New GM Trades and Signings Part 2

[Buds17]

Free agent quality aside, when Ontario-born ROR would rather play for a rebuilding team than take the same term to come back here...that strikes me as an issue.

Failing to convince Ontario-born Duchene to come here (or not pursuing him at all?) is an issue.

Hathaway and Accari were also signed to very reasonable deals for worse teams. Us failing to get in on them is the issue.


When Shanahan came here he said that Ontario guys would come here at a discount. For a while that proved semi-true. Now we can't even sign them at par value.

ROR likely shouldn't play anywhere lower than 2C in Nashville's lineup. Would that be true as a Leaf? IIRC, Duchene couldn't block his trade to Ottawa and never officially signed a contract with that team. For whatever it may be worth, Hathaway and Acciari are American born players (the latter also didn't have a veto in last season's contract). Discount or not, the hometown player that actually did sign here feels like persona non grata by some of the fanbase at times.

 

[andora]

There are different ways to be “hard to play against”. Toughness is one of them. Another is speed. The Leafs need a huge injection of both.

Both of those guys would add speed to our lineup.

I completely understand and agree there are lots of ways that you can be hard to play against. I just don't see it with these two guys and then throw in the potential money and term that they are seeking. I just don't find them attractive targets

 

[Dekes For Days]

Ok. After that deadline though some insiders said these could be rentals because they might prefer going back to the States or because they might be out of our price range, but yet we complain now that they are gone for these exact reasons. We chose the younger person and better skater between Kampf and Acciari who bring the same amount of offence and Kampf players harder defensive minutes which is what we obviously valued more. O'Rielly just chose not to come here so there's that. If we gave Schenn what he got people would be complaining about that contract I'm sure. Kerfoot was was useless and just forgot how to score or hit the net. Is that everyone of our depth players we let go? Oh yeah, Bunting. Well, people grew tired of his antics and he became useless when he stopped drawing penalties.

We didn't need to bring back all of the same people. We did need to do more than replace them all with one forward who shouldn't even be playing.

Another complaint was our puck moving from the back end was pretty weak outside Rielly. Brought in a guy on a 1 year deal who can do that very well and has been a guy who can put up 40-50 points from the backend many times. Day 1 of FA and you'd think the season was already played and ended.

I don't think the season has already been played and ended. I'm hopeful that Treliving can turn this around, and I'll give him time. But space is running out, and things aren't looking good so far. Yes, offense from the back-end is a decent area to bolster, but I'm not sure 4.15m to one of the worst defensive players in the league coming off a mess of a year is the best or most efficient way of achieving that goal.

 

[The Masters]

 

[RoadWarrior]

*Crouse - Matthews - *Bertuzzi
*Bailey - Tavares - Marner
*Gadjovich - *Minten - Nylander
Lafferty - Kampf - Reaves

Rielly- *Soderstrom
*Hanifin - Klingberg
McCabe-Liljegren
Gio

Murray
Woll

This assumes:
1. We sign Gadjovich for cheap and sign Bailey for 2 years for cheap to play with Tavares
2. Minten steps in. I know Minten is still young, but hey....ORielly left, so we need a third line center and we don't have cap space
3. We trade Jarnkrok and Brodie for Hanifin
4. We still can sign Bertuzzi to an AAV of $6M, after having traded Jarnkrok?
5. This is the big one, trade Knies to Arizona for Crouse (50% retention), Soderstrom and Lamoureux

How about they sign Domi or Bertuzzi instead of Bailey.

 

[Sypher04]

I would MUCH rather keep Knies over getting Crouse. Thankfully, I really don’t think there’s even a chance in hell the Leafs would move him

 

[Dr.Funk]

 

[Bloomberg]

How about they sign Domi or Bertuzzi instead of Bailey.

I have Bertuzzi on the top line there. I rather a combination of Bertuzzi and Crouse than Bertuzzi and Domi. Crouse offers a different skill set

I would MUCH rather keep Knies over getting Crouse. Thankfully, I really don’t think there’s even a chance in hell the Leafs would move him

It'll be Knies for Crouse and 2 D prospects. We need more prospects in general after trading away so many 1st round picks and we don't have many future picks either as Dubas traded them away.

 

[Sypher04]

It'll be Knies for Crouse and 2 D prospects. We need more prospects in general after trading away so many 1st round picks and we don't have many future picks either as Dubas traded them away.

If I’m the Leafs I’m not trading Knies. End of story.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

I would start by saying that I think the Leafs would really go hard after Domi since he is really the only one who can, with any kind of decent chance, fill our 3C and 2PP center hole in UFA; Bertuzzi can't play center, Rodrigues shouldn't be playing center, the rest of the UFA centers are nowhere near good enough or won't come here (Bergeron and Krejci), Keefe didn't have much of an appetite for Jarnkrok at center, Lafferty was bad at center, and if we are putting Holmberg there, then we have some issues.

Then we need one more guy...

Scanning the market, Tomas Nosek, Mason Shaw, and Axel Jonsson-Fjallby are still decent options out there for our shutdown line. Suter, Fischer, ZAR, and Motte are also still out there as well.

Conversely, if we look at offensive winger options, there are guys like Rodrigues and reclamation projects like Yamamoto, Gurianov, and maybe Comtois. Boqvist, Sundqvist, Suter, Ritchie, and Erne just don't do enough for me to prefer them over just putting Reaves there and then double shifting Nylander on that line.

I think it makes more sense to get a shutdown guy. Nosek is solid, and Shaw/AJF have some solid upside (although Shaw has major injury concerns). We need another PKer up front as well, and most of those options are solid enough PKers.

Meanwhile, if we get Domi, we probably do not need to add another PP forward, so we can afford to use Reaves on that line and just double shift Nylander (or Jarnkrok or Marner) at ES to make it all work.

Knies - Matthews - Marner
Jarnkrok - Tavares - Nylander
Robertson - Domi - Reaves/Nylander
Nosek - Kampf - Lafferty

Defensively, who really knows. Keefe is going to have his hands full figuring out how to make that defense work with Klingberg on it. I assume Liljegren is getting a lot more PK responsibilities to make up for Holl leaving? Rielly is also a sneaky good PKer but we do not have any RHD PKers at that point.

Rielly - Barrie did work decently well under Keefe back in 2019-2020, but that puts a lot of pressure on the other pairings to step up in the tough minutes and who knows if they can handle it. Otherwise, are we sheltering a Gio-Klingberg pairing and then having a top 4 of McCabe, Brodie, Rielly, Liljegren? If we trust Liljegren to step up, it could work. There would be issues if we ever wanted to rotate in Timmins for Gio though, because who knows if Timmins is ready for any kind of serious defensive responsibility at this point, and he'd need to handle it.

Rielly - Liljegren
McCabe - Brodie
Giordano - Klingberg
Timmins

PP1: Matthews, Marner, Nylander, Tavares, Rielly
PP2: Domi, Knies, Jarnkrok, Robertson, Klingberg
PK Forwards: Kampf, Marner, Lafferty, Jarnkrok, Nosek, Robertson/Knies
PK Defensemen: McCabe, Giordano, Brodie, Liljegren, Rielly (#5).

I think we sacrificed a lot of flexibility and overall effectiveness just for a little bit more offense from the back end (unless Klingberg really explodes) and an enforcer who can't play more than 8 minutes a night anymore.

Of course, there is also Nolan Patrick as a potential 3C... But who knows with his massive injury history. If Domi is absolutely prohibitive, and we are possibly turning to Holmberg anyways, giving Patrick a chance may be our best option. It wouldn't be drastically different than giving Monahan a shot, except Patrick has never lived up to his high end potential like Monahan once did.

As for signings for the Marlies: RD Nic Meloche, RW Brett Ritchie, C Alex Limoges, RD Cal Foote

While I certainly think it is optimistic to say we will get two semi-promising young RD in Foote and Meloche when we already have Timmins, Niemela, and Villeneuve on the depth chart, they would make that Marlies defense quite formidable and have plenty of upside for both the present and the future. With Klingberg and Brodie as pending UFA's, and Timmins' health still being a question mark (never mind whatever happens with Liljegren), there are opportunities for these guys to win jobs here in the future, and we have a top-notch developmental system for them to work on themselves for opportunities elsewhere too.

I liked Limoges out of college. His skating will likely never be NHL caliber, but he is a solid two-way guy with some size and can help with the dirty work. We need guys who can support our legit NHL wing prospects and he can do that.

Ritchie is similar, except as a winger instead of as a center. Local guy who has been given three separate contracts from Treliving in the last three years (although was ultimately traded by him to get his brother at this past year's TDL).

I think we could also add a goalie, but we may just get one thrown in a Matt Murray trade because the UFA options are far from ideal.

If I’m the Leafs I’m not trading Knies. End of story.

Sure as heck not for Crouse anyways. I'd rather just take a swing at Comtois for free.

 

[Brobust]

Rather than go after Bertuzzi or Domi, they should go get Garland.

Probably cheaper than Bertuzzi. Better two way impact than both. Also, one of the top penalty drawing players over the past 3 seasons.

 

[Sypher04]

I could definitely see Domi being a good fit

 

[Rare Jewel]

Rather than go after Bertuzzi or Domi, they should go get Garland.

Probably cheaper than Bertuzzi. Better two way impact than both. Also, one of the top penalty drawing players over the past 3 seasons.

Supposedly, they can't give him away.

 

[Mitch nylander]

I would start by saying that I think the Leafs would really go hard after Domi since he is really the only one who can, with any kind of decent chance, fill our 3C and 2PP center hole in UFA; Bertuzzi can't play center, Rodrigues shouldn't be playing center, the rest of the UFA centers are nowhere near good enough or won't come here (Bergeron and Krejci), Keefe didn't have much of an appetite for Jarnkrok at center, Lafferty was bad at center, and if we are putting Holmberg there, then we have some issues.

Then we need one more guy...

Scanning the market, Tomas Nosek, Mason Shaw, and Axel Jonsson-Fjallby are still decent options out there for our shutdown line. Suter, Fischer, ZAR, and Motte are also still out there as well.

Conversely, if we look at offensive winger options, there are guys like Rodrigues and reclamation projects like Yamamoto, Gurianov, and maybe Comtois. Boqvist, Sundqvist, Suter, Ritchie, and Erne just don't do enough for me to prefer them over just putting Reaves there and then double shifting Nylander on that line.

I think it makes more sense to get a shutdown guy. Nosek is solid, and Shaw/AJF have some solid upside (although Shaw has major injury concerns). We need another PKer up front as well, and most of those options are solid enough PKers.

Meanwhile, if we get Domi, we probably do not need to add another PP forward, so we can afford to use Reaves on that line and just double shift Nylander (or Jarnkrok or Marner) at ES to make it all work.

Knies - Matthews - Marner
Jarnkrok - Tavares - Nylander
Robertson - Domi - Reaves/Nylander
Nosek - Kampf - Lafferty

Defensively, who really knows. Keefe is going to have his hands full figuring out how to make that defense work with Klingberg on it. I assume Liljegren is getting a lot more PK responsibilities to make up for Holl leaving? Rielly is also a sneaky good PKer but we do not have any RHD PKers at that point.

Rielly - Barrie did work decently well under Keefe back in 2019-2020, but that puts a lot of pressure on the other pairings to step up in the tough minutes and who knows if they can handle it. Otherwise, are we sheltering a Gio-Klingberg pairing and then having a top 4 of McCabe, Brodie, Rielly, Liljegren? If we trust Liljegren to step up, it could work. There would be issues if we ever wanted to rotate in Timmins for Gio though, because who knows if Timmins is ready for any kind of serious defensive responsibility at this point, and he'd need to handle it.

Rielly - Liljegren
McCabe - Brodie
Giordano - Klingberg
Timmins

PP1: Matthews, Marner, Nylander, Tavares, Rielly
PP2: Domi, Knies, Jarnkrok, Robertson, Klingberg
PK Forwards: Kampf, Marner, Lafferty, Jarnkrok, Nosek, Robertson/Knies
PK Defensemen: McCabe, Giordano, Brodie, Liljegren, Rielly (#5).

I think we sacrificed a lot of flexibility and overall effectiveness just for a little bit more offense from the back end (unless Klingberg really explodes) and an enforcer who can't play more than 8 minutes a night anymore.

We're pretty well on the same page.

My picks would be Max Domi for bottom 6 scoring along with Max comtois. Both could bring more scoring along with some feistiness. Then I'd bring in Mason Shaw for the energy and tenacity as the 13th forward.

 

[Bloomberg]

If I’m the Leafs I’m not trading Knies. End of story.

I definitely understand the sentiment. Knies might be one of those rare power forwards that every team would want. It's also why he would get a high return and get us the D prospects we need. I don't think the Leafs will move him either (it might not be the right move), but I would think Arionza would pay a premium for him and get him and build around him and Cooley.

 

[Torontonian]

Free agent quality aside, when Ontario-born ROR would rather play for a rebuilding team than take the same term to come back here...that strikes me as an issue.

Failing to convince Ontario-born Duchene to come here (or not pursuing him at all?) is an issue.

Hathaway and Accari were also signed to very reasonable deals for worse teams. Us failing to get in on them is the issue.


When Shanahan came here he said that Ontario guys would come here at a discount. For a while that proved semi-true. Now we can't even sign them at par value.

Few issues with your comments;

1) Not everyone like Duchane and other Ontario born players want to come here, that’s just how it is, feels like we have been sold on this “Ontario born dream” where everyone from Ontario or the GTA wants to play for the Leafs. In Duchane case, he was suddenly bought out and signed with a team that’s close to Nashville.

2) Hathaway at 2.4m is an overpayment still, 4th line player making that much hurts regardless.

 

[TMLAM34]

Still hoping for Fischer. He would do well next to Jarnkrok and Kampf on a shutdown line.

Jarnkrok - Kampf - Fischer

Domi wouldn’t be bad for the wing in the top six.

 

[OVO16]

Still hoping for Fischer. He would do well next to Jarnkrok and Kampf on a shutdown line.

Jarnkrok - Kampf - Fischer

Domi wouldn’t be bad for the wing in the top six.

Signed with Detroit

 

[Gabriel426]

We should be wary though, there is a trade that's just waiting to be done and then we can hopefully breathing a bit easier.

Do you really trust our MGT to make good trade after overpaying for 4th liner and unwanted player?
Most likely they will overpaid in trade too.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

We're pretty well on the same page.

My picks would be Max Domi for bottom 6 scoring along with Max comtois. Both could bring more scoring along with some feistiness. Then I'd bring in Mason Shaw for the energy and tenacity as the 13th forward.

I think Comtois will get too much money for us. Even Domi is a tight squeeze unless we dump Murray or Samsonov comes a lot cheaper than expected. Shaw would come in sub-1 mill and would be able to get a legit shot in a top 12. I think that could include here.

 

[TMLAM34]

Signed with Detroit

Of course he did lol

 

[SeaOfBlue]

Still hoping for Fischer. He would do well next to Jarnkrok and Kampf on a shutdown line.

Jarnkrok - Kampf - Fischer

Domi wouldn’t be bad for the wing in the top six.

Fischer is not great TBH. There are better options.

 

[Dreakmur]

If I’m the Leafs I’m not trading Knies. End of story.

Good thing Shanahan blocked Dubas from doing that!

 

[Dekes For Days]

Good thing Shanahan blocked Dubas from doing that!

Except he didn't.

 

[Mitch nylander]

I think Comtois will get too much money for us. Even Domi is a tight squeeze unless we dump Murray or Samsonov comes a lot cheaper than expected. Shaw would come in sub-1 mill and would be able to get a legit shot in a top 12. I think that could include here.

I see Comtois getting a contract similar to Mcleod's deal 1.4, we can squeeze it. Domi will be tough, but Murray dump is ineviteble.

As for Shaw, I just l love the energy he brings despite his size.