Miscellaneous NHL Discussion LXXXVII: What An Ugly Number

[TheKingPin]

Yeah what were thinking with Frost? Post draft:

2nd in OHL in scoring, 4th in PPG
4TH in OHL in scoring, 2nd in PPG was only .01 behind Robertson
Led LV in PPG, 2ND in points....almost the same PPG as Robertson in Ahl
Got hurt and missed a year
Led LV IN PPG, everyone was shit in NHL....top scorer had 52 pts.

The Frost disappointment is severely overstated. Everything was looking great until he got hurt and missed a year. His only bad season on the ice was last year in the NHL when not one player actually had a good year..

Yes this next year is important for him. Unfortunately this team lacks players who drive offense where kids can lean on. And given the 4th line is about to supply no offense, even more pressure will be on everyone else to produce.

Hopefully if they play together, the kid line catches magic and they all go on to great careers.

I think the injury, but also them trying to make him a checking forward or whatever they tried to do. At least they got a lot of blow back on that.

This year will be such an epic failure. I can’t wait to see how bad Fletcher will look.

 

[ajgoal]

This year will be such an epic failure. I can’t wait to see how bad Fletcher will look.

Why would Fletcher look bad? This is Torts' roster.

/s

 

[deadhead]

I think the injury, but also them trying to make him a checking forward or whatever they tried to do. At least they got a lot of blow back on that.

This year will be such an epic failure. I can’t wait to see how bad Fletcher will look.

The problem with Frost was that he was exposed at the NHL level, he didn't play with urgency off the puck, he lacked the top flight vision of G as a playmaker, and struggled in traffic.

They wanted him to get stronger and to play more of a two way game, centers have more defensive responsibilities than wings.
He did, then blew out his shoulder at 21 - nobody's fault, but it cost him a season and the beginning of last season.

What I saw was the addition of Tippett, and even better, pairing them with Cates, freed Frost to play a style more suited to his skill set, high paced where he can make plays off the rush but wasn't forced to hold the puck and find the open man on a regular basis. I think he lacks the vision of the top centers, but can be effective using his speed in open ice.

 

[renberg]

The reports I remember were that he just consider bringing Giroux back. Not even that he make a promise to re-sign him, just to circle back and see if they could make it work.

Would you have wanted to bring G back at 3/$7M?

 

[ajgoal]

Would you have wanted to bring G back at 3/$7M?

But that's not the question. The question is would you be willing to at least discuss a return contract in the offseason. And yes, I would be willing to have that discussion. If he is firm on 6.5 million, then you can always say you can't make it work and wish him luck.

Of course, I'd also like to think that I wouldn't have buried the roster under so many bad contracts that bringing him back at that price wouldn't have been out of the question had it made sense.

 

[BernieParent]

i dont understand how anyone can rank a young player just coming into nhl and playing only ever for a team as shit as the Flyers..

godam Mcjesus couldnt look good here..

put a player like Frost on a legit nhl team and id bet hes a way better player instantly..

It's a crying shame the Flyers didn't trade for Deslauriers seasons ago to prevent Frost from getting injured.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

So to get an expanded list the GM would have had to kiss Clodes ass and meet his condition's. Got it.

He was smart to refuse.

Chuck is a pushover!

Chuck should have caved to Giroux’s demands!

But that's not the question. The question is would you be willing to at least discuss a return contract in the offseason. And yes, I would be willing to have that discussion. If he is firm on 6.5 million, then you can always say you can't make it work and wish him luck.

Of course, I'd also like to think that I wouldn't have buried the roster under so many bad contracts that bringing him back at that price wouldn't have been out of the question had it made sense.

So you lie to Giroux when you know he’s not part of your plans going forward?

 

[blackjackmulligan]

Chuck is a pushover!

Chuck should have caved to Giroux’s demands!


So you lie to Giroux when you know he’s not part of your plans going forward?

Chuck is terrible GM. That is not debatable to me. That being said I will not crucify him for the Giroux deal.

Giroux picked his spot; no issue at all with him choosing his destination. Unless I see a list of what Florida offered the deal was never going to be a home run.

 

[Flyerfan18]

Fletcher refused to expand his options and make the best deal possible to improve the team. Normal day at work for him.

That’s not correct. Made up again. Only a few know what was actually discussed and it’s no one on this board

 

[Tripod]

Deslauriers gt paid more than Kessel

 

[deadhead]

Deslauriers gt paid more than Kessel

Well, given Kessel is retired (in spirit), that's not surprising.

 

[Angry Hockey Dad]

I love hotdogs so I would take Kessel any day

 

[Mkoll]

That’s not correct. Made up again. Only a few know what was actually discussed and it’s no one on this board

wait, then how do you know its "made up"?

 

[TheKingPin]

It’s very confusing. You could have likely brought back G for cheap and got a deal on JG = trying to be competitive. But you don’t don’t so you are trying to retool.

But then you also trade a lot of assets in terms of picks, cap space, and term for players, Nevermind they are bottom level players.

Lack of direction should doom anyone. I can’t imagine why Chuck still has a job.

 

[TheKingPin]

The problem with Frost was that he was exposed at the NHL level, he didn't play with urgency off the puck, he lacked the top flight vision of G as a playmaker, and struggled in traffic.

They wanted him to get stronger and to play more of a two way game, centers have more defensive responsibilities than wings.
He did, then blew out his shoulder at 21 - nobody's fault, but it cost him a season and the beginning of last season.

What I saw was the addition of Tippett, and even better, pairing them with Cates, freed Frost to play a style more suited to his skill set, high paced where he can make plays off the rush but wasn't forced to hold the puck and find the open man on a regular basis. I think he lacks the vision of the top centers, but can be effective using his speed in open ice.

The problem with Frost is not that he is not Giroux. He’s Frost and that’s ok.

Think of any relationship. You shouldn’t try and change someone. You help them grow and improve.

I agree with Tippett. He needs a Frost or Couts. I think they can both benefit from each other. I also like Tippett more than some on here.

 

[Beef Invictus]

So to get an expanded list the GM would have had to kiss Clodes ass and meet his condition's. Got it.

He was smart to refuse.

That's called making a deal. It's the GMs job. The deal offered was highly beneficial to Fletcher, but he decided to pull a Clarke and get all butthurt at a player asserting himself.

 

[Beef Invictus]

That’s not correct. Made up again. Only a few know what was actually discussed and it’s no one on this board

The source has already been posted multiple times.

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

The source has already been posted multiple times.

Heres comes the discrediting of the source in 3, 2, 1.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

wait, then how do you know its "made up"?

What’s “made up” is people here acting like they know for a fact. The only first-hand witness to talk is Briere, & he denies it.

 

[Surrounded By Ahos]

Deslauriers gt paid more than Kessel

Who do we think gets more points; Kessel in his one year with Vegas, or Deslauriers in his four with Philly?

 

[blackjackmulligan]

That's called making a deal. It's the GMs job. The deal offered was highly beneficial to Fletcher, but he decided to pull a Clarke and get all butthurt at a player asserting himself.

Of course. He was supposed to bow down and kiss the ring. I get it. How dare he tell him no extension. What dumb ass.

It cant possibly be he wanted the team to go in another direction without Clode can it?

What deal was offered? You keep saying this yet not providing any details.

 

[Striiker]

Guys, it doesn't matter than Fletchers been bent over and absolutely destroyed on every single trade he's made since becoming GM, proving he's completely incompetent, a horrible negotiator, and doesn't understand what pieces have value.

THIS TRADE is the one where he maximized the return and did the best anyone could have realistically done. You should be praising his work, not criticizing him for only getting a trash winger and a draft pick way out in the future.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Of course. He was supposed to bow down and kiss the ring. I get it. How dare he tell him no extension. What dumb ass.

It cant possibly be he wanted the team to go in another direction without Clode can it?

What deal was offered? You keep saying this yet not providing any details.

Considering Giroux was still competing with Couturier to be the team's clear best player, yes. What a dumbass.

Fletcher's idea of the team's direction is a heap of garbage and you know it. The team is worse without Giroux.

 

[blackjackmulligan]

Considering Giroux was still competing with Couturier to be the team's clear best player, yes. What a dumbass.

Fletcher's idea of the team's direction is a heap of garbage and you know it. The team is worse without Giroux.

He didn't want him back. One of the rare good moves he has made.

This is not about his direction. This is about 1 transaction.

The team stinks with or without Clode. It was time for both to cut the cord. If Clode even wanted to win in any way at all he would have asked out years ago.

You haven't talked about Ghost in while, go beat that horse.

 

[WIP CALLER]

Who do we think gets more points; Kessel in his one year with Vegas, or Deslauriers in his four with Philly?

Yeah but who will have more hits and fights?