Player Discussion Mitch Marner - On Hiatus

[rumman]

220 plus pages in and all I can say is team Marner are as delusional or more than the Dubas disciples..............

 

[thewave]

220 plus pages in and all I can say is team Marner are as delusional or more than the Dubas disciples..............

We are getting into defending his clicks per 60 on sportsnet articles now.

 

[PromisedLand]

I think with a good coach Lily is doing mighty fine right now. Keefe is a basketcase coach imho.

I would not trade Lily in a package with Marner unless it makes total sense.

I am finally at my laptop so can post pics (HF is working like shit on my phone)

Rielly played about 300+ games in NHL before his breakout season. And lets be honest playing D in AHL and NHL is not the same. D-men take time to develop.

Rielly was also not a yo-yo and got consistent playing time for development purposes.

Liljegren's partners have been what? Oldman Gio; now Brodie and then Edmundson for a little bit? How is Lily supposed to develop and learn from as his D partner?

People laugh at it but I think Hainsey had a lot of good impact on Rielly's game. Lily has been unfortunate as he has never had a good partner from whom he can learn and develop. Its on Keefe and management for being complete JACKASSES IMO.

Liljegren has played about 196 games in the NHL

Lily

 

[Stephen]

We had this kid jump from 800K to 10.9M. He has not lived up to his side of the bargain, it's over. Go enjoy head fakes and secondary assists on another team that doesn't care about making sacrifices. It's always excuses with this guy. I was in this thread praising him after game 6 because I thought he had a great game. But he just doesn't have that finishing ability like a Pasta, and he shouldn't be paid MORE than players he's below in skill, talent, heart, determination, ability, resilience.

In terms of ELC contract to second deal, only McDavid ($12.5 million), Matthews ($11.6 million) have made a bigger jump in AAV than Marner ($10.9 million). Eichel is next at $10 million.

I ask myself, did Mitch Marner have the 3rd greatest first three years in the NHL in this era to justify that initial contract? Answer is probably not.

Since then, has he scored 40 goals? No. Has he scored 100 points? No. Has he contended for a scoring title? No. Has he won a major award? No. Has he won one of the other awards? No. Has he won a Stanley Cup? No. Has he been to the finals. No. Has he been to the conference finals? No.

And yet, he wants a raise to $12.5 million? How about no?

 

[HamiltonNHL]

HF is working like shit on my phone

use mobile brave

I ask myself,

did Mitch Marner have the 3rd greatest first three years in the NHL in this era to justify that initial contract?

Since then, has he scored 40 goals? No.

Has he scored 100 points? No

. Has he contended for a scoring title? No.

Has he won a major award? No.

Has he won one of the other awards? No.

Has he won a Stanley Cup? No.

Has he been to the finals. No.

Has he been to the conference finals? No.

Was he negotiating with a newbie GM who rolled over ?

Yes.

 

[PromisedLand]

Sportsnet's Luke Fox, has made a keen observation about Maple Leafs GM Brad Treliving's comments on Mitch Marner and how they differ from how he spoke of Matthews and Nylander.​

​

Last off-season Leafs GM Brad Treliving made it known that his priorities were to get Auston Matthews and William Nylander to put pen to paper on extensions.

While Matthews signed in late August, it took a little longer to get Nylander to sign, but they both got done and they will be Leafs together for at least the next four seasons.

With Mitch Marner and John Tavares able to sign extensions in less than a month, Treliving's tone has been quite different. While he has not openly discussed Tavares, Treliving responded to the comments made by Marner's agent Darren Ferris this week while in Buffalo for the scouting combine. His comments caught the attention of Sportsnet's Luke Fox, who was on "Leafs Morning Take" today and noted the difference in tone when asked about the Marner situation.
​

 

[PromisedLand]

It is not the hate, it is that is MM even believe that he can do well in the playoffs?
Bc when the pressure(100mil extension) was on last playoffs, he choked big time. I just don't think he can do it under even more pressure this season.

If Marner and his cap hit pulled the Leafs over the bump do you think we even have this discussion? On the contrary, Marner is the biggest culprit when it comes to putting up offense from Gm5 to Gm7 he SUCKS ASS

AND

He never takes responsibility; its always someone else's fault. Meanwhile, his camp is a money hungry trashcan that want all the money. They did it the day Matthews signed his RFA deal (same f***ing day Ferris was out saying Marner will get what he is worth) and then again... just this month Ferris is out running his mouth.

Mitch Marner and Toronto Maple Leafs need a divorce. And NEED IT NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[PromisedLand]

Well, he had his chances. The thing is this is a get it done league and he just couldn't get it done.

If I am MM, I would start throwing videos and clips of him working out and bulking up, also working on his shots on social medias in order to at least show the fan bases that he is working on his weaknesses. Hopefully to gain some positive vibes.

LMAO it won't fly. DO you remember the "fan letter" after he signed his RFA deal? People were pissed

The irony is the Leafs offered him a 7 year deal that his side scoffed at, and they settled for a 6 year deal instead...had he signed the 7 year deal, Tavares' contract would end before his, so he would have still been around with JT off the books...karma is a funny thing.

hockey gods finally throwing us a bone

 

[rumman]

We are getting into defending his clicks per 60 on sportsnet articles now.

what's this mean?

 

[Punch Drunk Loov]

In terms of ELC contract to second deal, only McDavid ($12.5 million), Matthews ($11.6 million) have made a bigger jump in AAV than Marner ($10.9 million). Eichel is next at $10 million.

I ask myself, did Mitch Marner have the 3rd greatest first three years in the NHL in this era to justify that initial contract? Answer is probably not.

Since then, has he scored 40 goals? No. Has he scored 100 points? No. Has he contended for a scoring title? No. Has he won a major award? No. Has he won one of the other awards? No. Has he won a Stanley Cup? No. Has he been to the finals. No. Has he been to the conference finals? No.

And yet, he wants a raise to $12.5 million? How about no?

You could trade Marner for anyone on the Florida Panthers roster, obtain the better player and have millions in savings from a contract signed 5 years ago.

I'm so over this guy. I still recall Marner filming that video where he read a hand written note on a rooftop after gouging the Leafs and threatening to play for the Zurich Lions or signing an offer sheet. He may very well be worth 12.5M, but I'm certain he won't live up to it on our team. He has more puck over glass penalties than goals in elimination games

 

[HamiltonNHL]

This thread should be for Trade Marner discussion only.

Any talk of offering Marner a contract is NOT what Tre wants and will handicap the team forever. People wanting Marner to stay are essentially Habs fans that want the Leafs to suck even longer than they have.

 

[ACC1224]

That’s the thing, most of these players aren’t available. Smart teams tend to keep them, but when they are available you need to have the cap space and/or the pieces required in order to get them.

My main point was that so much is made of all the playoff points Marner has, but how has that translated into playoff round wins? And yes, that is not all on Marner, but he is now the odd man out with Shanahan already having committed to Matthews and Nylander. Matthews is a legit #1 center, although he also hasn’t been able to be the difference maker in the playoffs, so it makes sense to retain him. As for Nylander, he has shown in the last few playoffs that he can be a difference maker.

Unfortunately, those proven players are rarely available as the smarter teams tend to hang onto them. And by proven playoff performers I mean those players who are willing to go into the dirty areas to get the puck, the players who will take the hit in order to make a play, who have that extra gear that's necessary in the playoffs, and who aren't afraid to engage in a scrum (but not to the point of taking an unnecessary penalty).

I believe that of our three, Matthews is the closest one to being that type of player (not counting the Stamkos encounter last playoffs), and Marner is the furthest. Bertuzzi and Domi are that type of player, but bvoth will probably be able to get more than we are willing to pay them, from another team. Both McCabe and Benoit are definitely that kind of player. Cowan may turn out to be that type as well. So we do have a few.

You had mentioned proven game 5-7 players. I’m not surprised they’re hard to find. Wonder how hard it is to find the PPG stat league wide for games 5-7?

In terms of ELC contract to second deal, only McDavid ($12.5 million), Matthews ($11.6 million) have made a bigger jump in AAV than Marner ($10.9 million). Eichel is next at $10 million.

I ask myself, did Mitch Marner have the 3rd greatest first three years in the NHL in this era to justify that initial contract? Answer is probably not.

Since then, has he scored 40 goals? No. Has he scored 100 points? No. Has he contended for a scoring title? No. Has he won a major award? No. Has he won one of the other awards? No. Has he won a Stanley Cup? No. Has he been to the finals. No. Has he been to the conference finals? No.

And yet, he wants a raise to $12.5 million? How about no?

When did he ask for a raise?

 

[Antropovsky]

In terms of ELC contract to second deal, only McDavid ($12.5 million), Matthews ($11.6 million) have made a bigger jump in AAV than Marner ($10.9 million). Eichel is next at $10 million.

I ask myself, did Mitch Marner have the 3rd greatest first three years in the NHL in this era to justify that initial contract? Answer is probably not.

Since then, has he scored 40 goals? No. Has he scored 100 points? No. Has he contended for a scoring title? No. Has he won a major award? No. Has he won one of the other awards? No. Has he won a Stanley Cup? No. Has he been to the finals. No. Has he been to the conference finals? No.

And yet, he wants a raise to $12.5 million? How about no?

On top of his undeserved contract, Instead of putting the work in the offseason (after numerous individual playoff failures), him and "his group" are focused on endorsement opportunities, business opportunities and his foundation. Toronto is just a money maker for "his group". Hence why they are going to fight tooth and nail not to be moved.

You had mentioned proven game 5-7 players. I’m not surprised they’re hard to find. Wonder how hard it is to find the PPG stat league wide for games 5-7?


When did he ask for a raise?

You were shown the game 5-7 stat wide for core 4 and Rielly... and how Marner compared to them. It's pretty clear who the weak link is for this Team. Which is all that matters.

 

[Punch Drunk Loov]

You had mentioned proven game 5-7 players. I’m not surprised they’re hard to find. Wonder how hard it is to find the PPG stat league wide for games 5-7?


When did he ask for a raise?

I think you know he is seeking a massive contract and with it a raise.

 

[Antropovsky]

Marner Assist Foundation financial details attached.

Looks like a huge jump in revenue and expenses in two years. Bonnie and Paul are directors.

This is a tough situation for them, could he leave amicably and still run the foundation? Or would it fold. I don't think players ever continue their foundations. Lukes Troops or whatever it was ended or may have been transferred to a teammate for a bit (Dion?).

T3010 Registered Charity Information Return

apps.cra-arc.gc.ca

 

[ACC1224]

I think you know he is seeking a massive contract and with it a raise.

I tend to wait for the facts to come out before worrying.

I do find it funny when something is made up, treated as fact and then people get upset by it.

This thread has delivered many laughs, hall of fame worthy IMO.

 

[PromisedLand]

Have you guys checked out the comments on his Instagram? It's a literal shit show of negativity

 

[Gallagbi]

Marner Assist Foundation financial details attached.

Looks like a huge jump in revenue and expenses in two years. Bonnie and Paul are directors.

This is a tough situation for them, could he leave amicably and still run the foundation? Or would it fold. I don't think players ever continue their foundations. Lukes Troops or whatever it was ended or may have been transferred to a teammate for a bit (Dion?).

T3010 Registered Charity Information Return

apps.cra-arc.gc.ca

Luke's troops became Lupe's Troops and they still honour military now. Just can't recall the name of it now.

Is Marners foundation tied to the Leafs at all? I haven't noticed it at any of the games

 

[thewave]

what's this mean?

Basically he is worth more to the owners of this hockey teams media division than he is worth to the Leafs on the ice..

 

[Notsince67]

Or why don't you do the work to defend your argument instead of always asking others to.

What star players with playoff success have similar traits to Marner?

BTW add lack of speed as a major reason Marner struggles in the playoffs. No shot and scared of dirty areas also being big.

Defend what exactly? I've been pretty clear what I think is the right avenue and it is always backed up if unclear. This is in direct contrast than your ham fisted bumbling attempts to use statistics to make a dumb point.

 

[thewave]

Luke's troops became Lupe's Troops and they still honour military now. Just can't recall the name of it now.

Is Marners foundation tied to the Leafs at all? I haven't noticed it at any of the games

Its just another foundation that does some good here and there. Employs a bunch of his family members apparently. Basically a tax evading grift seeming type of thing. You know like Bono and the One foundation where approximately 1.7% or something of the money they brought in made it to the target cause.

 

[Mess]

Ex-Leaf Jay Rosehill went on an impassioned rant this week about why the Toronto Maple Leafs shouldn't even consider running it back with the same core.

Rosehill is a part of the team over at "The Leafs Nation" and is a co-host of the popular "Leafs Morning Take" podcast alongside Nick Alberga. His rants have become something of a spectacle, as his passion and fire for the game seem to really come through. His experience in the league is important as well. This week, the former Leaf said what many fans in Toronto are thinking, which is that there is no way that this organization can begin this season with the Core 4 remaining intact after another very disappointing first round loss.

But the fact of the matter is that something needs to change with this team, because if not, then they're just going to keep running in circles until the window completely closes.

Groundhog day !!!!

 

[Notsince67]

I asked for your opinion on how Marner played in our last 2 playoff series, period. It's a very simple question, not leading in any way and you can jump through all the hoops you want, the simple truth is that you're not answering the question. IMO there were 3 possible ways this could go:

1 - you admit that in you opinion, Marner played poorly
2 - you say that Marner played well (meaning you're either lying or you don't understand hockey)
3 - you deflect, refusing to answer the question

I figured the odds of #3 happening were about 99% and that's exactly what happened. Make all the excuse you want, give all the "reasons" you want but we all know it's bullshit. Marner played like crap, you know it, I know it, everyone else knows it and your intellectual dishonesty is preventing you from admitting it and as a result, what's left of your credibility takes a hit.

This is where you go on an insulting rant about how smart you are, and how stupid everyone is that doesn't fall for you bullshit.

Over to you.

Your presuppositions about my comments are again full of lies. They are very clear. Why don't you go play in the kiddie pool instead of playing grown up?

If that happens, and I don’t believe it will, then what Tre and Pelley said at the presser meant jackshit! But I believe they meant what they said, that the previous plan has not worked (6 years with this core has proven that), and major changes are needed, which will include not resigning Marner! Tre knows that a more balanced lineup is crucial, and by paying 4 forwards that much, this cannot be done.


You get it!

You can only control the possible. Tre has never indicated he is willing to let Marner go for nothing. He has narrow options.

 

[Antropovsky]

Luke's troops became Lupe's Troops and they still honour military now. Just can't recall the name of it now.

Is Marners foundation tied to the Leafs at all? I haven't noticed it at any of the games

Good point, I used to see Lukes Troops alot during broadcasts but haven't seen any Marner Assist at games.

 

[PromisedLand]

Has Matthews ever won anything worth mentioning?

And he will win Rocket again this season.

Sure there are no "Team Accomplishments" but quite frankly for team accomplishments, especially in hockey, you need help from your teammates, linemates, coach and management.

Matthews is a generational player, Marner types come and go. marner isn't in Matthews' tier man.

Matthews needs to do more sure.... but IMO he had to carry the deadweight that is Marner on his line. Matthews was the only shooter, and when Matthews makes plays Marner wouldn't shoot, figure skate forcing plays and turnover the puck. Have you ever seen Marner cycle the f***ing puck in the playoffs? Matthews can cycle and hold on to the puck, he wins board battles more often than not and then when he makes a play there is nobody to make something out of it. Matthews alone can't do it all.

Imagine McDavid doing everything without having Bouchard shooting rockets from the point; Drai and Hyman not shooting the puck.

Team construction matters. Matthews is paid really high AAV for a short-term that I agree but Matthews is also pretty good!