Player Discussion Mitch Marner - On Hiatus

[mydnyte]

Marner will bet on himself and when he puts up 0G 2 assists in game 4-7 his fans will say he was one of our best players and deserves more money than the Conn Smythe winner

I really hate defending Marner, but, the comments against him are just looney.

I have a clear vision of a shift on game 7, where he gained the zone and was circling in the zone looking for a F to pass to (Domi or Bert at that point) and both were engaging in stupidity, and neither looking to go to open ice, or a passing position. ...then Marner got clobbered and lost the puck.
Now, it looked bad on Marner, but, whose fault was is really??

Marner is a playmaker/passer, not a goal scorer, so, when he has nobody open to pass to, he's kinda screwed.

He really needs to work on his shot more(though its better than it was before), and use it more, as he doesnt even come close to using it enough to become a shooting threat.

then there is the idiot Keefe who puts Marner and Domi together, a 85% pass first guy (Marner) and a 95% pass first guy (Domi) with Bert who just SUCKED and never got open and couldnt receive a pass even if he was open!!!

I really hope we do not resign Bertuzzi!!

 

[Trapper]

How else do they use 18 million in cap space?

If they run it back what difference does it make. Just give it all to the same guys.

 

[HamiltonNHL]

this extension talk

It’s fake.

 

[Notsince67]

I’m pissed.
It’s time for a change


Excellent

If he returns he’s driving the third line and PP2

If? That isnt what you promised

 

[Gary Nylund]

Yeah man. It's like I was saying to someone else a few minutes ago. If they actually sign Marner to an extension, I think that might be the straw that breaks the camel's back for me and I might be done with this team. Or at the very least officially become detached from any emotional investment I once had with them.

If they are not serious about winning, then why the f*** am I going to waste my time investing myself and watching them?

To see what? More guaranteed 1st round exits for the next half decade? F*** that

I think I'm addicted and could never be done with the team. I know how you feel though and my enthusiasm for watching has been going down last couple of years. I think there will many night where the game will be on, but I'm not paying much attention.

The salty tears are really something

Interesting comment. Does that mean you're going to cry if you don't get your way and Marner's playing for another team? Or are you the type that's more likely to react violently when you don't get your way?

People assume that trading Mitch suddenly makes the Leafs a better team.

1) Tre would have to hit a win in the trade. How many trades did he win in Calgary?
2) The team has to replace Mitch's 90 points through better defence or through like for like offence.
3) JT is no spring chicken his production will start to decline.
4) We need a 1A goalie to compete with perennial Veznia candidates Swayman, Vas, Bob
5) Our Defence is garbage we need to improve our D significantly, dressing Rielly up as a 1 when at best he is a 2 wont work any more.
6) We need some of our prospects to hit and stick and become impact players.
7) We need to improve team speed, we move the puck slow, we skate slow.
8) The bottom of our forward groups are useless anchors, Gregor, Dewar, Holmberg, Reaves, Jarnkrok, Kampft --- what do they do exactly to help this team win?
9) Berube's system in Toronto is yet to be proven effective, some say he was in the right place at the right time, some say he is the next coming of Bowman and is going to bring us to the promised land.

If fans think , we trade Mitch and all of a sudden we are on par with Florida/Boston and other elite teams in the East they are fooling themselves.

I think you're misunderstanding what people think - I doubt anyone assumes that trading Mitch makes us a better team. What people think is that considering how badly Marner plays after the first couple of playoff games, spending a ton of cap space on him is not the path to playoff success so it makes sense to try something else. It's an uphill battle no matter what for reasons you've stated so it's hard to see us winning a cup before the next rebuild no matter what. But however slim the chances are, committing to Marner for another lengthy term seems like it guarantees we'll fail.

 

[Ports]

The key to my post being getting Marner off of his full NMC and into a contract even with a limited NTC (10 team list etc) returns control to the Leafs and makes him tradeable without consent.

If Marner is not signing such a deal perhaps its best he test free agency and see what other teams are offer then.

He probably will then because the Leafs would be crazy to give him a NMC when they’re having trouble trading him now.

 

[Notsince67]

Interesting comment. Does that mean you're going to cry if you don't get your way and Marner's playing for another team? Or are you the type that's more likely to react violently when you don't get your way?

Me cry? As foreign as it may seem to you, I conduct myself like a typical Gen X man. Tears, safe spaces and capitulation to authority is as anathema to me as stupidity and knitting circles

 

[hullsy47]

It’s fake.

Dreger just backtracked.no extension talk in place

 

[GoonieFace]

Me cry? As foreign as it may seem to you, I conduct myself like a typical Gen X man. Tears, safe spaces and capitulation to authority is as anathema to me as stupidity and knitting circles

Lol, this is a hockey forum, keep the big words out of it

 

[ACC1224]

Dreger just backtracked.no extension talk in place

He said there were extension talks now he's saying there isn't?

 

[Madap]

I really hate defending Marner, but, the comments against him are just looney.

I have a clear vision of a shift on game 7, where he gained the zone and was circling in the zone looking for a F to pass to (Domi or Bert at that point) and both were engaging in stupidity, and neither looking to go to open ice, or a passing position. ...then Marner got clobbered and lost the puck.
Now, it looked bad on Marner, but, whose fault was is really??

Marner is a playmaker/passer, not a goal scorer, so, when he has nobody open to pass to, he's kinda screwed.

He really needs to work on his shot more(though its better than it was before), and use it more, as he doesnt even come close to using it enough to become a shooting threat.

then there is the idiot Keefe who puts Marner and Domi together, a 85% pass first guy (Marner) and a 95% pass first guy (Domi) with Bert who just SUCKED and never got open and couldnt receive a pass even if he was open!!!

I really hope we do not resign Bertuzzi!!

Well you convinced me. Can’t believe I overlooked that one time where he almost made a play but didn’t. Marner is a great game 7 player and it’s Domi and Bertuzzi’s fault he’s sucked over the past 10 years.

Sign this guy ASAP.

 

[hullsy47]

He said there were extension talks now he's saying there isn't?

On tsn radio

 

[ACC1224]

On tsn radio

Did he say why he he got it wrong?

 

[notDatsyuk]

People assume that trading Mitch suddenly makes the Leafs a better team.

1) Tre would have to hit a win in the trade. How many trades did he win in Calgary?
2) The team has to replace Mitch's 90 points through better defence or through like for like offence.
3) JT is no spring chicken his production will start to decline.
4) We need a 1A goalie to compete with perennial Veznia candidates Swayman, Vas, Bob
5) Our Defence is garbage we need to improve our D significantly, dressing Rielly up as a 1 when at best he is a 2 wont work any more.
6) We need some of our prospects to hit and stick and become impact players.
7) We need to improve team speed, we move the puck slow, we skate slow.
8) The bottom of our forward groups are useless anchors, Gregor, Dewar, Holmberg, Reaves, Jarnkrok, Kampft --- what do they do exactly to help this team win?
9) Berube's system in Toronto is yet to be proven effective, some say he was in the right place at the right time, some say he is the next coming of Bowman and is going to bring us to the promised land.

If fans think , we trade Mitch and all of a sudden we are on par with Florida/Boston and other elite teams in the East they are fooling themselves.

1 - not signing Mitch at $12Mx8 is already a win. If we don't have to give up assets to trade him, that's also good.

2 - Domi seemed to be working out just fine, at a fraction of the cost.

3 - JT's production is already declining. He's another, separate problem.

4, 5, 6, 7, 8 - true, and overpaying Marner isn't going to solve any of those issues. Trading him or letting him walk to free up the cap space may.

9 - we'll have to wait and see.

If fans think we overpay Mitch by even more than the last time, and all of a sudden we are on par with Florida/Boston and other elite teams in the East, they are fooling themselves, and haven't been paying attention.

 

[Nineteen67]

I think I'm addicted and could never be done with the team. I know how you feel though and my enthusiasm for watching has been going down last couple of years. I think there will many night where the game will be on, but I'm not paying much attention.



Interesting comment. Does that mean you're going to cry if you don't get your way and Marner's playing for another team? Or are you the type that's more likely to react violently when you don't get your way?



I think you're misunderstanding what people think - I doubt anyone assumes that trading Mitch makes us a better team. What people think is that considering how badly Marner plays after the first couple of playoff games, spending a ton of cap space on him is not the path to playoff success so it makes sense to try something else. It's an uphill battle no matter what for reasons you've stated so it's hard to see us winning a cup before the next rebuild no matter what. But however slim the chances are, committing to Marner for another lengthy term seems like it guarantees we'll fail.

Even Dubas realized that running it back wasn’t working.

 

[notDatsyuk]

If Marner is doing anything the coach doesn't want him doing, that is on the coach. You call him out or bench him. The accountability starts there. If he is doing everything the coach asks, then the right step in firing the coach has been taken. Rinse and repeat with Chief.

What about if he doesn't, and maybe can't, do what the coach wants him to do?

 

[notbias]

What a pathetically stupid 'stat', and one only fools could put any stock in. When are those who geek out over so-called 'advanced' stats going to learn that 'expected' doesn't mean jack shit? Actual performance matters, imaginary spreadsheet numbers are meaningless.

I gave you "real" stats, it is not my fault if you can't read them.

When he was on the ice, his team still lost despite him shooting an insanely high, and unsustainable shooting %.

It'd be good if you read entire posts before responding to a single part of it, it makes you look foolish otherwise.

Also, xGF% are predictive stats, and they were terrible, like his other two seasons, I was using xGF% to show that the more likely outcome is what happened in the majority of his seasons, not the outlier where he still was bad.

There should be a section of this site where you can only use points as stats and the simpletons can stay there.

 

[TMLBlueandWhite]

On tsn radio

This Seravelli guy knows as much as we do.

Wouldn't surprise me if he just comes to this site for his next article. I've become convinced this site is mined by the media and journalists for feeds. I can't even count the number of times I've read articles that looked like they just reworded a page from one of these threads.

If it looks familiar there's probably a good reason why.

 

[Notsince67]

What about if he doesn't, and maybe can't, do what the coach wants him to do?

Let's see the evidence. Good players have been called out across the league by their coaches

 

[Gary Nylund]

Me cry? As foreign as it may seem to you, I conduct myself like a typical Gen X man. Tears, safe spaces and capitulation to authority is as anathema to me as stupidity and knitting circles

So violent reaction then, got it.

 

[ToneDog]

This Seravelli guy knows as much as we do.

Wouldn't surprise me if he just comes to this site for his next article. I've become convinced this site is mined by the media and journalists for feeds. I can't even count the number of times I've read articles that looked like they just reworded a page from one of these threads.

If it looks familiar there's probably a good reason why.

I'm guessing Seravelli knows a little more than we do, even if he looks older than he is.

 

[Racer88]

How else do they use 18 million in cap space?

They are going to have to use some of it to replace the players that have left to provide that 18 mill. Not all of it will be attributed to improvements

 

[Ports]

You're wrong about Kadri, almost every Leaf fan wanted him gone at the time. And there was no uproar to keep Hyman, most thought he was whatever. This is completely different.

If millions of fans weren't calling for Marner's head right now we would have no talk of moving him and management wouldn't even flinch, I guarantee it. If you can't see how that logic works idek how to explain it to you.

We'll have to agree to disagree I guess.

I disagreed with both trading Kadri and letting Hyman walk. Their mistake was signing JT when they had 30 goal Kadri + an extra $6.5M for a defenseman. Not giving Hyman the No Trade protection when he would have accepted less money to remain a Leaf was also foolish. Dubas got nothing of value in the Kadri trade who goes on to become an integral part of Colorado’s cup run and they’re still looking for a replacement for Hyman.

 

[Hellcat]

1 - not signing Mitch at $12Mx8 is already a win. If we don't have to give up assets to trade him, that's also good.

2 - Domi seemed to be working out just fine, at a fraction of the cost.

3 - JT's production is already declining. He's another, separate problem.

4, 5, 6, 7, 8 - true, and overpaying Marner isn't going to solve any of those issues. Trading him or letting him walk to free up the cap space may.

9 - we'll have to wait and see.

If fans think we overpay Mitch by even more than the last time, and all of a sudden we are on par with Florida/Boston and other elite teams in the East, they are fooling themselves, and haven't been paying attention.

Totally agree, the solution is not just one move. Can't over pay and cant expect one trade to fix all.

 

[Ports]

If they are making moves based on what they think the fans want, this team will have no hope.

.

If the GM starts listening to what the fans want, he’ll end up sitting next to them in the stands.