiting in the wings for ages?

But nobody is offering to pay $1 billion even if the stadium were adequate.

 

[VivaLasVegas]

NBA: Seattle and Vegas likely to receive franchises. In searching for articles, I saw both "soon" and "in the near future" both used in reference to this subject.
MLB: That talk is brewing just a bit. "We have to fix Oakland and Tampa first". Sounds like a familiar refrain, doesn't it? It begins at 5:10 and ends at 5:45 of the linked video. I should note, Oakland is set to move to Las Vegas in 2025. I'm unsure about the status of Tampa, as I don't pay a lot of attention to baseball outside of the Tigers.

The A's sort of showed up in Vegas uninvited, obtained lukewarm and skeptical interest and relatively modest financial support for a stadium, and even the MLB is doubtful about the ability of their flakey and notoriously cheapskate owner to successfully pull off the move. Had the A's gone elsewhere, the local response would have been somewhere between a sigh of relief and muted celebration since we'd rather have an expansion team with a better owner.

 

[dj4aces]

The A's sort of showed up in Vegas uninvited, obtained lukewarm and skeptical interest and relatively modest financial support for a stadium, and even the MLB is doubtful about the ability of their flakey and notoriously cheapskate owner to successfully pull off the move. Had the A's gone elsewhere, the local response would have been somewhere between a sigh of relief and muted celebration since we'd rather have an expansion team with a better owner.

Thanks for the additional insight on the A's. All I knew of their current situation specifically is the brief bit I'd heard from podcasts and the like (pretty sure the A's were recently mentioned on 32 Thoughts).

 

[CanadienShark]

I'm actually kind of intrigued after what I've read.

 

[HTFN]

The A's sort of showed up in Vegas uninvited, obtained lukewarm and skeptical interest and relatively modest financial support for a stadium, and even the MLB is doubtful about the ability of their flakey and notoriously cheapskate owner to successfully pull off the move. Had the A's gone elsewhere, the local response would have been somewhere between a sigh of relief and muted celebration since we'd rather have an expansion team with a better owner.

if I understand it correctly the A's is still not a guarantee because they can't manage to actually get a plan together.

These dingdongs didn't have support going in and then haven't actually managed to really materialize any sort of concrete plan. The MLB for now is apparently just sort of fine with that, but there will eventually come a point where something has to give if Fisher keeps asking for the moon and getting nowhere because now they're basically officially out of Oakland.

 

[Ghost of Murph]

A lot of money to be made by the owners and league in expanding by 4 more teams, which will probably happen over the coming years. That means 70 games out of 82 will be home and home with each team team playing every other team at least twice a season. Good bye to any semblance of regular season rivalries.

I have nothing against Atlanta. I do have a problem with the 4th place league of the major sports in America becoming diluted with a ridiculous number of teams for such a niche sport in the country with the vast majority of teams. Also, there is only so much star talent as is. Not a fan of spreading that talent thinner and thinner.

 

[Wry n Ginger]

I think several things should happen.

ARZ should move but only be able to take 2/3 of their roster.

2 other teams get added.

All remaining teams established longer than 5 years protect 16 players. 9 forward, 5 Dmen and 2 goalies

Arizona and the new teams would draft the players they want.


A cool twist would be adding void cards randomly to some players