You seem to be misremembering what "people like me" said. Our depth was good last year, especially post-deadline.
New GM Trades and Signings Part 2
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SprDaVE
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- Sep 20, 2008
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At least he acknowledges that this team needs more scoring. It's a huge need. I hope he finds it but there isn't much out there. Bertuzzi and Domi.... that's about it?
If he reaches those bonuses, he'll be worth as much. That's not an unreasonable amount, 4.25 for arguably the worst defensive D in the NHL last Season is.
Sure, but you could say the same about your prior examples as well, we can merely speculate.
We're also speculating when we say that Wheeler, Brown, Duchene wouldn't have taken slightly more money to play for the Toronto Maple Leafs, that's also speculation until confirmed otherwise.
If being a Leafs fan has taught me anything, it's that players will fight for every f***ing dime in their wallet first and foremost, unless maybe that's purely a Toronto Maple Leaf culture issue?
Mess
Global Moderator
The biggest cage rattling message sent today that must have Shanny and his Shanapaln soul searching came from Ryan O'Reilly.. The former Blue speaking from experience as a Cup winner and Conn Smythe playoff MVP told Leaf "No thanks". He was very vocal after Leafs playoff loss and frustrated at players effort and coaching after the loss to Florida.
Picture this, ROR is playing centre in the playoffs on Leafs 2nd line with captain Tavares on is LW and Mitch Marner on his right a pair of $11 mil players, and playing behind Matthews & Nylander top line, yet those that consider the Leafs a serious Cup contender saw ROR (an Ontario kid) walk away for similar money as rumoured to go play in Nashville where they just bought-out 1 top 6 center in Duchene and traded the other Ryan Johansen with 50% retention for future considerations, sighting better winning opportunity as a reason for leaving today.
With the core returning and the coach, ROR went for greener pastures, Instead the insider revealed that O'Reilly's decision to leave Toronto was motivated by something far more damning, a simple desire to get away from the Maple Leafs organization.
Damning details about Ryan O'Reilly's decision to leave Toronto.
Ryan O'Reilly's decision to leave the Toronto Maple Leafs may send shockwaves through the organization once again.
Source for ROR criticism of Leafs from TSN overdrive interview: Ryan O'Reilly laments Leafs coaching - 'There's so many things we could have done differently'
In his first interview with the Toronto media following the Leafs elimination in the second round, the pending free agent and big-name Leafs deadline acquisition Ryan O'Reilly spoke candidly about his experience with the Leafs, including a sly criticism of the coaching staff.
However, later in the interview as the Overdrive hosts worked through the Leafs elimination in the second round, O'Reilly was critical of the team's play and even their coaching. Potentially referring to the Leafs loaded second line of Tavares, Marner, and himself, O'Reilly lamented that the he and others thought the coaching staff could've adjusted better to the Florida series, and did so multiple times.
It's an interesting comment, being that it comes across as hiding his disappointment and potential criticism from being too public, but with the GM change and potential coaching change in Toronto, perhaps there's an avenue for O'Reilly to return and feel better about the team's playoff chances.
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Torontonian
Registered User
After digesting today; it’s not as terrible as first thought, We lost a ton of UFAs, but 3 of those players were not with us until game 62 last season, we were fine without those players prior to that. Losing Kerfoot and Holl is an addition.
The main thing is, we still have money left over, (muzzins 5m and potentially Murray’s 4.6m if they trade or buy him out in the 2nd window). And more importantly, we didn’t give out any crippling contracts. There are still free agents available that would make us a better team.
Having quality depth is important yes, but the team will only go as far as the big boys will take us.
The main thing is, we still have money left over, (muzzins 5m and potentially Murray’s 4.6m if they trade or buy him out in the 2nd window). And more importantly, we didn’t give out any crippling contracts. There are still free agents available that would make us a better team.
Having quality depth is important yes, but the team will only go as far as the big boys will take us.
SprDaVE
Moderator
- Sep 20, 2008
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Ideally they get Bertuzzi. I just don't know how he gets less than someone like Killorn and that might be a tough one to fit.
I'd go after Domi as well but I think it would require a trade by the Leafs to fit him in because I think it would be interesting to fit both in and really bolster up.
Rare Jewel
Patience
I don't want seem like I'm defending him because I'm still quite skeptical about his appointment. But it wasn't exactly a banner crop of UFA's was it?
I mean in contrast to luring Jarnkrok or Ritchie it's not really a big deal.
Amazing how you would never think that this team would have problems scoring
Yet here we are
We better get Bertuzzi. Reaves ain't scoring anything
Jimmy Firecracker
Backcheck, Forecheck, Paycheque.
Here I was concocting a post to scheme how the Leafa could salvage the off-season that included signing Hathaway, only to double check and find he went back to Philly. Great.
SprDaVE
Moderator
- Sep 20, 2008
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Ehhhh I don't think it's much of an issue. I honestly think Treliving did well to steer away from questionable contracts that he screwed up in Calgary.
ROR and Duchene were hard to see sign elsewhere for what they did but sounds like offered the same. Sounds like the majority of Canadian teams had a hard time today as well.
This team will still be a top 10 scoring team because of the talent. It just needs better quality of depth in case of injuries and to provide secondary options. It really only needs a LW that can put up 20+ goals and we're more or less set.
The trade protection isn’t a big deal with either player.
If you’re gonna trade Matthews it has to be a sign and trade and to do that he would have to agree anyway. And Nylander only has a 10 team NTC which means there are still 21 teams they could trade him to.
Marner on the other hand his trade protection kicking in likely means he isn’t going anywhere. He has a full NMC and isn’t eligible for an extension for another year.
So i see the new war is festering - dubas will live on because of how he could bring in cheap depth and new guy klingberg.. all separate symptoms of the over death by a thousand cuts of the past 5 years
They wont make us any harder to play against imo.. both fluff grit guys with horribly inconsistent play on their aide of center
Quoting you because you have said it a couple times and it needs to acknowledged.. klingberg is a wreck.. and surprisingly is quite shitty despite his skill at moving the puck out of his zone unless he carries it.. but then it creates a whole new array of adventure
They wont make us any harder to play against imo.. both fluff grit guys with horribly inconsistent play on their aide of center
Orpik.. it was shady and as posted looked at but a-ok! Lol
Quoting you because you have said it a couple times and it needs to acknowledged.. klingberg is a wreck.. and surprisingly is quite shitty despite his skill at moving the puck out of his zone unless he carries it.. but then it creates a whole new array of adventure
kb
Registered User
- Aug 28, 2009
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And he blew $8 million on cap on 22 goals. I don't get it. The team is easier to play against and still didn't really address any secondary scoring.
I think he's throwing darts at a board, and he signs whomever it lands on. He literally let a player better than Klingberg - who was also a transition wizard (Gustafsson) - go for less than 1/5th of what he paid for Klingberg without addressing a need.
Someone please make it make sense.
Kurtz
Registered User
- Jul 17, 2005
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Free agent quality aside, when Ontario-born ROR would rather play for a rebuilding team than take the same term to come back here...that strikes me as an issue.
Failing to convince Ontario-born Duchene to come here (or not pursuing him at all?) is an issue.
Hathaway and Accari were also signed to very reasonable deals for worse teams. Us failing to get in on them is the issue.
When Shanahan came here he said that Ontario guys would come here at a discount. For a while that proved semi-true. Now we can't even sign them at par value.
That 10 team NTC nylander has likely means he wouldn't extend there as well. Anybody trading a premium for him would look to sign him.
Commander Clueless
Apathy of the Leaf
- Sep 10, 2008
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Yeah this offseason isn't just about Dubas paying too much for the core. It looks like we might have lost our free agency sex appeal.
Who wants to start up the rebuild thread?
BallardEra
Leafs&Caps Since 1982™
Looks like he wasn't too enamoured with Keefe. Guessing when Keefe came back that ROR didn't want to return.
Mess
Global Moderator
I'm actually quite pleased at the departures outside of ROR and Schenn.
Luke a former Kelowna Rocket (soft spot) and played well for the Leafs the 2nd time around and I've always been a big ROR fan even before he was a Leaf.
ROR sent a real message today leaving a milquetoast soft core group that lacks compete, that provided 1 goal for $33 mil and no push back in round #2 and very critical of Keefe's lack of coaching (which I agree with him on both accounts), so him and Luke leaving for Smashville can't be faulted. But I will miss them.
Bunting and his act had worn out his welcome, Holl a bad reminder of a expansion draft protection blunder and Kadri for Kerfoot trade very regrettable. Good Riddance !!
LeafChief
Matthew Knies Enthusiast
TheFloater
Registered User
Absolutely. It looks like they don't want to add any of the kind of bad deals passed out today to their cap sheet in the future, but what's the next step? They could bring in guys on cheap contracts for depth scoring (Comtois, Yamamoto), or is there a trade coming? Otherwise all they have left are the young guys like Roberston and Abbruzzese to fill spots on the third and fourth line. I have no idea what Treliving is planning on doing. Very little cap space, many spots left to fill, and Samsonov still to sign. Muzzin on LTIR creates more cap space, that's one other option. They wouldn't accrue any cap space during the year though.
Maple Leaf
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- Sep 18, 2009
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SeaOfBlue
The Passion That Unites Us All
- Aug 1, 2013
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I would start by saying that I think the Leafs would really go hard after Domi since he is really the only one who can, with any kind of decent chance, fill our 3C and 2PP center hole in UFA; Bertuzzi can't play center, Rodrigues shouldn't be playing center, the rest of the UFA centers are nowhere near good enough or won't come here (Bergeron and Krejci), Keefe didn't have much of an appetite for Jarnkrok at center, Lafferty was bad at center, and if we are putting Holmberg there, then we have some issues.
Then we need one more guy...
Scanning the market, Tomas Nosek, Mason Shaw, and Axel Jonsson-Fjallby are still decent options out there for our shutdown line. Suter, Fischer, ZAR, and Motte are also still out there as well.
Conversely, if we look at offensive winger options, there are guys like Rodrigues and reclamation projects like Yamamoto, Gurianov, and maybe Comtois. Boqvist, Sundqvist, Suter, Ritchie, and Erne just don't do enough for me to prefer them over just putting Reaves there and then double shifting Nylander on that line.
I think it makes more sense to get a shutdown guy. Nosek is solid, and Shaw/AJF have some solid upside (although Shaw has major injury concerns). We need another PKer up front as well, and most of those options are solid enough PKers.
Meanwhile, if we get Domi, we probably do not need to add another PP forward, so we can afford to use Reaves on that line and just double shift Nylander (or Jarnkrok or Marner) at ES to make it all work.
Knies - Matthews - Marner
Jarnkrok - Tavares - Nylander
Robertson - Domi - Reaves/Nylander
Nosek - Kampf - Lafferty
Defensively, who really knows. Keefe is going to have his hands full figuring out how to make that defense work with Klingberg on it. I assume Liljegren is getting a lot more PK responsibilities to make up for Holl leaving? Rielly is also a sneaky good PKer but we do not have any RHD PKers at that point.
Rielly - Barrie did work decently well under Keefe back in 2019-2020, but that puts a lot of pressure on the other pairings to step up in the tough minutes and who knows if they can handle it. Otherwise, are we sheltering a Gio-Klingberg pairing and then having a top 4 of McCabe, Brodie, Rielly, Liljegren? If we trust Liljegren to step up, it could work. There would be issues if we ever wanted to rotate in Timmins for Gio though, because who knows if Timmins is ready for any kind of serious defensive responsibility at this point, and he'd need to handle it.
Rielly - Liljegren
McCabe - Brodie
Giordano - Klingberg
Timmins
PP1: Matthews, Marner, Nylander, Tavares, Rielly
PP2: Domi, Knies, Jarnkrok, Robertson, Klingberg
PK Forwards: Kampf, Marner, Lafferty, Jarnkrok, Nosek, Robertson/Knies
PK Defensemen: McCabe, Giordano, Brodie, Liljegren, Rielly (#5).
I think we sacrificed a lot of flexibility and overall effectiveness just for a little bit more offense from the back end (unless Klingberg really explodes) and an enforcer who can't play more than 8 minutes a night anymore.
Then we need one more guy...
Scanning the market, Tomas Nosek, Mason Shaw, and Axel Jonsson-Fjallby are still decent options out there for our shutdown line. Suter, Fischer, ZAR, and Motte are also still out there as well.
Conversely, if we look at offensive winger options, there are guys like Rodrigues and reclamation projects like Yamamoto, Gurianov, and maybe Comtois. Boqvist, Sundqvist, Suter, Ritchie, and Erne just don't do enough for me to prefer them over just putting Reaves there and then double shifting Nylander on that line.
I think it makes more sense to get a shutdown guy. Nosek is solid, and Shaw/AJF have some solid upside (although Shaw has major injury concerns). We need another PKer up front as well, and most of those options are solid enough PKers.
Meanwhile, if we get Domi, we probably do not need to add another PP forward, so we can afford to use Reaves on that line and just double shift Nylander (or Jarnkrok or Marner) at ES to make it all work.
Knies - Matthews - Marner
Jarnkrok - Tavares - Nylander
Robertson - Domi - Reaves/Nylander
Nosek - Kampf - Lafferty
Defensively, who really knows. Keefe is going to have his hands full figuring out how to make that defense work with Klingberg on it. I assume Liljegren is getting a lot more PK responsibilities to make up for Holl leaving? Rielly is also a sneaky good PKer but we do not have any RHD PKers at that point.
Rielly - Barrie did work decently well under Keefe back in 2019-2020, but that puts a lot of pressure on the other pairings to step up in the tough minutes and who knows if they can handle it. Otherwise, are we sheltering a Gio-Klingberg pairing and then having a top 4 of McCabe, Brodie, Rielly, Liljegren? If we trust Liljegren to step up, it could work. There would be issues if we ever wanted to rotate in Timmins for Gio though, because who knows if Timmins is ready for any kind of serious defensive responsibility at this point, and he'd need to handle it.
Rielly - Liljegren
McCabe - Brodie
Giordano - Klingberg
Timmins
PP1: Matthews, Marner, Nylander, Tavares, Rielly
PP2: Domi, Knies, Jarnkrok, Robertson, Klingberg
PK Forwards: Kampf, Marner, Lafferty, Jarnkrok, Nosek, Robertson/Knies
PK Defensemen: McCabe, Giordano, Brodie, Liljegren, Rielly (#5).
I think we sacrificed a lot of flexibility and overall effectiveness just for a little bit more offense from the back end (unless Klingberg really explodes) and an enforcer who can't play more than 8 minutes a night anymore.
LaPlante94
Registered User
- Apr 12, 2011
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Ok. After that deadline though some insiders said these could be rentals because they might prefer going back to the States or because they might be out of our price range, but yet we complain now that they are gone for these exact reasons. We chose the younger person and better skater between Kampf and Acciari who bring the same amount of offence and Kampf players harder defensive minutes which is what we obviously valued more. O'Rielly just chose not to come here so there's that. If we gave Schenn what he got people would be complaining about that contract I'm sure. Kerfoot was was useless and just forgot how to score or hit the net. Is that everyone of our depth players we let go? Oh yeah, Bunting. Well, people grew tired of his antics and he became useless when he stopped drawing penalties. It's actually quite sad we don't have players in our system who could replace a guy like Acciari, Schenn or even Bunting and bring what they did to this team. Another complaint was our puck moving from the back end was pretty weak outside Rielly. Brought in a guy on a 1 year deal who can do that very well and has been a guy who can put up 40-50 points from the backend many times. Day 1 of FA and you'd think the season was already played and ended.
Dreakmur
Registered User
There are different ways to be “hard to play against”. Toughness is one of them. Another is speed. The Leafs need a huge injection of both.
Both of those guys would add speed to our lineup.
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