Mitch Marner (post playoffs) discussion thread continued...

[Gabriel426]

Does Marner now get the Larry Murphy treatment next year?

Larry Murphy actually won something before coming to the Leafs and he was not really a playoff disappointment, he was a speed disappointment, lol.

 

[Captain Crunch]

Yes, let's boo our players out of town! That will for sure make other players want to come here.

You guys are too much and honestly don't deserve a good team.

Okay, so maybe we should sing koom bye ya (have no idea how to spell that) and be happy that we have a pretty good regular season team, but one that shits the bed in the playoffs. I don’t think so.
These boys wanted to be paid. Well, if you want all that money, you damn well better be able to produce when it counts! It would be one thing if they had taken bridge deals (it sure would have helped Dubas get some good supporting players, although Dubas plays a big part in this for giving out all that money), but no, they felt they deserved it. Like the quote from the movie Spiderman says, “With great power comes great responsibility”. Well, it should also say, “With many millions comes great responsibility!”

 

[Leafsfan74]

Hutton is that D, no? He didn't leave for injuries, sounds like the leave was unpredictable

Yeah, if so, that's really unfortunate. That hit he laid against Anderson was the best hit of the year for this team, and he played, what? One game?

 

[Leafsfan74]

Since it's been shown rather conclusively that thinking this team could go on a deep run was a pipe dream, pissing away a 1st round pick for a grade B rental was a really bad gamble. When things go well you get the credit, when they don't you take the blame. And considering how valuable 1st round picks are, Dubas deserves a lot of blame for this one.

If it was up to me, I'd put a hard rule in place right now. Until this team wins at least one playoff round, no more pissing away picks on rentals, period.

Disclaimer - I think rentals are rarely a good idea anyway and saying no rentals never ever no matter what would likely be a good idea as well.

The problem is, Leafs don't have a five year window anymore, and, they are up against the Cap, so rentals will have to be a part of the situation, especially when the team wins the division.

 

[ToemassCabriolet]

Marner is a known commodity at this point; I'm not disappointed in him. He will not transmogrify into anything other than what he's shown everyone to be over the past five - FIVE - years. Could he show more physicality, could he try harder at the boards, could he shoot the puck better? The answer in a deterministic universe is resoundingly no, no, and no. If he suddenly decided to try to work all those things into his game, he'd probably end up like Bart Simpson in this clip:

If that means the Leafs decide to trade him (e.g. because they think it's insane to shelter an $11m player), then so be it. It's nothing personal, kid.

 

[Gary Nylund]

The problem is, Leafs don't have a five year window anymore, and, they are up against the Cap, so rentals will have to be a part of the situation, especially when the team wins the division.

I disagree. Make the right moves and our window could still be open for a decade.

 

[nuck]

I wonder what Mitch would have looked like if he hadn't led the NHL in regular season in ice time and and played 4 minutes more a night than Mackinnon and 5 a night more than Pasta? He was played to death in the play-ins last year by Keefe too and was a minus with no goals. Babs didn't use him that much and he produced a lot more. Even in his breakout regular season beside Tavares, less than 20:00 a night. Nylander at 18:21 a night still had legs and his stats showed that. I don't want to necessarily give Mitch a pass for that, but if he is still a Leaf next year I hope the new coach understands the club has more than two offensive producers.

 

[Kurtz]

Afraid to take the hit to make a play. Did not want to be the first man on the puck on the boards.

 

[Jimmy Firecracker]

I disagree. Make the right moves and our window could still be open for a decade.

Its at least open for three more seasons, that’s how long we’ve got the core four plus Brodie and Muzzin signed for. Campbell, Rielly, and Hyman will need new contracts in that time span but it’s not impossible to sign all of them.

 

[koyvoo]

Afraid to take the hit to make a play. Did not want to be the first man on the puck on the boards.

This is us though. That's our identity. There were countless examples of a bunch of our guys doing the very similar things.

Not defended Marner. Gutless is gutless. But our other pretender superstars did the exact same, more than once.

 

[ANDI P IS CUTE]

He mentioned in an article that the marner camp refused to allow the coaching staff to adjust the pp make up. He insisted on playing the right side half wall vs playing on the left goal line with Nylander on the left half wall allowing them to open up more shooting lanes.
Mitch insisted on staying on the right half wall forcing those telegraphed cross ice passes to Matthews.

wow. and an A on his sweater too?

 

[Gary Nylund]

I wonder what Mitch would have looked like if he hadn't led the NHL in regular season in ice time and and played 4 minutes more a night than Mackinnon and 5 a night more than Pasta? He was played to death in the play-ins last year by Keefe too and was a minus with no goals. Babs didn't use him that much and he produced a lot more. Even in his breakout regular season beside Tavares, less than 20:00 a night. Nylander at 18:21 a night still had legs and his stats showed that. I don't want to necessarily give Mitch a pass for that, but if he is still a Leaf next year I hope the new coach understands the club has more than two offensive producers.

It's possible this is an issue I guess. But I don't want to give him a pass either, just too many issues with him for me to do that.

Afraid to take the hit to make a play. Did not want to be the first man on the puck on the boards.

Yeah on one hand, I don't want him to get crunched into boards and avoiding hits helps him stay healthy. On the other hand, avoiding hits can't be your absolute #1 priority over everything else no matter what and on this occasion, that does seem to be the case. It's game 7, you're down a goal, you haven't been producing, time to get your nose dirty and contribute any way you can.

Its at least open for three more seasons, that’s how long we’ve got the core four plus Brodie and Muzzin signed for. Campbell, Rielly, and Hyman will need new contracts in that time span but it’s not impossible to sign all of them.

You say at least three, I say maybe a decade if we're smart. Sounds like we're on the same page.

 

[koyvoo]

wow. and an A on his sweater too?

If a spoiled brat is allowed to act like one, he will. This shit, if true, is all on Keefe. What’s the point of having a head coach in the first place if the inmates are going to run the asylum?

 

[The Blueprint]

Afraid to take the hit to make a play. Did not want to be the first man on the puck on the boards.

I remember watching this play specifically and thinking that's just not how you win games. Terrified.

 

[Headshot77]

Nylander is Kessel 2.0. We already have that piece.

Now we need the Crosby or Malkin.

Matthews and Marner ain't it.

Matthews is it. Dude was a warrior. Winning the rocket with an injured wrist is the stuff of legends.

The move is to trade Marner for like, two top 6 wingers who make 4-5 mil apiece. I don't want Marner on the Pens, but as an example: Marner for Guentzel and Rust. This has the added benefit of providing more depth while saving 1.5 million. And you can bump a guy like Hymen down to the second line.

 

[koyvoo]

Matthews is a warrior who produces well below his standards and abilities when the games matter and opponents are giving max effort every shift for five straight post seasons. Lol. Ridiculous.

 

[Azail]

Imagine he signed something like 9.5x6 without any of that drama. People would currently be a little "down" on him... but not belligerent. And maybe he would have played much better without that contract negotiation monkey on his back. Was that extra money worth this pressure? I just don't understand.

Go to any person in the street and say:

"2 choices.

1. I give you 65 million dollars over the next 6 years, but it will be outrageous pressure and your whole city will turn on you on a dime.

2. I give you 57 million dollars over the next 6 years, and you'll be the hometown hero with far less pressure... oh, and your team will be able to spend more on other players"

Ask anybody. They'll all take #2. Everybody. Why? Because you will have the PRECISE same lifestyle either way, so why not enjoy living as the top 0.000001% without the extra pressure? I simply don't understand the greed of these people.

Unfortunately I don't agree with this at all. If he was making 9.5mil and put up the performance he just did there would 100% be calls for him to be gone. He's a top line player that just played like dogshit.

People get way too bent out of shape about the contract. How about just look at the player, where he is slotted and judge him on that?

If you have a player that makes $6.5mil playing on your top line that puts up ppg in the regular season multiple seasons in a row, and then puts up 0.5 ppg for multiple playoffs in a row. Are you going to be like, oh well, he makes less money he gets a pass, no you would judge him based on what he is expected to do based on where he slots in the lineup and what he does in the regular season.

You rely on your best players no matter how much they make. The reality is, Mitch was/is a top line player. I don't care if he's making 20mil, or 1mil, a top line player that plays at PPG pace in the regular season should be better when the real games start.

 

[The Best Leafs Ever]

Does Marner now get the Larry Murphy treatment next year?

I hope he is miles away from this team before this even begins.

 

[killer1980]

All our young guys are part of Generation Whatever. The least important thing in their lives is getting the shit beat out of them in a hockey rink, especially when they can get $millions of dollars for floating around and shooting the puck without absorbing any bodily damage.

 

[ANDI P IS CUTE]

dubas is in love with mm sadly.

 

[Dion TheFluff]

Afraid to take the hit to make a play. Did not want to be the first man on the puck on the boards.

yeah! and it's not like it was Josh Anderson barreling down on him (infact the exact opposite. size wise anyways)

 

[ANDI P IS CUTE]

Yesterday I was all in favour of trading Marner but after thinking about it I’ve come to my senses. Marner was FINE in both Boston series. He put up 9 pts in 7 games in the first Boston series. In the 2nd Boston series Cassidy broke up the perfection line to get him away from 91 & 16

The problem is Keefe doesn’t know how to coach. He kept running the same lines out over and over again even though they weren’t working. He did nothing to try to get them away from the matchups. He’s a horrible junior caliber coach and needs to be fired

you mean the world renowned bergeron lite phillip danualt? lol. cmon man.

 

[ToemassCabriolet]

Matthews is a warrior who produces well below his standards and abilities when the games matter and opponents are giving max effort every shift for five straight post seasons. Lol. Ridiculous.

Matthews was far more disappointing than Marner. So much so, you gotta hope he's playing injured. Otherwise, the dude's checking out in the playoffs, because we've seen him hustle and generate plays in o-zone that were not materializing in the play offs.

Muffins into the breadbasket from the perimeter is not what you'd call quintessential Matthews. And no dude, it wasn't just a game of inches.

 

[ANDI P IS CUTE]

Afraid to take the hit to make a play. Did not want to be the first man on the puck on the boards.

times 100. gutless.

 

[Dion TheFluff]

Matthews was far more disappointing than Marner. So much so, you gotta hope he's playing injured. Otherwise, the dude's checking out in the playoffs, because we've seen him hustle and generate plays in o-zone that were not materializing in the play offs.

Muffins into the breadbasket from the perimeter is not what you'd call quintessential Matthews. And no dude, it wasn't just a game of inches.

were you watching the right series?