MrB1P's top 50 affiliated prospects. Edition 2019-2020.

[Mrb1p]

I mean don't get me wrong I don't see it as a big deal just got individually amused by that specific part of your quote. I think most people understand full well that Hughes is a better prospect than Zegras, at least for now (while unlikely in this case, there's plenty of examples of players picked lower in the first round becoming better than the guy who went first)

But this post does make me beg the question, what rankings were putting Zegras in the 15-20 range? This aggregate ranking had him 5th
We looked at 14 sources to come up with EOTP’s Consensus NHL Draft Rankings


I still think we have a critical difference in interpretation with respect to Glass. In that I wouldn't say Glass enjoys challenging players "a lot" more so that he enjoys challenging on the forecheck and around the boards when he feels the situation is best suited for it. It's hard to describe without specific video evidence of what I mean but the kid always thinks about the totality of the ice whenever he does anything. So where other players will aggressively press any time their legs can get them to a player on the puck or to an open offensive lane, Glass seems to take into account what might happen if he fails to execute on a defensive challenge or if he goes to open ice that is still a difficult area for his teammates to feed him the puck. This results in a lot of time spent roving around and scanning the entire ice surface.....really the only way I can describe it and he's the only player I've used this analogy for is that it's like he's a tiger positioned to pounce when the opportunity is right. When he feels it's the right time he does some tremendous things on and off the puck but he seems hesitant, in my view, to go beyond that cautious and calculated style of play and do exactly what you described: "push the play and challenge opposing players a lot"

Maybe I've just had the bad luck of every time I've gotten to watch him play he's been more reserved than usual but I'd estimate I've watched around 30 of his games now between the WHL, WJC, Vegas training camp, and AHL and it's always been like that. He's cerebral almost to a fault. Almost, if he wasn't so talented at what he does when he actually engages, it might be a problem but for him it isn't. It's just a hinderance to what I feel could make him an even more impactful player. The only times I ever really get the sense that Cody is being more assertive than not from the start of his shift to the end is when he's on the powerplay. In those situations he's far more active all around the offensive zone and hounds the puck relentlessly when it clears the zone.

And maybe I haven't seen enough of Zegras but I really didn't get the sense that he wasn't engaged enough. In fact, I'd go as far as to say that from what I have seen from Zegras compared to Glass at the same age, Trevor is more willing to at least attempt to use his speed and stick handling to try to work his way through traffic while generally looking for the best passing lane to set up a play for his teammates. Comparing both players at the same age I actually see more hustle in Zegras' game. And his passing, in my opinion, is only slightly below Glass' (and I consider Glass to have better passing now than many if not most players in the NHL. Where Zegras does better with lead passes, Glass can laser a tape to tape pass even at times where a pass seems all but impossible like few other players I've seen).

In terms of playmaking Zegras has a great deal of talent and I feel, if I were to do my own ranking I would have him firmly in the top 30 if not the top 20. Where you seem to have concerns with his engagement in the play, my only real concern with him is that his dazzling skills may have trouble translating at the NHL level but I'm not overly worried about that. I'm expecting him to develop well at BU.

I meant over the year, in contrast to Hughes having been #1 for quite a while.

As for Glass, I think were saying a bit of the same thing. Its hard to describe, but what you are saying is true. The best way I can explain it is that he "picks apart" defenses, yes with skills, but mostly with his insane spacial awarness and vision. Bobby Brink is another guy that does this. Just the way they use their stick angle, their position, tiny shifts in pace or in their skating angle, looking in another direction, etc, then pouncing when the time is right and every thing. I didn't mean that he plays a similar game to a guy like Gallagher or Domi.

It may be a language barrier thing, but even in french I cannot explain it with a few words, so probably not .

 

[Mrb1p]

Also keep in mind Marner was 18. Suzuki was 19, and his regular season numbers really haven't dramatically changed, yet he's gotten a dramatic boost in this years rankings, despite his numbers age-adjusted being worse than they were in his draft year.

Meh, the age difference really is negligible. Suzuki is still 19 for almost a full month, hes really just that young.

Dare I raise the teammate card too ? I mean, Tkachuk, Dvorak, Mete, Jones, Juolevi, Pu... A bit more talent than Ratcliffe, Durzi and Samurokov, but yeah, he did play 6 less games or something for two more points.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Another one out of the park

 

[HanSolo]

I meant over the year, in contrast to Hughes having been #1 for quite a while.

As for Glass, I think were saying a bit of the same thing. Its hard to describe, but what you are saying is true. The best way I can explain it is that he "picks apart" defenses, yes with skills, but mostly with his insane spacial awarness and vision. Bobby Brink is another guy that does this. Just the way they use their stick angle, their position, tiny shifts in pace or in their skating angle, looking in another direction, etc, then pouncing when the time is right and every thing. I didn't mean that he plays a similar game to a guy like Gallagher or Domi.

It may be a language barrier thing, but even in french I cannot explain it with a few words, so probably not .

Nah I think we're closer to the same page this time.

I mean time will tell how close Zegras will actually be to that quality. It's my impression that in spite of a few differences they're quite similar. Part of how that unfolds is gonna depend on how the BU coaching staff develops Zegras.

Also it's worth mentioning that the whole time I've been making this comparison I've been comparing Zegras to an 18 year old Glass. If we're talking where both guys are today, it's not particularly close.

 

[Mrb1p]

Another one out of the park

Nice, you mean another home-run ? Thats great.

 

[Mrb1p]

Nah I think we're closer to the same page this time.

I mean time will tell how close Zegras will actually be to that quality. It's my impression that in spite of a few differences they're quite similar. Part of how that unfolds is gonna depend on how the BU coaching staff develops Zegras.

Also it's worth mentioning that the whole tike I've been making this comparison I've been comparing Zegras to an 18 year old Glass. If we're talking where both guys are today, it's not particularly close.

Obviously, and I do acknowledge that Zegras is one of the best playmaking prospect, he really has a talent there, and I think that is part of the reason why some would say he plays similar to Hughes, even though I think thats sacrilegious. I just think he has areas he needs to work on to be more than a complimentary piece that thrives on the powerplay in the NHL. He's going to have a lot of talent to work with again with Wise and Mastrosimone, it will be fun to see how well he does.

 

[93LEAFS]

Meh, the age difference really is negligible. Suzuki is still 19 for almost a full month, hes really just that young.

Dare I raise the teammate card too ? I mean, Tkachuk, Dvorak, Mete, Jones, Juolevi, Pu... A bit more talent than Ratcliffe, Durzi and Samurokov, but yeah, he did play 6 less games or something for two more points.

Marner is born in May, it is a sizable difference and CHL experience, or let's forget Marner also put up 2ppg the year previous as a 17-year-old in the regular season and in the playoffs. Their CHL numbers aren't comparable, and Suzuki's production outside of the playoffs really didn't dramatically change over the years. Or the fact Marner put up 14 points in 5 MC games to Suzuki's 7 in 4? I mean, at the same age, Marner put up 61 in the NHL. Suzuki and Marner don't belong in the same sentence.

 

[Isaac Nootin]

Welp, you got me there. I still think there's some difference between the whole hockey world having Hughes at one and Zegras hovering around 7-20 though

Did OP ever address his claims of Zegras being ranked 7th-20th pre draft? Or was that just glossed over as well?

 

[Mrb1p]

Marner is born in May, it is a sizable difference and CHL experience, or let's forget Marner also put up 2ppg the year previous as a 17-year-old in the regular season and in the playoffs. Their CHL numbers aren't comparable, and Suzuki's production outside of the playoffs really didn't dramatically change over the years. Or the fact Marner put up 14 points in 5 MC games to Suzuki's 7 in 4? I mean, at the same age, Marner put up 61 in the NHL. Suzuki and Marner don't belong in the same sentence.

Yeah Im not comparing Suzuki and Marner at all.

 

[Mrb1p]

Did OP ever address his claims of Zegras being ranked 7th-20th pre draft? Or was that just glossed over as well?

You'll have to read through a few posts but its there, come on, its a good exercise for you.

 

[Isaac Nootin]

You'll have to read through a few posts but its there, come on, its a good exercise for you.

You didn't explain anything. You simply used your usual bag of excuses "well what I meant was" "maybe I didn't explain myself correctly" then completely gloss over the topic. If you took any accountability for your mistakes you'd be much further ahead here. It would be a good exercise for you.

I'd like to see these rankings of Zegras at 20. Thanks.

 

[Mrb1p]

You didn't explain anything. You simply used your usual bag of excuses "well what I meant was" "maybe I didn't explain myself correctly" then completely gloss over the topic. If you took any accountability for your mistakes you'd be much further ahead here. It would be a good exercise for you.

I'd like to see these rankings of Zegras at 20. Thanks.

Man, you really paint me as an evil person . What if its really what I meant ? The problem here is that I didn't spell out "He was ranked 5-20 over the calendar year."?

Have you realized I didn't type out "He was ranked 5-20 on the final rankings." ?

 

[93LEAFS]

Yeah Im not comparing Suzuki and Marner at all.

Well, you were saying his production was comparable when you look at everything factored in, its worlds apart. Especially when you factor in the 14 points in 5 games at the MC to 7 in 4. I mean, age-adjusted numbers-wise factoring Regular season, weighted playoffs, Memorial Cup, and U-20 WJC, here is how they stack up. I'll add Strome and DeBrincat too because you also pointed to them.

Mitch Marner:
D-1: 1.24
D: 2.24
D+1: 2.04
D+2: NHL

Nick Suzuki
D-1: 0.80
D: 1.65
D+1: 1.39
D+2: 1.23

Dylan Strome
D-1: 0.88
D: 1.89
D+1: 1.71
D+2: 1.41

Alex Debrincat
D-1: 1.79
D: 1.70
D+1: 1.75

I just find it surprising your willing to bump Suzuki significantly from last year just based off the playoffs (he was 31 last year, and is now 20). You had Suzuki pass guys like Kravtsov, Zadina, and Kaprizov (where I don't see that strong a case in any example). If you weighted the playoffs as heavily as you did with Suzuki with other prospects, I would think someone like Rasmussen last year probably should have been at the very least in your top 50.

 

[Isaac Nootin]

You didn't explain anything. You simply used your usual bag of excuses "well what I meant was" "maybe I didn't explain myself correctly" then completely gloss over the topic. If you took any accountability for your mistakes you'd be much further ahead here. It would be a good exercise for you.

I'd like to see these rankings of Zegras at 20. Thanks.

Man, you really paint me as an evil person . What if its really what I meant ? The problem here is that I didn't spell out "He was ranked 5-20 over the calendar year."?

Have you realized I didn't type out "He was ranked 5-20 on the final rankings." ?

Case in point. Thanks.

 

[Isaac Nootin]

Well, you were saying his production was comparable when you look at everything factored in, its worlds apart.

Well, what he meant was....

 

[Mrb1p]

Well, you were saying his production was comparable when you look at everything factored in, its worlds apart. Especially when you factor in the 14 points in 5 games at the MC to 7 in 4. I mean, age-adjusted numbers-wise factoring Regular season, weighted playoffs, Memorial Cup, and U-20 WJC, here is how they stack up. I'll add Strome and DeBrincat too because you also pointed to them.

Mitch Marner:
D-1: 1.24
D: 2.24
D+1: 2.04
D+2: NHL

Nick Suzuki
D-1: 0.80
D: 1.65
D+1: 1.39
D+2: 1.23

Dylan Strome
D-1: 0.88
D: 1.89
D+1: 1.71
D+2: 1.41

Alex Debrincat
D-1: 1.79
D: 1.70
D+1: 1.75

I just find it surprising your willing to bump Suzuki significantly from last year just based off the playoffs (he was 31 last year, and is now 20). You had Suzuki pass guys like Kravtsov, Zadina, and Kaprizov (where I don't see that strong a case in any example). If you weighted the playoffs as heavily as you did with Suzuki with other prospects, I would think someone like Rasmussen last year probably should have been at the very least in your top 50.

Man, that sentence.

Okay, a few things, first you're completely ignoring QOT, you're completely ignoring the massive difference in production from OS to Guelph and you're making it look like Suzuki is in his 20 year old season, meanwhile he was 19 all the way, which is essentially most players D+1 season. Secondly, Kravtsov is ranked 5 spots ahead of Suzuki and in my opinion, Kaprizov and Zadina have both lost some value. Lastly, ranking prospects is fluid, theres abunch of parameters that run in each other that you have to deal with to actually come to a conclusion, some overlap happen.

 

[Mrb1p]

Well, what he meant was....

No, you got it wrong...

It's: "Well, you didn't specifically type it out so I'm going to try and make you look bad by putting the worse of the two options in your words."

 

[93LEAFS]

Man, that sentence.

Okay, a few things, first you're completely ignoring QOT, you're completely ignoring the massive difference in production from OS to Guelph and you're making it look like Suzuki is in his 20 year old season, meanwhile he was 19 all the way, which is essentially most players D+1 season. Secondly, Kravtsov is ranked 5 spots ahead of Suzuki and in my opinion, Kaprizov and Zadina have both lost some value. Lastly, ranking prospects is fluid, theres abunch of parameters that run in each other that you have to deal with to actually come to a conclusion, some overlap happen.

His production in the regular season between the two teams was a minor difference. We are talking about a difference of 1.5 per game to 1.69. A 19-year-old in the OHL shouldn't be dependent on the quality of teammates. Marner put up great numbers without Tkachuk the year before having Ryan Rupert on his wing. You seem to have gotten significantly higher on Suzuki since he was the main piece of the trade for Pacioretty. Similar to how you were overly high on Mete and Juulsen last year.

I'm not making him look like he's 20. I'm using his actual age. Guess what, he was a pretty much a full season ahead of Marner, who you tried to use as a comparable a couple pages back. Their production is in no way comparable, no matter how much you want to argue about line-mates. Strome and Debrincat's production was elite with McDavid, and then was elite again without him.

You point heavily to the playoffs for why Suzuki's stock has dramatically improved in your reason. But, it seems like the boosting of a guy your team got, because really not much has changed in the last 3 years regarding where he ranks out as a prospect.

 

[Mrb1p]

His production in the regular season between the two teams was a minor difference. We are talking about a difference of 1.5 per game to 1.69. A 19-year-old in the OHL shouldn't be dependent on the quality of teammates. Marner put up great numbers without Tkachuk the year before having Ryan Rupert on his wing. You seem to have gotten significantly higher on Suzuki since he was the main piece of the trade for Pacioretty. Similar to how you were overly high on Mete and Juulsen last year.

I'm not making him look like he's 20. I'm using his actual age. Guess what, he was a pretty much a full season ahead of Marner, who you tried to use as a comparable a couple pages back. Their production is in no way comparable, no matter how much you want to argue about line-mates. Strome and Debrincat's production was elite with McDavid, and then was elite again without him.

You point heavily to the playoffs for why Suzuki's stock has dramatically improved in your reason. But, it seems like the boosting of a guy your team got, because really not much has changed in the last 3 years regarding where he ranks out as a prospect.

I can't take that last sentence seriously. Literally everything changed with that playoffs run for Suzuki. He proved he was to be absolutely dominant on the ice, something he had never done before.

Also, are you suggesting 1.5 isn't great because thats some bollocks.

 

[93LEAFS]

I can't take that last sentence seriously. Literally everything changed with that playoffs run for Suzuki. He proved he was to be absolutely dominant on the ice, something he had never done before.

Also, are you suggesting 1.5 isn't great because thats some bollocks.

When you examine his production relative to his age, yes, its not a dramatic change. He's in the oldest cohort outside of overagers. As a first round pick still in the OHL at 19, he should be one of the most dominant players on the ice every night. You didn't give Rasmussen the same benefit of the doubt last year, and he had a better playoffs than Suzuki. The playoffs absolutely doesn't change everything. If it
did, Rasmussen would have been a top 50 guy last year.

In retrospect, don't you think you may have been overly generous to Habs prospects last year, and may be doing the same again this year? Whether it is a conscious bias or not.

 

[Mrb1p]

When you examine his production relative to his age, yes, its not a dramatic change. He's in the oldest cohort outside of overagers. As a first round pick still in the OHL at 19, he should be one of the most dominant players on the ice every night. You didn't give Rasmussen the same benefit of the doubt last year, and he had a better playoffs than Suzuki. The playoffs absolutely doesn't change everything. If it
did, Rasmussen would have been a top 50 guy last year.

In retrospect, don't you think you may have been overly generous to Habs prospects last year, and may be doing the same again this year? Whether it is a conscious bias or not.

He had better playoffs as in he put up a better PPG ? Then can we say Suzuki was really close to Marner because he only had two less points Thats a lot of moving the goalposts. Anyway, I'll be honest, unlike a lot of the debating that has been done around here and tell you that I don't think Rasmussen looked even half as good as Suzuki in the POs last year when compared to Suzuki this year.

Otherwise, don't you think you may be a bit overly strict with Habs prospects ?

Plus, both Juulsen and Mete played really good in the top four, as I expected, Kotkaniemi made the NHL at 18 and posted thrirty points with good defensive numbers and Poehling just had a great year too, so I wasn't exactly wrong. When you look back at the list, of the players ranked behind the different Habs prospect, not much would be ranked ahead as of today. Kotkaniemi completely surpassed anyone behind him, and even a few above him (Mittlestatd, Kaprizov, Tolvanen, Boqvist, Necas, Makar?.) Ryan Poehling has Hague and maybe Hronek who surpassed him ? So was I wrong there ? Behind Juulsen and Mete, aside from Hronek and Hague, obviously, and I could add in Hayton, Cholowski, Brook and the 2019 picks. So, where was I wrong in my rankings of Habs prospect, exactly? I already stated I was wrong on Pettersson, Mittlestatd, and Necas plus, I would add in that Kravtsov and Kravtsov were too low, and funny enough Vitali's ranking wasn't disputed at all, if I recall correctly. A few were ranked too high, IMO, Berggren, Tippett, Sprong, Andersson and Donato. Vilardi and Timmins too, I guess, but those were injuries that I could not predict.

So, maybe, just maybe, the Habs have great prospects? Who knows though, really, it makes no sense that a team with 10 top 60 picks in the last three draft has good prospects, right ?

 

[93LEAFS]

He had better playoffs as in he put up a better PPG ? Then can we say Suzuki was really close to Marner because he only had two less points Thats a lot of moving the goalposts. Anyway, I'll be honest, unlike a lot of the debating that has been done around here and tell you that I don't think Rasmussen looked even half as good as Suzuki in the POs last year when compared to Suzuki this year.

Otherwise, don't you think you may be a bit overly strict with Habs prospects ?

Plus, both Juulsen and Mete played really good in the top four, as I expected, Kotkaniemi made the NHL at 18 and posted thrirty points with good defensive numbers and Poehling just had a great year too, so I wasn't exactly wrong. When you look back at the list, of the players ranked behind the different Habs prospect, not much would be ranked ahead as of today. Kotkaniemi completely surpassed anyone behind him, and even a few above him (Mittlestatd, Kaprizov, Tolvanen, Boqvist, Necas, Makar?.) Ryan Poehling has Hague and maybe Hronek who surpassed him ? So was I wrong there ? Behind Juulsen and Mete, aside from Hronek and Hague, obviously, and I could add in Hayton, Cholowski, Brook and the 2019 picks. So, where was I wrong in my rankings of Habs prospect, exactly? I already stated I was wrong on Pettersson, Mittlestatd, and Necas plus, I would add in that Kravtsov and Kravtsov were too low, and funny enough Vitali's ranking wasn't disputed at all, if I recall correctly. A few were ranked too high, IMO, Berggren, Tippett, Sprong, Andersson and Donato. Vilardi and Timmins too, I guess, but those were injuries that I could not predict.

So, maybe, just maybe, the Habs have great prospects? Who knows though, really, it makes no sense that a team with 10 top 60 picks in the last three draft has good prospects, right ?

You dramatically overrated Mete and Juulsen. Saying they both had top pairing potential while Dermott didn't. Dermott dramatically outplayed both in the NHL last year. Now, I'm not saying Dermott will be a top pairing D-man, but he has been better than both, and probably should be viewed as the better player going forward. Neither were worthy of being top 50 last year, and neither is a year later given retrospect. Mete hasn't scored a goal in two full NHL seasons. He hasn't looked like a good top 4 d-man at all. He has bad point production and bad possession numbers. The only thing that bails him out is he has Price behind him. I won't be too harsh on Juulsen due to the injury, but I will say Dermott dramatically outplayed him.

Kotkaniemi dramatically surpassed everyone behind him? Tkachuk played at the same level as him if not better. Kotkaniemi you were right about, I'll give you that. But, some of the others are very generous, like you are again this year.

It seems almost everyone in this thread seems to think you are being overly generous with Habs prospects, and were last year. Poehling had one great NHL game, and a pretty good season. I don't see his stock being dramatically different.

Suzuki had a great playoffs, but it still really doesn't change much from what we saw the 2 and half years prior. He didn't stand out at the WJC either. And again, you use the Marner comparable. How about the fact Marner's MC cup blew his out the water. If you include the Memorial Cup numbers Marner had 58 points in 22 games, Suzuki had 49 in 28. I don't see that as particularly close. Marner was also a year younger. You are talking of a ppg of 2.64 to a ppg of 1.75. That's almost a full point per game. You really think there post-season performances are in the same league?

 

[Mrb1p]

You dramatically overrated Mete and Juulsen. Saying they both had top pairing potential while Dermott didn't. Dermott dramatically outplayed both in the NHL last year. Now, I'm not saying Dermott will be a top pairing D-man, but he has been better than both, and probably should be viewed as the better player going forward. Neither were worthy of being top 50 last year, and neither is a year later given retrospect. Mete hasn't scored a goal in two full NHL seasons. He hasn't looked like a good top 4 d-man at all. He has bad point production and bad possession numbers. The only thing that bails him out is he has Price behind him. I won't be too harsh on Juulsen due to the injury, but I will say Dermott dramatically outplayed him.

Kotkaniemi dramatically surpassed everyone behind him? Tkachuk played at the same level as him if not better. Kotkaniemi you were right about, I'll give you that. But, some of the others are very generous, like you are again this year.

It seems almost everyone in this thread seems to think you are being overly generous with Habs prospects, and were last year. Poehling had one great NHL game, and a pretty good season. I don't see his stock being dramatically different.

Suzuki had a great playoffs, but it still really doesn't change much from what we saw the 2 and half years prior. He didn't stand out at the WJC either. And again, you use the Marner comparable. How about the fact Marner's MC cup blew his out the water. If you include the Memorial Cup numbers Marner had 58 points in 22 games, Suzuki had 49 in 28. I don't see that as particularly close. Marner was also a year younger. You are talking of a ppg of 2.64 to a ppg of 1.75. That's almost a full point per game. You really think there post-season performances are in the same league?

We don't have the same definiton of dramatically outplayed. I think they were pretty much all top 4 Dman when they played, which was pretty much in line with the ranking. The fact that you say that Mete hasn't looked good tells me more about your knowledge of Habs players than anything. Mete and Weber went through a stretch of 20 game

Heres a direct coach form Julien, not that his opinion is legion, but still: “He skates so well, not only does he kill plays but he also steals pucks and he’s gone up the ice,” Julien said. “So I’ve liked his game, he’s been pretty good.

Looking at his point production is funny, because he's not an offensive Dman, he's never been. He's a transition player that breaks up plays in his zone and brings them the other way, and he does that effectively. At one point, for a stretch of like 25 games, he had been on the ice for about 4 goals for when compared to one given, all that, while playing the 2nd most ES minutes, even ahead of Weber. This is how misinformed you are, my friend. This is how ridiculous your opinion is at this moment.

And you keep saying Suzuki's playoffs don't change anything and that its the same we saw from the 2 and a half year prior ? I hate doing this, I really hate it, but do you actually watch hockey or does the hockey you watch happen on a laptop screen with a lot of numbers on it ? Because your opinion is CLEARLY stats driven.

 

[93LEAFS]

We don't have the same definiton of dramatically outplayed. I think they were pretty much all top 4 Dman when they played, which was pretty much in line with the ranking. The fact that you say that Mete hasn't looked good tells me more about your knowledge of Habs players than anything. Mete and Weber went through a stretch of 20 game

Heres a direct coach form Julien, not that his opinion is legion, but still: “He skates so well, not only does he kill plays but he also steals pucks and he’s gone up the ice,” Julien said. “So I’ve liked his game, he’s been pretty good.

Looking at his point production is funny, because he's not an offensive Dman, he's never been. He's a transition player that breaks up plays in his zone and brings them the other way, and he does that effectively. At one point, for a stretch of like 25 games, he had been on the ice for about 4 goals for when compared to one given, all that, while playing the 2nd most ES minutes, even ahead of Weber. This is how misinformed you are, my friend. This is how ridiculous your opinion is at this moment.

And you keep saying Suzuki's playoffs don't change anything and that its the same we saw from the 2 and a half year prior ? I hate doing this, I really hate it, but do you actually watch hockey or does the hockey you watch happen on a laptop screen with a lot of numbers on it ? Because your opinion is CLEARLY stats driven.

I've probably watched more Suzuki than you over the past 3 years than you have. Talked to more informed people who actually scout the OHL as a profession etc. So, don't try to say my opinion is stats driven. I just used quantifiable evidence to support my case. You want to belittle my opinion by saying its stats driven. Your opinion is clearly driven by who the Habs have the rights too. You seem to think you know more than everyone here, and seem to think no one else watches these players. Guess what, no, dominating the OHL playoffs in your last OHL playoffs doesn't dramatically change things. The only reason you heavily weight it is because his prospect rights are now owned by MTL and not Vegas. I actually watch Hockey and follow prospects. Age-related factors need to be accounted for. You seem to just say, well its the same as someone doing it a year younger. All evidence shows that isn't true. You continually try to compare Marner's 18-year-old numbers to Suzuki's 19-year-old numbers.

Mete isn't a top 4 d-man, he may be used as one, but nothing really supports the case. His doesn't produce points, he isn't a good possession player, and outside of his skating, he doesn't do anything particularly well. Dermott dramatically outplayed him this year. Its not even close. Now, Dermott has a year and a half on him. Cody Ceci got the most 2nd ES minutes on the Senators last year? Does that make him a good player? Zaitsev and Hainsey got the 2nd and 3rd most on the Leafs? Does that make them good players? Mete's gf% ratio is good over that stretch because Price played lights out, not because of Mete. He was just lucky to have goaltending that stopped 94.1% of shots right behind him. So, he isn't good possessionally and doesn't produce points.

 

[abo9]

I'm only stats watching but I'm surprised by Vesalainen being 16th? He seems to have done pretty good for a 19-20years old in the KHL but not amazing in the AHL?

Also I see everyone tagging Frost as a very very good prospect, but he's 21 ranks lower than Suzuki? I don't want to join the club of Suzuki haters but from the stats I'd rank them similar, is there something concerning or different in Frost's style that you don't like? I've watched Suzuki once live, but did not see a very good game from him so I can't say (I'm very excited as a Habs fan though).

And for everyone claiming Habs's bias... I'm kind of surprise you put Suzuki ahead of Poehling. Seems like Poehling is the most ready player and a 2-way player and safer bet, with Suzuki being more high reward/more risk. Maybe you value more the higher ceiling though?

I'm not so much debating as asking your reasoning behind them, as I like to get information on players but don't really have time to watch almost any games during the year