Mitch Marner discussion continues

[Oscar Peterson]

how many good passes did Marner even make to Matthews? My recollection is that every chance Matthews had was either set up by himself or from Hyman (or that good play by Holl). Which is at least understandable, since Montreal's entire gameplan for dealing with the top line was to stop Marner from passing to Matthews and having Matthews score. But while Matthews adjusted by becoming a pass first player and setting up Hyman and Marner for all kinds of good chances, Marner just couldn't make Montreal pay for daring him to take all the shots he wanted

Exactly what I saw as well... too bad Keefe couldn't see it somehow

 

[Gallagbi]

Exactly what I saw as well... too bad Keefe couldn't see it somehow

I think he saw it, he just bet on him to break through eventually. He waited out a few of those slumps together during the season too.

 

[keonsbitterness]

Point is definitely an abnormally good performer in the playoffs. Unfortunately, Marner is an abnormally bad playoff performer

Both talented players. Maybe Point's drive is just that much better than Marner's.

 

[Oscar Peterson]

I think he saw it, he just bet on him to break through eventually. He waited out a few of those slumps together during the season too.

If he did see it and still didn't bother making any tactical adjustments, that's even worse imo

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

Exactly what I saw as well... too bad Keefe couldn't see it somehow

He probably could, and I'm sure they also know it's been like 85 games without a powerplay goal for Marner. I think it's more of an issue where they believe demoting him is more trouble than it's worth, with him trying to force his way out of Toronto when he felt disrespected by Babcock/Lou.

 

[Gallagbi]

If he did see it and still didn't bother making any tactical adjustments, that's even worse imo

Felt like lack of finish was more of a problem than lack of chances. Keefe only influences one of those.

Matthews didn't generate as much as normal, but as a result Hyman and Marner generated more. I don't have the numbers in front of me to back it up, but that's what it felt like.

 

[Oscar Peterson]

Felt like lack of finish was more of a problem than lack of chances. Keefe only influences one of those.

Matthews didn't generate as much as normal, but as a result Hyman and Marner generated more. I don't have the numbers in front of me to back it up, but that's what it felt like.

Lack of finish because Matthews was shadowed by Danault (one of the best defensive players in hockey). Marner was getting a ton of chances but was pretty obviously playing terrible, and was bringing down Matthews at ES and on the PP. Keefe's got to get a different look for Matthews, and failing to do so was inexcusable imo.

 

[JT AM da real deal]

I feel bad for the flack that Paul Marner gets sometimes. Our first introduction to Marner was as an aggressive hockey parent on that CBC documentary as Mitch is losing a playoff game but his message is a little too on the nose.

Mitch fails to score and his team gets blown out in elimination and his dad tells him he only showed up in the third, should hit guys to make his presence known and “was that just another game?”

Paul gave up on da hitting thing as Mitch did try 1 playoff series and he got hurt every time he tried to engage .. that was it for that in peewee .. Mitch can't get into physical hockey he really can't handle it .. and he does not like it at all either .. there are many Paul's out there .. but only 1 i know who went to task video taping games and practices for ongoing development .. i never saw before

 

[Gallagbi]

Lack of finish because Matthews was shadowed by Danault (one of the best defensive players in hockey). Marner was getting a ton of chances but was pretty obviously playing terrible, and was bringing down Matthews at ES and on the PP. Keefe's got to get a different look for Matthews, and failing to do so was inexcusable imo.

Matthews saw looks with a few different lines but never for a full game. He was also double shifted to get away from Danault at various times. Lack of opportunities didn't hurt them, it was lack of conversion.

 

[IPS]

What does last year have to do with anything?
I'm saying that a 25% shooting percentage is pretty lucky for a guy who didnt break 13% in the regular season. You don't have to believe me. Stay obtuse.

What does last year have to do with anything? Are you even bothering to follow along with the conversation?

You said "well let's see if Point can shoot like that on playoff price" and I referenced that he didn't have any issues scoring on a red hot Korpisalo from last year (who Marner also shot 0% against) - so it's not so far out to assume he'll score on Price too.

And what about regular season sh%? Mackinnon shot 9.7% in the regular season and shot over 21% these playoffs. Do you not understand the concept of players elevating their game in the playoffs?

 

[killer1980]

He probably could, and I'm sure they also know it's been like 85 games without a powerplay goal for Marner. I think it's more of an issue where they believe demoting him is more trouble than it's worth, with him trying to force his way out of Toronto when he felt disrespected by Babcock/Lou.

And maybe, just maybe, Babcock was right about Marner.

 

[Gabriel426]

I am never good in math but I think 1% is still better than 0%.

Marner didn't have a good playoffs.
AM didn't have a good playoffs.
Willie had a great playoffs.
Kerfoot had a great playoffs.
Spezza had a great playoffs.
Leafs didn't have a good playoffs. Heck, I think Leafs(MGT and players) need to understand that the regular season is only 82 games and not 89 games. While 56 games and not 63 for this season.

Marner can score 200 pts in the regular season but if he still gets ZERO goal and played the way he did in the last few playoffs, it means nothing.
Same with Danualt. If he is on the Leafs, he might not even beat out Kerfoot as 3C. But if he can do whatever he is doing now in future playoffs, I would rather have him than AM, JT and Kerfoot as our C.
Would you rather have a McDavid and Drai winning Hart or Art Ross, AM winning the Rocket or Carlson winning Norris on your team and can't advance to the 2nd round or a team without any individual awards winner but end up playing in the Cup Finals.

 

[stickty111]

Based on these last few pages, we are at the point where Marner fans are hoping his comparables fail so Marner doesn't look bad. Comments like lets see Point score against Price is a perfect example. We have hit a whole another level of embarassment. Point and Barzal have taken Marner to school on performance in the playoffs.
Point is on a legendary playoff goal scoring streak, while Marner is known for delay of game penalties.

 

[Gallagbi]

Based on these last few pages, we are at the point where Marner fans are hoping his comparables fail so Marner doesn't look bad. Comments like lets see Point score against Price is a perfect example. We have hit a whole another level of embarassment. Point and Barzal have taken Marner to school on performance in the playoffs.
Point is on a legendary playoff goal scoring streak, while Marner is known for delay of game penalties.

I think you're nuts if you're expecting Point or anyone to shoot consistently like he has all playoffs.

 

[stickty111]

I think you're nuts if you're expecting Point or anyone to shoot consistently poke he has all playoffs.

Oh Point's streak isn't my expectation, but raising your game is. We saw Nylander do it this playoffs and usually Matthews.

 

[killer1980]

Based on these last few pages, we are at the point where Marner fans are hoping his comparables fail so Marner doesn't look bad. Comments like lets see Point score against Price is a perfect example. We have hit a whole another level of embarassment. Point and Barzal have taken Marner to school on performance in the playoffs.
Point is on a legendary playoff goal scoring streak, while Marner is known for delay of game penalties.

I wonder how many here would rather have Cole Caufield wearing the blue and white than MM. I know I would. He would at least stick his nose in there and can score in the playoffs.

 

[Gabriel426]

Based on these last few pages, we are at the point where Marner fans are hoping his comparables fail so Marner doesn't look bad. Comments like lets see Point score against Price is a perfect example. We have hit a whole another level of embarassment. Point and Barzal have taken Marner to school on performance in the playoffs.
Point is on a legendary playoff goal scoring streak, while Marner is known for delay of game penalties.

I always thought Marner's comparable is Kuch.

 

[ShaneFalco]

Based on these last few pages, we are at the point where Marner fans are hoping his comparables fail so Marner doesn't look bad. Comments like lets see Point score against Price is a perfect example. We have hit a whole another level of embarassment. Point and Barzal have taken Marner to school on performance in the playoffs.
Point is on a legendary playoff goal scoring streak, while Marner is known for delay of game penalties.

Don't forget fancy passes and fly-bys

 

[JT AM da real deal]

I wonder how many here would rather have Cole Caufield wearing the blue and white than MM. I know I would. He would at least stick his nose in there and can score in the playoffs.

Cole has flat out speed as well as good skill .. Mitch has more skill but in playoff hockey SPEED wins out

 

[killer1980]

Cole has flat out speed as well as good skill .. Mitch has more skill but in playoff hockey SPEED wins out

He's a bonafide goal scorer and looks like he's got some toughness too.

 

[JT AM da real deal]

I always thought Marner's comparable is Kuch.

Kuch has a rocket man .. take a look at his one timer .. power, skill and location on a bomb

 

[Antropovsky]

Video of Marner love letter: Marner on staying with Maple Leafs: 'It's where I've always wanted to be' - Sportsnet.ca

WTF was the purpose of the letter? Starts by reading all the Leaf legends, talks about the Raptors victories... speaks for his entire team on multiple occasions (like he's their leader)...oh and don't forget talking about his sacrifices to get here.... playing in cold rinks and long bus rides in London. Hahaha most kids feels privileged to play hockey growing up and he makes it sound like he was in a war.

RFA signing his RFA contract and acts like he's LeBron and made "the decision"

 

[Gallagbi]

Video of Marner love letter: Marner on staying with Maple Leafs: 'It's where I've always wanted to be' - Sportsnet.ca

WTF was the purpose of the letter? Starts by reading all the Leaf legends, talks about the Raptors victories... speaks for his entire team on multiple occasions (like he's their leader)...oh and don't forget talking about his sacrifices to get here.... playing in cold rinks and long bus rides in London. Hahaha most kids feels privileged to play hockey growing up and he makes it sound like he was in a war.

RFA signing his RFA contract and acts like he's LeBron and made "the decision"

He bit off more than he could chew and that was when he realized. Expectations and perception change real quick when you're asking to be paid like a top 5 player.

 

[freshwind]

Cole has flat out speed as well as good skill .. Mitch has more skill but in playoff hockey SPEED wins out

this reminds me of a buddy in high school... super skilled hockey player ... dominated up until midget, once he hit jr b he was still pretty much the best skilled and high iq player but way too slow... led his team in scoring every year but we would always bug him that he had to get by the same guy 3 times on a rush LOL ... skill alone does not produce... speed alone does not produce ... when you can combine the 2 you have a winner ...

 

[1specter]

Believe.

At least you're self aware I guess