Mitch Marner (post playoffs) discussion thread continued...

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No doubt, but "I haven't been able to hang out with my friends" when he gets to spend every day with team mates, coaches, trainers, mentors, and I would imagine mental health professionals, (never mind the money) seems a lot like ill timed self pity to me. Especially considering what others have endured.
What was the question that he gave that response to?
I find that people post snips of an interview and things are taken out of context. Not saying that’s the case here, I didn’t listen to the interview. I rarely if ever do
 
I’m not really a Marner fan. I think my criticisms of the player are pretty well known. But cooling down after a few days I think unless there’s a sweetheart deal you run back the Big 4 and hope this playoff meltdown pain will propel him forward like it did with a Nylander this time around.

No guarantees but maybe a dialed in Marner is something we want to take advantage of as opposed to letting him learn on the job here only to take off somewhere else. Of course he’s going to be under heavy scrutiny next season.

Only thing I would say is this guy could probably talk to a sports psychologist and hit the gym. I’m not being facetious or joking around. I think Nathan Mackinnon said he had to go see one earlier in his career when he was crippled with self doubt about turning into a bust. Also would love to see him work with Gary Roberts to get stronger and more explosive.

That’s about it.
Didn't MacKinnons play ramp up once he started training with Crosby in the offseason?
 
Dubas to the press: "Marner is not going anywhere."

Dubas to Marner: "Get ready mother f***er you're out, pack the bags and just wait for the flight ticket."
 
What was the question that he gave that response to?
I find that people post snips of an interview and things are taken out of context. Not saying that’s the case here, I didn’t listen to the interview. I rarely if ever do

"What will you take away from this season?"
 
I agree, there's definitely a huge risk in holding onto Marner, because if he sucks again next playoffs and the Leafs bail out in round one again, his value would be completely shot.
Not if he puts up 8--100 pts in the regular season again. Teams like the jackets and others just want to make the playoffs and he can help in that regard.
 
Posted this on reddit the other day.

I swear up and down Marner's problem isn't that he doesn't care. I think he cares way, way too much. He is a Leafs fan, so every single ounce of the trauma that we feel about Game 7's, he feels. Then there's the fact that he's lived those disappointments. Then there's the fact that he has the residual guilt of raking his team over the coals for every penny. And then there's the fact that his contract literally has 93 in it, this guy wants to be a franchise legend more than anything else in the world and carries that with him every shift in the playoffs.

He sucked ass in the playoffs this year, but nothing about his body language or facial expressions told me that he didn't care. The pure frustration and dejection that was constantly on his face and in his shoulders showed me a guy who is carrying the weight of the world on his shoulders, but does not have anywhere near the kind of capacity for that. Let me be 100% clear that I have zero sympathy for him here. These are all problems of his own making. The contract and his ego are what did this to him. But funnily enough, while I think OP is correct in that fixing Marner is better than trading him, I think figuring out how to get him to chill the f*** out a little bit is the way to go.

Mitch is dynamite when he's relaxed. When he's got swagger. He doesn't need to ratchet the pressure up and care even more, he needs to calm down and play hockey. Unfortunately, I think that's why a trade is the best case for him, because I doubt you can really just get him to forget all of the shit that he's put himself through here. How do you tell a guy to forget those Doug Gilmour dreams and just be Mitch Marner? If he goes somewhere else that happens pretty much automatically.

If I could push a button and fix Marner to make him a playoff beast, I'd push that button instead of trading him 10/10 times. I think it's next to impossible that we find a good trade. How do you trade the 4th highest scorer in the league and not get put over the barrel? Fixing him is the way to go. But I really don't think it's that simple, or even in the direction that most people assume that it is.
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So it's a bit of a relief to hear Dubas say that he won't trade Marner. But the real question is how to we fix this guy mentally. He scored 9 points in 7 games against the big bad Bruins as a sophomore. The talent is in there. It's almost completely unbelievable that of all the young stars in the league we got the one who is a dud in the playoffs. Marner will figure it out eventually, so how do the Leafs help him do that when the pressure is going to be EVEN BIGGER on him next year. Failure was already not an option, the pressure on him is going to be astronomical now that he's going to have to justify his existence to us every time he steps on the ice and triple that in the playoffs. He was total ass last year after he signed his contract, I'm afraid that we're going to be headed for another year of that. While I don't believe that he'll be a playoff dud, unfortunately all of this pressure that he's created for himself has turned him into a bit of a headcase that effects his performance.
yep and its unfortunate that the coach and management didnt see what we were seeing and moved him down the line up to get his bearings and easier match ups
 
Not if he puts up 8--100 pts in the regular season again. Teams like the jackets and others just want to make the playoffs and he can help in that regard.

I have no doubt Marner could consistently get 90 plus points playing with Matthews in the regular season, but I don't think he'll be as attractive if he stinks the joint again next playoffs...sure, they'll still be takers, but the offer might not be as high.
 
yep and its unfortunate that the coach and management didnt see what we were seeing and moved him down the line up to get his bearings and easier match ups

I don't get why they didn't just throw him on the Kerfoot line for a while. Let him be a pea shooter on a sheltered line and away from the Montreal game plan and let Matthews run with Nylander, a linemate that has proven successful in the past and the hottest Leaf scorer in the series. I mean, I do get why, Keefe is in way over his head. But still.
 
I don't get why they didn't just throw him on the Kerfoot line for a while. Let him be a pea shooter on a sheltered line and away from the Montreal game plan and let Matthews run with Nylander, a linemate that has proven successful in the past and the hottest Leaf scorer in the series. I mean, I do get why, Keefe is in way over his head. But still.
I don't think that would have worked as a line. Nylander brings goalscoring and wins puck battles in a way that Marner simply doesn't. It may have been worth a try, but what's even weirder is that Keefe did decide to break up his only good offensive line anyway by putting Foligno there. So maybe he is just lost
 
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Boy, if there is an Eichel trade to be made for Marner and we don't move on it. I'm going to have a hard time forgiving them. I get the crowd that doesn't want to replace $11 million for $10 million. I do. And I would feel the same way if Eichel wasn't potentially available. This guy is way better than John Tavares. Players like him are never available for trade. I get the injury concerns too. But that is where you need a competent medical staff to do their job ***cough****Leafs*****Foligno*****cough*****.

I'm just saying players of Eichel's quality are never available. He's a franchise level player. For god sake, make the deal.
 
Boy, if there is an Eichel trade to be made for Marner and we don't move on it. I'm going to have a hard time forgiving them. I get the crowd that doesn't want to replace $11 million for $10 million. I do. And I would feel the same way if Eichel wasn't potentially available. This guy is way better than John Tavares. Players like him are never available for trade. I get the injury concerns too. But that is where you need a competent medical staff to do their job ***cough****Leafs*****Foligno*****cough*****.

I'm just saying players of Eichel's quality are never available. He's a franchise level player. For god sake, make the deal.

Eichel is a better pure athlete and has more upside than Marner. The downside is he comes off as very mercurial. Marner's pure shooting and skating strength and explosiveness aren't special so he has fewer tools to eventually figure it out in the playoffs.
 
Eichel is a better pure athlete and has more upside than Marner. The downside is he comes off as very mercurial. Marner's pure shooting and skating strength and explosiveness aren't special so he has fewer tools to eventually figure it out in the playoffs.
I don't really follow Buffalo all that close, although I've seen more than enough to know that Jack is a very high end player. What about him concerns you other than his health? I see he disagrees with his team about his health, and that is just being smart, you should always manage your own health, trust nobody but you. Eric Lindros would be dead today if he followed the Flyers medical staff directions.
 
I don't really follow Buffalo all that close, although I've seen more than enough to know that Jack is a very high end player. What about him concerns you other than his health? I see he disagrees with his team about his health, and that is just being smart, you should always manage your own health, trust nobody but you. Eric Lindros would be dead today if he followed the Flyers medical staff directions.

Don't get me wrong, I'd most likely take the Eichel for Marner. But over the course of the Sabres build, Eichel seemed to get very down on the program very early on, so as a comparison to Matthews, he struck me as a more difficult franchise center to build around.
 
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Don't get me wrong, I'd most likely take the Eichel for Marner. But over the course of the Sabres build, Eichel seemed to get very down on the program very early on, so as a comparison to Matthews, he struck me as a more difficult franchise center to build around.
How would matthews react to that same situation, that has to be super frustrating to an extremely talented player, he’d be top 10 IMO with a good supporting cast
 
Don't get me wrong, I'd most likely take the Eichel for Marner. But over the course of the Sabres build, Eichel seemed to get very down on the program very early on, so as a comparison to Matthews, he struck me as a more difficult franchise center to build around.

Maybe, but we don't have to build around him so not a concern. His health though, that's another story and that would need to be figured out before making the trade.
 
Don't get me wrong, I'd most likely take the Eichel for Marner. But over the course of the Sabres build, Eichel seemed to get very down on the program very early on, so as a comparison to Matthews, he struck me as a more difficult franchise center to build around.
Fair enough. One interesting thing, I took a look over at the Buffalo board, and some of them are interested in Marner, but not a one of them wants us to get Eichel, they want to make it a 3 way trade with us getting Seth Jones. I think they see the same thing I do. It's better from my vantage.
 
How would matthews react to that same situation, that has to be super frustrating to an extremely talented player, he’d be top 10 IMO with a good supporting cast

I think the Sabres would have been in better hands with Matthews.

But that's not to say a Matthews, Eichel, Tavares, Nylander wouldn't be an amazing Big 4, Version 2.
 
Didn't MacKinnons play ramp up once he started training with Crosby in the offseason?
I think they have been training long before his breakout since they literally came from the same town.
Something just clicked with Mack. It could very well be that he was told the team will be building around you trust him with faith.
 
I think they have been training long before his breakout since they literally came from the same town.
Something just clicked with Mack. It could very well be that he was told the team will be building around you trust him with faith.

On Spittin Chiclets I think he talked about having the fear of being labeled a bust and saw a sports psychologist to help him focus that anxiety productively and be a great player for the Avalanche.
 
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