MrB1P's top 50 affiliated prospects. Edition 2019-2020.

[ChaoticOrange]

How is Bouchard defensive IQ?

Fine, actually. The knock on him right now is he needs to make decisions faster.

No one is ever going to confuse him for Scott Stevens, but his defensive play has improved and he obviously made it a focus this past season.

 

[Stewie Griffin]

Viewings. I know how the poster is. He might be biaised but at least he watches the players. He's also aware of all the stats out there, like most regular here on hfboards. Funny because I'm pretty sure I had a discussion with him about Brook vs Smith and his opinion hasn't changed.

You'd think Caufield would be higher on his list since he's a habs prospect?

Yes as I said above I appreciate the rankings as I also enjoy following prospects. I haven't seen Brooks that much as the only games I get to see live are OHL, but I still don't see how he's ranked so high.

As for Caufield, I don't think I've seen anyone here complain about his ranking so obviously the consensus is that it's fair. It's the other rankings people have argued about.

 

[Volica]

Elite Prospects - WHL Stats All-time season

Also ignores the fact, most elite young defenders graduate out of the league before they play their 19-year-old season like Seth Jones, Morgan Rielly, and Ivan Provorov.

I mentioned it very early in this thread; which was simply put aside as a "Lol, you aren't watching it right."
Brook had a great season, in a D+2... where most of his counterparts (that according to these ranks he's like 20+ spots higher than) were already playing meaningful minutes in a men's league (AHL/NHL); and doing these type of offensive things in their D+1 versus D+2. Guys who are elite, blue chippers, just don't spend their D+2 in the CHL for the most part. It really takes a special circumstance to see it (physical maturity, or something).

OP is having a hard time actually coming up with reasonable arguments in terms of the rankings.
Like on one hand: Suzuki had a great playoffs, thus that performance should be counted.
On the other hand, Evan Bouchard and Noah Dobson have major playoff performances, but that doesn't mean much. It's even sillier when you roll that back for Bouchard, where after a huge playoff performance in junior, he goes and has a great performance in the AHL!

It's even nuttier that someone like Evan Bouchard isn't even ranked in this entire thing. Coming from a Flames fan.

 

[Favin]

49- Juuso Valimaki

Played 26 NHL games last season

Zegras played a major part of the year on Hughes wing.

Zegras is vanilla. What does he do good exactly ? He played with Jack Hughes all year and sure, he had good numbers (Not great.) I have watched so many USDP games and every time I was just wondering where Zegras was. Sure, nice pass here, nice rush there. But Id want MUCH, much more from him. I expect he cracks the top 50 next year, but as of now he's just not it for me. I had him ranked in the 20s in my 2019 ranking as there is obvious passing talent and skating but I'm not sure its enough.

There is no evidence that Hughes (or Turcotte) inflated Zegras' numbers.

2017-18
...with Hughes: 22 GP, 0.82 ppg
...without Hughes: 34 GP, 1.21 ppg
...with Turcotte: 35 GP, 1.09 ppg
...without Turcotte: 21 GP, 1.00 ppg

2018-19
...with Hughes: 46 GP, 1.50 ppg
...without Hughes: 14 GP, 1.29 ppg
...with Turcotte: 35 GP, 1.37 ppg
...without Turcotte: 25 GP, 1.56 ppg
...with all three in lineup: 21 GP, 1.43 ppg
...with either Hughes or Turcotte out of lineup: 39 GP, 1.46 ppg
...with both Hughes and Turcotte out of lineup: 4 GP, 1.25 ppg

Brook isn’t even the 13th best D prospect.

True, he is good, but somewhere around #20-25 def prospect

Brook was better than all of those this year, few more points or not.

You are comparing his D+2 season, when many of the top guys are no longer with junior clubs. Brook's D+1 season (38 pts in 59 games including playoffs) is what should be used as comp when comparing to someone like Ty Smith (78 pts in 72 games).

If you want to compare late birthdays (Brook born June 17), there are plenty of D+1 comps with Summer birthdays: Jokiharju (1.05 ppg), Woo (1.02 ppg), Bear (1.00 ppg), Clague (0.85 ppg) to name a few...all better than Brook (0.64 ppg)

 

[dBoon]

Secondly, Kravtsov is ranked 5 spots ahead of Suzuki and in my opinion, Kaprizov ... has lost some value.

So, leading the KHL in goals with 30 as a 22 year old will make you lower a guys ranking? Mmmm'kay

 

[Volica]

Played 26 NHL games last season

Regular season games. Juuso only got 24.
Matt Murray was 4th in Calder voting in 2016/17; the season before he played 34 games and had a Stanley Cup to his resume

 

[93LEAFS]

You think Suzuki didn't significantly improved? The big knock I (and pretty much everybody) had on him was his lack of intensity and involvment. Did he improve those? Yes. Significantly? Yes. He even said himself he was focusing on rounding his game up.

Unless you are statwatching only..

The major knock on Suzuki was while he lacked intensity, he also wasn't a great skater for a guy trying to make it with his build. He improved, but it is not like he significantly improved his stock based on his previous 2 years.

Suzuki turned 19 in aughust, so no, there was not only "3" players older than him per team. Its not how age works, age is only a number you get on a random calendar, in reality, Suzuki was much closer to 2018 than a typical 2017 draftee, but I know you already know that and you are just being dishonest, so thats about it.

He's a 2017 draft class, and there are still another 4 and a half months younger than Suzuki of guys who are 19-year-olds this season in the CHL who aren't eligible unless they come back as an overager. He's in the oldest age cohort of non-OA players. 1st round 19 year-olds in the CHL are expected to dominate whether their birthday was in January or December. I'd say the same thing about Even Bouchard who was born in October. That's not being dishonest no matter how much you want to deflect. He's in his 4th OHL season, he's in the oldest co-hort that is about to graduate out of the league

 

[Dead Coyote]

Brook was better than all of those this year, few more points or not.

Okay. So you're going to argue that stats wise...a better point total or points per game don't really matter?

Because your argument was not that he was better all round, or defensively. It was that scoring wise, he's better. And if that's the case, why is he behind in point totals and points per game? We'll have to see if he's better in the NHL, but I find it hard to believe one could argue that he's better than multiples of people who have outproduced him at the same level and age.

 

[OregonCanuck]

how is Quinn 19th.. He gona prove you wrong

 

[Mrb1p]

how is Quinn 19th.. He gona prove you wrong

Ive commented on him already, you can search for a longer post, but I cant find anyone that plays like him and the lack of a shot scares me.

 

[Mrb1p]

Okay. So you're going to argue that stats wise...a better point total or points per game don't really matter?

Because your argument was not that he was better all round, or defensively. It was that scoring wise, he's better. And if that's the case, why is he behind in point totals and points per game? We'll have to see if he's better in the NHL, but I find it hard to believe one could argue that he's better than multiples of people who have outproduced him at the same level and age.

The statement was "the best Dman point wise in the WHL since.." thats what I said, no need to debate it.

 

[Mrb1p]

Fine, actually. The knock on him right now is he needs to make decisions faster.

No one is ever going to confuse him for Scott Stevens, but his defensive play has improved and he obviously made it a focus this past season.

Ive seen Bouchard look into the emptiness of too many arenas to rank him in my top 50. He actually didnt get better, and I doubt hell ever have it. Hes just not a smart hockey player.

 

[Mrb1p]

I mentioned it very early in this thread; which was simply put aside as a "Lol, you aren't watching it right."
Brook had a great season, in a D+2... where most of his counterparts (that according to these ranks he's like 20+ spots higher than) were already playing meaningful minutes in a men's league (AHL/NHL); and doing these type of offensive things in their D+1 versus D+2. Guys who are elite, blue chippers, just don't spend their D+2 in the CHL for the most part. It really takes a special circumstance to see it (physical maturity, or something).

OP is having a hard time actually coming up with reasonable arguments in terms of the rankings.
Like on one hand: Suzuki had a great playoffs, thus that performance should be counted.
On the other hand, Evan Bouchard and Noah Dobson have major playoff performances, but that doesn't mean much. It's even sillier when you roll that back for Bouchard, where after a huge playoff performance in junior, he goes and has a great performance in the AHL!

It's even nuttier that someone like Evan Bouchard isn't even ranked in this entire thing. Coming from a Flames fan.

Bouchard has been producing out of this world numbers for the past three years now, Im not surprised at his production. Now we gotta ask ourselves, did he actually improve on what he had to improve? Not so sure. Thats why I have him outside of the top 50.

 

[Mrb1p]

Played 26 NHL games last season





There is no evidence that Hughes (or Turcotte) inflated Zegras' numbers.

2017-18
...with Hughes: 22 GP, 0.82 ppg
...without Hughes: 34 GP, 1.21 ppg
...with Turcotte: 35 GP, 1.09 ppg
...without Turcotte: 21 GP, 1.00 ppg

2018-19
...with Hughes: 46 GP, 1.50 ppg
...without Hughes: 14 GP, 1.29 ppg
...with Turcotte: 35 GP, 1.37 ppg
...without Turcotte: 25 GP, 1.56 ppg
...with all three in lineup: 21 GP, 1.43 ppg
...with either Hughes or Turcotte out of lineup: 39 GP, 1.46 ppg
...with both Hughes and Turcotte out of lineup: 4 GP, 1.25 ppg



True, he is good, but somewhere around #20-25 def prospect



You are comparing his D+2 season, when many of the top guys are no longer with junior clubs. Brook's D+1 season (38 pts in 59 games including playoffs) is what should be used as comp when comparing to someone like Ty Smith (78 pts in 72 games).

If you want to compare late birthdays (Brook born June 17), there are plenty of D+1 comps with Summer birthdays: Jokiharju (1.05 ppg), Woo (1.02 ppg), Bear (1.00 ppg), Clague (0.85 ppg) to name a few...all better than Brook (0.64 ppg)

Brook had wrist injuries prior to this year and I didnt think he had number one potential, now that hes been healthy, Ive seen what he can really do, which is pretty much everything, theres nothing more to it.

 

[Mrb1p]

So, leading the KHL in goals with 30 as a 22 year old will make you lower a guys ranking? Mmmm'kay

I dont know if hell ever come over, Ive been hyped up about him for three years now, at one point he cant be in my top 10 for ten years.

 

[dBoon]

I dont know if hell ever come over, Ive been hyped up about him for three years now, at one point he cant be in my top 10 for ten years.

Actually I was wrong - he onlt turned 22 in April, so most of that was as a 21 year old.

The Wild have been working on him, and I expect that he'll be here to start the 2020 season.

He's hyped up for good reason.

 

[Cygnusx1018]

Why is Brook ahead of Dobson and Brannstrom

 

[Hattrick Kane]

Some of you need to settle down. Believe it or not, some of these prospects are going to bust, even from your own team.

This ranking doesn’t mean a whole lot, and neither does any other prospect list made. If you want proof of that, go back and look at previous year’s lists.

 

[Just Linda]

Why is Brook ahead of Dobson and Brannstrom

I made a list before Christmas, Dobson behind those 2. I would have been way wrong had I posted it, he's second half was outstanding. Brannstrom fell a bit for me, not a lot but Dobson superpassed him for sure in my book.

 

[Favin]

I dont know if hell ever come over, Ive been hyped up about him for three years now, at one point he cant be in my top 10 for ten years.

Only on this website, is Kaprizov a 'has been' and Gusev a 'will be'

 

[Goldenhands]

Same guy who had Broberg out of the first round, Brink and Dorofeyev top 15 ect. And where Is Bode Wilde? One of his favorites from the last draft, hard to believe he isnt craking his top 50 when he was so high on the guy...

Garbage list, you could throw some names in a hat and end up having a better list...

 

[Mrb1p]

Only on this website, is Kaprizov a 'has been' and Gusev a 'will be'

I dont think anyone said that.

 

[Mrb1p]

Same guy who had Broberg out of the first round, Brink and Dorofeyev top 15 ect. And where Is Bode Wilde? One of his favorites from the last draft, hard to believe he isnt craking his top 50 when he was so high on the guy...

Garbage list, you could throw some names in a hat and end up having a better list...

Still waiting on Matthews 100 points season, but yeah, keep it up.

 

[Legend123]

Same guy who had Broberg out of the first round, Brink and Dorofeyev top 15 ect. And where Is Bode Wilde? One of his favorites from the last draft, hard to believe he isnt craking his top 50 when he was so high on the guy...

Garbage list, you could throw some names in a hat and end up having a better list...

Arent u the one with ylonen and Primeau over Caufield, Suzuki and Poehling???
If not, my bad

 

[ottawa]

Yes I think everyone is aware of that

What ranks Suzuki 21 spots above Frost when Frost has outplayed him in every level? What ranks Suzuki above Barret Hayton who is a year younger, and plays a more complete game? What ranks Poehling above Frost and Hayton? I wouldn't mind if you had them all similarly ranked, as they all are similar prospects with top-6 forward potential, but you ranked the 2 habs prospects MUCH higher than the others. I think the problem people have with your rankings is that you clearly showed some bias (which is okay, we're all human), but then when people comment on the bias, you keep trying to defend yourself and keep saying things any one that watches hockey could say: "I don't like their skill set that much"

Suzuki had almost half as many playoff points (playoff + memorial cup) as Frost had regular season points...49 points in the cup run vs Frost's 109 reg season points.

Just let that sink in