Confirmed Trade: [MTL/NSH] PK Subban for Shea Weber - Pt. 2
- Thread starter SniperHF
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Reverie
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- Oct 21, 2014
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I don't think the "but Weber is on team Canada and Subban isn't" part is very legit.
By that logic Marc-Edouard Vlasic is better than Subban.
Ducks in a row
Go Ducks Quack Quack
PavelBrendl
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- Jul 9, 2013
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Man, I'm going to miss Subban. I'll miss the rushes, charisma and showmanship he brings, but I definitely won't miss the diving, slewfooting and other bone-headed plays.
Even though I don't like the trade at face value, I think Weber will be good for the Habs. He might not be in his prime anymore, but he's a still a top defenceman in the league, a leader and big SOB with a mean streak and a cannon shot. I'm shocked, but probably not as outraged as some Habs fans.
Even though I don't like the trade at face value, I think Weber will be good for the Habs. He might not be in his prime anymore, but he's a still a top defenceman in the league, a leader and big SOB with a mean streak and a cannon shot. I'm shocked, but probably not as outraged as some Habs fans.
It does, hence Subban winning one to Weber's none. That honestly might be the worst argument I've ever seen in HFB.
love those stats ... you can use them however you want ...
how about ... blocked shots? power play goals? hits? turnovers?
GardinerExpressway
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StittsvilleJames
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The best part of this trade is clearly that us Sens fans can now admit that PK is pretty good, but now we have to admit also that Weber has always been overrated.
On a serious note, I don't like facing Weber so much more each season for the next few years, but on the bright side we won't have to deal with PK vs EK thing 6 time a year for the next decade.
On a serious note, I don't like facing Weber so much more each season for the next few years, but on the bright side we won't have to deal with PK vs EK thing 6 time a year for the next decade.
heres your block shot sir.love those stats ... you can use them however you want ...
how about ... blocked shots? power play goals? hits? turnovers?
PK won half a Norris, he's a good to great defenseman and so is Weber, the problems will come up later if Weber start failing early when he still has the bulk of those 10 years to make up, or if PK goes into Nashville and becomes a perfect teammate while still having plenty of prime years ahead of him.
I wonder if this move was pushed by PK due to all the rumored at the draft. MB should have come out and had his players back much more then he did, not some comment about people calling so he has to listen, but an emphatic "PK is Montreal's #1 defenseman now and in the future, we will not be trading him I don't care how many people ask." Subban seems like the type of player who needs to know his team will be behind him 100% and any small amount of doubt could quickly sour that relationship. I'm just glad he won't be in the East anymore, the guy may have been a problem for some, but he definitely is the guy you want on the ice in the last 2 mins, whether playing down or with a lead, and that's just invaluable.
NobleSix
High Tech Low-Life.
Yep. Subban wasn't liked by the team's captain, a contingent of other players on the team, and the coach. He clashed with Therrien and Bergevin in the media many times throughout the year, and seemed to be more concerned with building his brand and being a philanthropist rather than a team player. Obviously MB and the Canadiens didn't like this. It was clear that he was going to be traded around the end of the season, at least for me. Tony Marinaro was alluding to it for months, and he has tons of sources in Montreal and within the Org/Alumni.
Don't believe anything Bergevin says. He is a notorious... "bender of the truth". He was looking to move Subban for months. This trade has NOTHING to do with on ice stuff. PK was traded because he wasn't liked due to his personality.
The Habs traded an amazing player regardless of off ice issues.
JS19
Legends Never Die
Still baffling why Bergevin even decided to trade him. Subban has more prime years in the tank compared to Weber, who's now approaching the other side of 30. The only conclusion I can come to is that Bergevin disliked that Subban was a charismatic figure who became the face of the franchise. I don't buy that nonsense about him being a cancer, it's typical of French media to paint the black guy as the **** disturber.
Poile should be charged with highway robbery. He got prime years out of Weber, and traded him for a much younger asset. Huge deal by Bergevin, and dumb deal by Bergevin.
Poile should be charged with highway robbery. He got prime years out of Weber, and traded him for a much younger asset. Huge deal by Bergevin, and dumb deal by Bergevin.
Intangir
Registered User
I've always really liked Weber's game and believe he's been the single most consistent d-man in the league for the last five years slightly ahead of Duncan Keith, which is a huge plus for him. Weber has unfortunately never won any hardware as a defenseman, but in terms of abilities on the ice, despite being a vastly different player than Subban and having different strengths, I believe they are both of roughly equal quality.
I also believe that, as of now, with the makeup of our team as it is, Weber's more defense-oriented game MIGHT be a better fit considering our emphasis on team-defense and dump-and-chase philosophy.
Staying as objective as possible, I can reasonably fathom Weber having a bigger positive impact on our team for the next 4 to 5 years if he doesn't regress, which might have been our GM's aim in this trade (as well as accomodating Subban's wishes maybe).
My only immediate concern with Weber pertains to how / if he will embrace the city and our team and play up to his own very high standard. I worry a bit about how he might react to having been traded to our hockey-mad, rabid, media-driven pressure-cooker of a city. Nevertheless, with what I've seen of him on the ice and in his interviews as well as from the professionalism he seems to exude, he should fine.
HOWEVER, trading a guy of Subban's stature, a true franchise defenseman, for an older guy is really, really, really not the smart thing to do in spite of a potential better fit. In Subban's case, I can reasonably see another 8-10 years of very high-level play while in Weber's case I believe it is closer to 5 or 6, making for a difference of about 4 years.
Let's face it, as far as top-level franchise defensemen go, the single most important thing teams should keep in mind is their age and the time they've got left to play as their impact on the ice is so great and far-ranging that their very presence opens or closes a cup window (just ask Edmonton fans about the importance of top-end defensemen).
As such, that aforementioned difference in projected longevity makes this trade very bad for the Canadiens, even with a possible better fit of Weber on our team.
Anyways, good or bad, I accept reality and make peace with this trade which brought a defensive stud into our lineup at the expense of another. In the end, I look to next season with an open heart ready to welcome Weber into the fold and, like with Subban, cheer for him and the team like mad.
I also believe that, as of now, with the makeup of our team as it is, Weber's more defense-oriented game MIGHT be a better fit considering our emphasis on team-defense and dump-and-chase philosophy.
Staying as objective as possible, I can reasonably fathom Weber having a bigger positive impact on our team for the next 4 to 5 years if he doesn't regress, which might have been our GM's aim in this trade (as well as accomodating Subban's wishes maybe).
My only immediate concern with Weber pertains to how / if he will embrace the city and our team and play up to his own very high standard. I worry a bit about how he might react to having been traded to our hockey-mad, rabid, media-driven pressure-cooker of a city. Nevertheless, with what I've seen of him on the ice and in his interviews as well as from the professionalism he seems to exude, he should fine.
HOWEVER, trading a guy of Subban's stature, a true franchise defenseman, for an older guy is really, really, really not the smart thing to do in spite of a potential better fit. In Subban's case, I can reasonably see another 8-10 years of very high-level play while in Weber's case I believe it is closer to 5 or 6, making for a difference of about 4 years.
Let's face it, as far as top-level franchise defensemen go, the single most important thing teams should keep in mind is their age and the time they've got left to play as their impact on the ice is so great and far-ranging that their very presence opens or closes a cup window (just ask Edmonton fans about the importance of top-end defensemen).
As such, that aforementioned difference in projected longevity makes this trade very bad for the Canadiens, even with a possible better fit of Weber on our team.
Anyways, good or bad, I accept reality and make peace with this trade which brought a defensive stud into our lineup at the expense of another. In the end, I look to next season with an open heart ready to welcome Weber into the fold and, like with Subban, cheer for him and the team like mad.
FROMSHORETOCHARA
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- Jul 2, 2009
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what a lot of people on this board tend to forget is that this is the type deal that needed to be cleared with the owner (Geoff Molson) so quit saying it was called by Bergevin alone ... evidently PK was a cancer in the locker room
SanDogBrewin
Righteous bucks!
Sorry if this has already been mentioned already but that re-capture for Nashville if Weber retires early. Huge of Weber's but that contract and I am not sorry Subban is out of the Eastern Conference.
JS19
Legends Never Die
To be fair, Nashville didn't construct that contract. It was the Flyers GM Holmgren who offer-sheeted.
Shea Weber is not chop liver. I think Hab fans have a tendency to over-evaluate their players, like most markets do. Most general managers do not think Subban is a top 15 defenceman in the league and they would take Weber over him. Ask Babcock who he prefers. Subban is great, don't get me wrong, but Shea Weber is nothing to sneeze at and will mentor all the upcoming D for years to come. Right now, the Habs are better with Weber than Subban. But, they must absolutely win the cup in the next two years before Price's contract is up or this might come back to haunt them....
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