Speculation: Monahan forward most likely dealt first

[John Mandalorian]

@bernmeister

What do you say to Johansen instead of Monahan instead of paying Montreal's extortionistic acquisition cost?

Factors:

* Monahan is better and having a better season but Johansen and Monahan are similar players. Each is a bad fit for Colorado and a better fit for NYR.

* Gorton vs NYR. Meanwhile, Sakic and Drury are ex teammates who can each possibly help each other out.

 

[TS Quint]

What other options are out there that you like much more?

I need at least two here bro. I assume Lindholm is one of them. Henrique??

Well “bro”, how much talk was there about the Jets landing Stastny at the trade deadline from the Blues? How much talk was there about he Jets landing Niederrider from the Preds at the deadline?

There are always plenty of options out there that don’t go out in the rumor mill. The Jets operate very differently than the Habs where Hughes uses LeBrun as a non stop mouth piece. Jets will figure it out and hopefully won’t have to overpay for Monahan Who isn’t a good fit.

 

[Gaud]

2nd + okay prospect

Best chance at a 1st is Conditional 2nd that becomes a 1st based on the team advancing in the playoffs and Monahan having played in those games as the conditions

To be fair , how far is a 2nd and an ok prospect from a 1st in value? Montreal got a 2nd plus Barron for Lekhonen, who i would put as worth less than Monahan if only because one is a winger and the other a C.

 

[bernmeister]

Rangers need to make big move. Or piss season away. Playoffs just around corner. Not much available this trade deadline. Lindholm only big name. But many after him. Price be sky high.

no false assumption, conventional wisdom of the herd is wrong
Giving mins to youth so they develop and are ready for next year is not a waste

Chytil out for season.

Monahan is a perfect fit for the Rangers. 1st rounder. If rangers win cup, add a 2026 third

Do not want
You are entitled to get what you can from him, but not from NYR.
failure to listen to bern earlier
doing all those rentals
has a day of reckoning, which is now.

more of same = more of same
no valued assets for rentals

youth for youth ok
vets for youth ok
vets for vets ok
but not
youth for vets

exceptions to every rule, but that is currently what applicable rule should be

@bernmeister

What do you say to Johansen instead of Monahan instead of paying Montreal's extortionistic acquisition cost?

Factors:

* Monahan is better and having a better season but Johansen and Monahan are similar players. Each is a bad fit for Colorado and a better fit for NYR.

* Gorton vs NYR. Meanwhile, Sakic and Drury are ex teammates who can each possibly help each other out.

You have summoned me, and I respond.
The above comments basically apply.
RyJo looks like a better fit, but Rs cannot sell tom for a quick fix

Also, we need cap going forward, and can't use 4m per x 2 on RyJo next season

Now, if we happen to have another retain on RyJo, and you can max him one mo time down to 2 per x 2, depending on what Avs want/need, that may be a possible b'c there may be a fit on rearranging the deck chairs on the titanic that is still a small win win with a vet + a small prospect we can consider adding.
I am not insulted if you believe he gets more on the open market

 

[HabzSauce]

Well “bro”, how much talk was there about the Jets landing Stastny at the trade deadline from the Blues? How much talk was there about he Jets landing Niederrider from the Preds at the deadline?

There are always plenty of options out there that don’t go out in the rumor mill. The Jets operate very differently than the Habs where Hughes uses LeBrun as a non stop mouth piece. Jets will figure it out and hopefully won’t have to overpay for Monahan Who isn’t a good fit.

Cool story so who are those guys exactly? Sounded like OP had some players in mind which is why I asked him.

I could care less about the jets by the way I'm not sure why you're bringing them up. There's 30 other teams to trade with if jets and Habs can't work something out

 

[HabzSauce]

In no particular order, key point being hard to say who will be available bc we don't even know yet who's in the playoffs so this is just spit balling at this stage until those standings are final (so hard to look into my crystal ball, some of my list likely won't be available and some new ones will be). This is just a list of guys I would sooner target at the TDL before Monahan, this is not a comprehensive list even (I know I'm forgetting 1-2 more players I've talked about in the past who might be available), just off the top of my head guys I would sooner have for various reasons and not position specific. I'm sure other Jets fans would be able to add to my list and have lists of their own, as you know no fan base agrees on these things 100% (Habs included). As I stated multi times most fans and management all are happy with Names job at 2C, we just wish we could get the same defensive ability with the offensive ability of a 60-70+ point center at 2C.......but those of course are hard to find but some of my list below fill that description or are enough of upgrade over Names to consider them. Another key point to know about the Jets is cap space is not an issue, they have lots for the TDL (5.5 million at this stage without a single player being traded away). Some of these players I like much more then Monahan and are better players IMO, some I think are similar value or less then Monahan trade value but are better fits on the Jets and fill needs on the Jets better. Some I like longer term, some shorter term so this is a mixed bag in my list but thats what you asked me for.

Tanev
Adam H
Lindholm
Sean W
Casey M
Claude G
Pinto
Jake G
Boone J
Trevor Z
Frank Vatrano

As nearly all my posts have stated, I would take Monahan at the TDL for a cheap enough price (which is less then what all Habs fans to get for him), but he's far from my top target, TBH he's likely not in my top 10 targets I would go after (all positions included). Monahan will be traded (IMO), the Habs will get more in return from some team then I would offer, which is perfectly fine bc other teams have a bigger need then the Jets do at 2C so others will pay more then me which is natural. He's just not a great fit IMO on the Jets for what most are asking for him, especially if one reads the Habs trade board where some habs fans expectations seem much higher then this thread is. Monahan & Lindholm are far from the only targets out there, just happens Monahan is the most advertised in the media........multi reasons for that, one is clearly Monahan wants to be traded and the Habs want to trade him.......but also has to do with its the Habs

Nice. I strongly disagree with your evaluation on Monahan but good post.

Besides Lindholm, I think the only center I'd rather have on your list over Monahan would be Pinto.

 

[John Mandalorian]

no false assumption, conventional wisdom of the herd is wrong
Giving mins to youth so they develop and are ready for next year is not a waste



Do not want
You are entitled to get what you can from him, but not from NYR.
failure to listen to bern earlier
doing all those rentals
has a day of reckoning, which is now.

more of same = more of same
no valued assets for rentals

youth for youth ok
vets for youth ok
vets for vets ok
but not
youth for vets

exceptions to every rule, but that is currently what applicable rule should be


You have summoned me, and I respond.
The above comments basically apply.
RyJo looks like a better fit, but Rs cannot sell tom for a quick fix

Also, we need cap going forward, and can't use 4m per x 2 on RyJo next season

Now, if we happen to have another retain on RyJo, and you can max him one mo time down to 2 per x 2, depending on what Avs want/need, that may be a possible b'c there may be a fit on rearranging the deck chairs on the titanic that is still a small win win with a vet + a small prospect we can consider adding.
I am not insulted if you believe he gets more on the open market

Do you have a bottom a bottom 6er that you can swap out?

 

[Hunter368]

Nice. I strongly disagree with your evaluation on Monahan but good post.

Besides Lindholm, I think the only center I'd rather have on your list over Monahan would be Pinto.

If we all agreed on everything in life it would be boring.

Its all good

 

[bernmeister]

Do you have a bottom a bottom 6er that you can swap out?

your preferences... LW/C/RW?

 

[Yanny]

To be fair , how far is a 2nd and an ok prospect from a 1st in value? Montreal got a 2nd plus Barron for Lekhonen, who i would put as worth less than Monahan if only because one is a winger and the other a C.

Lehkonen was not a rental (RFA), It's hard to predict trade at the dealine but I dont thing that monahan worth more than lehky

 

[John Mandalorian]

your preferences... LW/C/RW?

Flexible. Under 3.5. Two years or less. Ideally is a decent skater with some grit.

 

[bernmeister]

Flexible. Under 3.5. Two years or less. Ideally is a decent skater with some grit.

ok, first crack at it....

we agree this is basically you dumping RyJo which NY considers at correct currency on basis of commensurate + nominal profit + chance RyJo = short term lightening in a bottle

per cf you show 0 cap space, and 47/50 contracts so you can theoretically add up to 3 bodies...


Leschyshyn 766,667 x2 + Vesey 800k x 2 + NYR 2024 4th
= 1.566,667 cap hit
for
RyJo 4.0 final max retain 50% = 2.0 hit + Avs 2026 2nd

Colorado gets 400k + instant cap relief, and the 2 pieces coming back are < 1m ea. so if they clear waivers further cap benefit.
Vesey is useful, speed, grit and a solid 4th line W
Lesch is called Leshitshow on our board.
4th rounder < 2nd, but is immediate, 2nd rounder is 2 yrs delayed


Rs get tweak which might help w/search for F help
We should be focused on Pinto from Sens, but this could work in the background

 

[LesCanadiens]

Calm down Batman.

He's just saying Monahan's not the player he wants to invest in. No need to get emotional about it.


I'm pretty sure there won't be any conditions on team performances. Only on his number of games played.

I call major BS on that, so you calm down, "Robin". He couples his comments with he (Monahan) has "big warts". So no matter how he's trying to very thinly veil it, he's saying that is all that Monahan is worth, and reluctantly as that. I'm still waiting for what these "big warts" are. Monahan is about a solid, complete player you can get. Point producer, faceoff guy, great room guy, never a floater or lazy that I can tell. Doesn't take stupid penalties. So what are these warts that a team would be reluctant to offer a very late 2nd for him? I'll give you the most logical answer. He's a Habs player. And don't you know, Habs players are all "scraps" and "overrated" on these boards. As soon as he's traded, as happened to guys like Toffoli, Lekhonen and others, he's a valuable asset. This is all well proven over and over. So no need to patronize us Hab fans that understand this.

 

[ole ole]

Calm down Batman.

He's just saying Monahan's not the player he wants to invest in. No need to get emotional about it.

He also mentioned Monahan as a plan c and if it came down to a plan c than he sees Monahan value at a 85-90th pick. Of course other teams would off more . That's quite easy to see.

 

[ole ole]

What other options are out there that you like much more?

I need at least two here bro. I assume Lindholm is one of them. Henrique??

His other option is keeping his 2nd pick . That 58 pick OA.
Keep it.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

Then don't bother to make an offer if you ,me and every other poster know it wouldn't come close. It was such a trash offer it should be taken as a joke.

A 3rd round pick is fair value for an injury prone bottom 6 player. It's probably overpayment when you consider how much of a liability he is at 5v5.

 

[ole ole]

Not worth it.

Out of curiosity, what does Winnipeg do if plan A doesn’t work and Montreal doesn’t want to trade him for a second? Stand down and ride the current roster? If that’s the case, why are we seeing reports everywhere that says they are going to be aggressive on the market?

The Jets are only to be willing to part with a 3rd from my understanding.

 

[ole ole]

no false assumption, conventional wisdom of the herd is wrong
Giving mins to youth so they develop and are ready for next year is not a waste



Do not want
You are entitled to get what you can from him, but not from NYR.
failure to listen to bern earlier
doing all those rentals
has a day of reckoning, which is now.

more of same = more of same
no valued assets for rentals

youth for youth ok
vets for youth ok
vets for vets ok
but not
youth for vets

exceptions to every rule, but that is currently what applicable rule should be


You have summoned me, and I respond.
The above comments basically apply.
RyJo looks like a better fit, but Rs cannot sell tom for a quick fix

Also, we need cap going forward, and can't use 4m per x 2 on RyJo next season

Now, if we happen to have another retain on RyJo, and you can max him one mo time down to 2 per x 2, depending on what Avs want/need, that may be a possible b'c there may be a fit on rearranging the deck chairs on the titanic that is still a small win win with a vet + a small prospect we can consider adding.
I am not insulted if you believe he gets more on the open market

Wow another post from Bermeister That makes sense.

 

[Benstheman]

I call major BS on that, so you calm down, "Robin". He couples his comments with he (Monahan) has "big warts". So no matter how he's trying to very thinly veil it, he's saying that is all that Monahan is worth, and reluctantly as that. I'm still waiting for what these "big warts" are. Monahan is about a solid, complete player you can get. Point producer, faceoff guy, great room guy, never a floater or lazy that I can tell. Doesn't take stupid penalties. So what are these warts that a team would be reluctant to offer a very late 2nd for him? I'll give you the most logical answer. He's a Habs player. And don't you know, Habs players are all "scraps" and "overrated" on these boards. As soon as he's traded, as happened to guys like Toffoli, Lekhonen and others, he's a valuable asset. This is all well proven over and over. So no need to patronize us Hab fans that understand this.

You take it so personal and I think it’s funny. Off course Monahan has warts. Defensively is below average and he is slow. And he has a large history of being seriously injured.

if none of that were true, Habs wouldn’t have gotten a pick to take his contract.

That being said, he has a lot a great qualities and his contract his contract is his biggest asset.

I think we will get a late 1st or equivalent for him but I definitely understand posters of other teams that don’t want to pay that for him.

 

[Benstheman]

A 3rd round pick is fair value for an injury prone bottom 6 player. It's probably overpayment when you consider how much of a liability he is at 5v5.

So your saying GMs overpay for rentals at the deadline?

I know you know Habs will easily get more than a 3rd for him.

 

[Benstheman]

To be fair , how far is a 2nd and an ok prospect from a 1st in value? Montreal got a 2nd plus Barron for Lekhonen, who i would put as worth less than Monahan if only because one is a winger and the other a C.

Lehkonen had a bigger value than Monahan has right now.

But 2nd + Barron (recent 1st pick) was a better offer than a late 1st.

 

[GirardSpinorama]

There is essentially no way the Avs have both ryjo and monahan on the roster at the same time. Completely anti thesis to the Avs system.

 

[Adam da bomb]

You take it so personal and I think it’s funny. Off course Monahan has warts. Defensively is below average and he is slow. And he has a large history of being seriously injured.

if none of that were true, Habs wouldn’t have gotten a pick to take his contract.

That being said, he has a lot a great qualities and his contract his contract is his biggest asset.

I think we will get a late 1st or equivalent for him but I definitely understand posters of other teams that don’t want to pay that for him.

All players have warts. Like Connor is weak defensively, Ehlers is also more injury prone than most. As Jets we are able to see the weaknesses in our own players. Caulfield is an incredible player but he is on the smaller side. Monahan does have a lot of positives as well.
Hunter was just saying if Monahan is cheap that he would be interested in him. Isn't that the general conversation around here. If players all were offered what they were worth by other teams these boards would be 5 pages max. Maybe, it would be better than offering a third not to make any offer at all. Or saying I'll just sign the player when they are a free agent.
To the right team he probably is worth a late 1st or second and a decent prospect.

I agree with you in wondering how anyone can take anything said here so personal.

 

[John Mandalorian]

If someone doesnt want to get extorted by Gorton Hughes before the Monahan bubble bursts, consider a Monahan lite in Ryan Johansen. Similar skill sets. Similar players but Johansen is a buy low option that will cost a lot less.

If you're tired of these extortionistic prices, just pick up the phone and dial 303. Our price is insane!

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

So your saying GMs overpay for rentals at the deadline?

I know you know Habs will easily get more than a 3rd for him.

I don't know that. It wouldn't shock me if he went for a 2nd, and it wouldn't shock me if he didn't.