OT: MIchigan Sports Thread: UM wins Natty Championship

[Perfect Human]

The Lions are low key a favorite this year and Dan Campbell is the odds on favorite to win Coach of The Year

 

[newfy]

It's not that it's offensive to think Lamar Jackson, despite his struggles the last few years, might be better than Jared Goff.

It's that Lamar Jackson is absolutely not worth more than the combination of:
* Goff
* At least one quality free agent signing
* Two first round picks

Trading for Lamar means you're pretty much running back the same rest of the roster. Sticking with Goff means you have tons of options to continue to improve the team around him.

Couldnt agree more.

Jackson might be an upgrade in this offense but its not some foregone conclusion and his health is a concern.

On top of that, youre giving up either both firsts this year so Carter/Anderson plus a high end corner potentially AND youre signing him to a huge contract.

He might be better than Goff but hes definitely not that big of an upgrade

 

[Ed Ned and Leddy]

I disagree, in the sense that they're building a team where Goff isn't the only QB that could be successful here. He's doing a much better job than I expected and I give him full credit for playing at a high level. But I think if Detroit continues with this plan, they'll have a very good roster around him, and could get a few more very good years out of either another veteran or a kid they draft soon and stash for a bit.

I definitely agree that we’re building a team where Goff isn’t the only QB that could be successful here. That’s why I wouldn’t overreact to his performance this year, which I agree was solid, and I’d be aggressive in bringing the next franchise QB in. I don’t want to pay Goff the extension he’s likely going to ask for.

I’d much rather roll the dice and give a guy like Lamar, who has proven that he can compete at an MVP level, a chance to play under a great young play caller in BJ and the best O line and weapons of his career.

I’m open to drafting a QB at #6 too, but I’m not convinced anyone is going to be there at this point, and there’s a ton of risk to any rookie QB unless they’re like a Joe Burrow talent (and even a guy like Lawrence has taken a couple years to find his footing).

I think you can build a very solid team around Jared Goff. Certainly the best Lions team in ages. But if you’re serious about competing for Super Bowls I don’t think he’s a guy you commit to.

 

[jkutswings]

I definitely agree that we’re building a team where Goff isn’t the only QB that could be successful here. That’s why I wouldn’t overreact to his performance this year, which I agree was solid, and I’d be aggressive in bringing the next franchise QB in. I don’t want to pay Goff the extension he’s likely going to ask for.

I’d much rather roll the dice and give a guy like Lamar, who has proven that he can compete at an MVP level, a chance to play under a great young play caller in BJ and the best O line and weapons of his career.

I’m open to drafting a QB at #6 too, but I’m not convinced anyone is going to be there at this point, and there’s a ton of risk to any rookie QB unless they’re like a Joe Burrow talent (and even a guy like Lawrence has taken a couple years to find his footing).

I think you can build a very solid team around Jared Goff. Certainly the best Lions team in ages. But if you’re serious about competing for Super Bowls I don’t think he’s a guy you commit to.

I'm certainly not opposed to considering a different QB long term, whether via draft or trade. I just don't think Lamar is that guy, even if he were free. WR production drops because the guy is more a runner than a passer, and I think his health is a real question mark going forward.

Let somebody else overpay for what a guy did a few years ago (and which I don't think he will ever repeat). Let Goff run things this year, see what the draft holds, and go from there.

 

[Ed Ned and Leddy]

Ah, Ramsey would've been a great add imo, but it's tough to fault a multi-millionaire for choosing Miami over Detroit.

Wouldn't mind hearing the price to bring Slay back, he could help bridge the gap if we do draft a Gonzalez/Witherspoon/Porter Jr.

 

[Ed Ned and Leddy]

I'm certainly not opposed to considering a different QB long term, whether via draft or trade. I just don't think Lamar is that guy, even if he were free. WR production drops because the guy is more a runner than a passer, and I think his health is a real question mark going forward.

Let somebody else overpay for what a guy did a few years ago (and which I don't think he will ever repeat). Let Goff run things this year, see what the draft holds, and go from there.

I hear you, and I think this is probably the prevailing opinion among Lions fans so I get it for sure.

To me, if you don't see Goff as the long-term solution (and I do not, despite liking the guy), this is the year to address it. Lamar would be my preference. #6OA is another option, but that relies on a) the FO believing in AR15 or Levis, and b) one of them being available (assuming Stroud and Young to 1-2).

This time next year, barring a nose dive which would of course be even worse, Goff is asking for a fat extension and our 1st is probably, idk, early teens? That doesn't give you a lot of flexibility imo.

It sounds aggressive, but if you don't make a trade or draft a quarterback this year, you are essentially committing to Goff for the foreseeable future in my eyes. And again I think you can build a very solid team there, maybe the best Lions team of my life, but that just wouldn't be my path forward if I'm Brad Holmes.

 

[newfy]

I hear you, and I think this is probably the prevailing opinion among Lions fans so I get it for sure.

To me, if you don't see Goff as the long-term solution (and I do not, despite liking the guy), this is the year to address it. Lamar would be my preference. #6OA is another option, but that relies on a) the FO believing in AR15 or Levis, and b) one of them being available (assuming Stroud and Young to 1-2).

This time next year, barring a nose dive which would of course be even worse, Goff is asking for a fat extension and our 1st is probably, idk, early teens? That doesn't give you a lot of flexibility imo.

It sounds aggressive, but if you don't make a trade or draft a quarterback this year, you are essentially committing to Goff for the foreseeable future in my eyes. And again I think you can build a very solid team there, maybe the best Lions team of my life, but that just wouldn't be my path forward if I'm Brad Holmes.

If you dont see Goff as worth it long term after the last season and a half, theres absolutely no reason to think Lamar is that guy either.

I dont need a guy thats thrown for over 3000 yards once in his career (barely at that) trying to hit Jamo downfield. People wanna complain about Goffs deep ball but if Lamar was here they would pull their hair out. Also be prepared to play Sudfeld 6 or 7 games when Lamar gets his inevitable injury.

I cant believe theres people who want to give up a bunch of assets (more than one first rounder) and sign Jackson to a mega deal when Goff is playing at the highest level of his career and is clearly playing better right now. Thats before even bringing the injuries into it

 

[Ed Ned and Leddy]

If you dont see Goff as worth it long term after the last season and a half, theres absolutely no reason to think Lamar is that guy either.

I dont need a guy thats thrown for over 3000 yards once in his career (barely at that) trying to hit Jamo downfield. People wanna complain about Goffs deep ball but if Lamar was here they would pull their hair out. Also be prepared to play Sudfeld 6 or 7 games when Lamar gets his inevitable injury.

I cant believe theres people who want to give up a bunch of assets (more than one first rounder) and sign Jackson to a mega deal when Goff is playing at the highest level of his career and is clearly playing better right now. Thats before even bringing the injuries into it

I get the injury concerns and I get the deep ball concerns.

Fundamentally, Jackson has shown me a level of play that Goff has not. I'd take on the risk to see if he can meet or exceed that level under this Ben Johnson offense. Personally I'd prefer to risk the Lions crashing and burning with Jackson then inevitably becoming the Kirk Cousins Vikings 2.0 under Goff.

 

[BSHH]

I get the injury concerns and I get the deep ball concerns.

Fundamentally, Jackson has shown me a level of play that Goff has not. I'd take on the risk to see if he can meet or exceed that level under this Ben Johnson offense. Personally I'd prefer to risk the Lions crashing and burning with Jackson then inevitably becoming the Kirk Cousins Vikings 2.0 under Goff.

The Lions have been - depending on one's stance - either been a joke or an embarrassment for a long time. This franchise (and perhaps even the city of Detroit, which currently endures long phases of hapless Red Wings, Tigers and Pistons) needs to build some respectability.

Right now they seem to be on a good path to becoming a playoff team again, with Goff as QB and some good draft picks to improve the defense (because their salary cap will be maxed out after re-signing players like Jl. Williams, Eliot and Cominskey, perhaps Chark will be already too expensive). I want the Lions to continue this path instead of hunting magic beans. The Lions still have to recover from the last time, when being a mere playoff team wasn't enough and risks were taken.

There might be a point in the future where the Lions have been bridesmaids too often. But here and now, the Lions need to be invited to the wedding for that problem to occur. And by the way, have Jackson's Ravens been so much better than Cousin's Vikings?

Gruß,
BSHH

 

[Ed Ned and Leddy]

The Lions have been - depending on one's stance - either been a joke or an embarrassment for a long time. This franchise (and perhaps even the city of Detroit, which currently endures long phases of hapless Red Wings, Tigers and Pistons) needs to build some respectability.

Right now they seem to be on a good path to becoming a playoff team again, with Goff as QB and some good draft picks to improve the defense (because their salary cap will be maxed out after re-signing players like Jl. Williams, Eliot and Cominskey, perhaps Chark will be already too expensive). I want the Lions to continue this path instead of hunting magic beans. The Lions still have to recover from the last time, when being a mere playoff team wasn't enough and risks were taken.

There might be a point in the future where the Lions have been bridesmaids too often. But here and now, the Lions need to be invited to the wedding for that problem to occur. And by the way, have Jackson's Ravens been so much better than Cousin's Vikings?

Gruß,
BSHH

I mean no but neither really have Allen's Bills or Herbert's Chargers and I'd still cut my arm off to have one of those guys in Honolulu Blue.

Your larger point I think is very fair. Goff sets the floor for this Lions team reasonably high. If people prefer steady, incremental growth and risk-aversion due to the Lions history I can definitely respect that. It's not my NFL philosophy, but I get why that's the stance of a lot of Lions fans right now.

 

[Ed Ned and Leddy]

Good add to the secondary

 

[newfy]

I get the injury concerns and I get the deep ball concerns.

Fundamentally, Jackson has shown me a level of play that Goff has not. I'd take on the risk to see if he can meet or exceed that level under this Ben Johnson offense. Personally I'd prefer to risk the Lions crashing and burning with Jackson then inevitably becoming the Kirk Cousins Vikings 2.0 under Goff.

Well yeah, he won an MVP three years ago so obviously he hit a crazy level. But since then he misses 6 games a year and cant throw the football.

You think having a QB run and get hurt is worth a couple firsts, thats fine but I'm really happy Detroit doesnt think so. 3 years is a long time in football. And if we do want to live in the past a bit Goff has hit a level in the past where he went to back to back pro bowls and threw for over 4600 yards twice. Over the last season and a half theres only a small handful of QBs who have outperformed Goff and Jackson is definitely not one of them

 

[Frk It]

How would you Lions fans feel about Bijan Robinson at #18 if you move on from Swift? Could be a nasty add to that offense, IMO.

I also think you might be able to get 1 of the 2 best defensive players in the draft at #6 with all these teams starving for QBs in the top 5.

 

[jkutswings]

How would you Lions fans feel about Bijan Robinson at #18 if you move on from Swift? Could be a nasty add to that offense, IMO.

I'd prefer to use both first rounders elsewhere and try to find a back later in the draft. But we'll see where free agency ends up and go from there.

I also think you might be able to get 1 of the 2 best defensive players in the draft at #6 with all these teams starving for QBs in the top 5.

Fingers crossed. I'd even consider moving up if there's a specific guy they grade out above everybody else, but if it's 1A vs 1B and one falls in their lap at 6, that's cool too.

Glad they already added a corner. But I hope they're not done, and continue being aggressive all spring/summer. As crazy as this sounds, The Detroit Lions need to strike while the iron is hot and challenge for the division right now.

 

[Ed Ned and Leddy]

Don’t think there was a perfect answer at LB but I could’ve lived without this deal.

 

[BSHH]

How would you Lions fans feel about Bijan Robinson at #18 if you move on from Swift? Could be a nasty add to that offense, IMO.

I also think you might be able to get 1 of the 2 best defensive players in the draft at #6 with all these teams starving for QBs in the top 5.

RB is a position with huge depth. After a few weeks, Pacheco started to become a dominant rusher for the Chiefs - who drafted him in the 7th round. Latavius Murray was signed off the street by the Broncos and instantly added a lot of rushing yards. I don't deny that B. Robinson is not only better, but special; however, drafting a RB early has almost never really paid off (including Swift). Therefore I prefer the Lions drafting to fill a different position at #18, even if Jl. Williams does not re-sign.

Gruß,
BSHH

 

[newfy]

How would you Lions fans feel about Bijan Robinson at #18 if you move on from Swift? Could be a nasty add to that offense, IMO.

I also think you might be able to get 1 of the 2 best defensive players in the draft at #6 with all these teams starving for QBs in the top 5.

Would be an exciting add but I likely lean against it. Someone like Chase Brown later on is wayyyy more appealing to me. I think thyre going to have a shot at Carter or Anderson at 6 for sure, and it kinda seems like Tyree Wilson is starting to get mocked in his own second tier on D after those guys. Walk away with one of those 3 and a DB at 18 I'm very happy. Replace the DB with Bijan, I'm excited to watch him for sure, but overall with how many solid backs there are I think its a little rich

 

[SpookyTsuki]

Yeah there’s really no point in drafting a rb early anymore.

 

[ManwithNoIdentity]

I want this guy to be a red wing so bad

Fantilli Named Big Ten Freshman of the Year - University of Michigan Athletics

Adam Fantilli of the University of Michigan ice hockey team was named the Big Ten Freshman of the Year when the all-conference awards were announced on Tuesd...

mgoblue.com

 

[Ed Ned and Leddy]

Understandable on paper but a huge emotional loss for a team that by all accounts puts a lot of weight on locker room atmosphere.

 

[Hen Kolland]

Understandable on paper but a huge emotional loss for a team that by all accounts puts a lot of weight on locker room atmosphere.

I’ll play devil’s advocate. I think that Jamaal Williams is not the good locker room guy that Lions fans have made him out to be.

He’s a self-admitted introvert and that he rarely spoke up in the locker room. I think he’s an emotional and lead by example type on the field, but I don’t view him as the glue that keeps everyone together.

For fans, it’s a big loss in terms of a guy who gave his all to the team, but Montgomery is a much better RB talent. I’d pay Montgomery 10 times over before I bring Jamaal back, knowing that these are the two options to consider.

 

[newfy]

Understandable on paper but a huge emotional loss for a team that by all accounts puts a lot of weight on locker room atmosphere.

Montgomery is a significant talent upgrade though. The guys is a consistent 1100 yards from scrimmage guy on what have been some horrible Chicago offenses/O-lines. In Detroit dont be surprised if he goes for 1500+ from scrimmage.

 

[Ed Ned and Leddy]

I’ll play devil’s advocate. I think that Jamaal Williams is not the good locker room guy that Lions fans have made him out to be.

He’s a self-admitted introvert and that he rarely spoke up in the locker room. I think he’s an emotional and lead by example type on the field, but I don’t view him as the glue that keeps everyone together.

For fans, it’s a big loss in terms of a guy who gave his all to the team, but Montgomery is a much better RB talent. I’d pay Montgomery 10 times over before I bring Jamaal back, knowing that these are the two options to consider.

Montgomery is a significant talent upgrade though. The guys is a consistent 1100 yards from scrimmage guy on what have been some horrible Chicago offenses/O-lines. In Detroit dont be surprised if he goes for 1500+ from scrimmage.

I get the move on paper, I can see Montgomery succeeding behind this line. I also think you're taking a risk when you move on from a back who lived in the endzone. We don't go on that late season run without Jamal's scoring consistency, and Montgomery will have to match/exceed that for this team to take a step forward.

Personally I don't think RB is the place I'd have shaken things up, but I understand the move and I understand why some people are really optimistic about it.

 

[jkutswings]

Barf. No objections to moving on from previous running backs. But that's supposed to be in order to draft a guy and pay him pennies, not to spend even more on an overrated guy who gets hurt.

Absolutely awful use of cap space.

 

[jfrank21]

He's missed 6 games in 4 years.....not sure that qualifies him as injury prone. We'll have to see what Jamaal signs for before we cry about use of cap space. I'm pumped for this move. Now we arent dependent on Swift's glass body to keep the backfield dynamic.