OT: MIchigan Sports Thread: UM wins Natty Championship

[jaster]

It's nice to have not heard from the contrarian-esque vocal minority (that of course included MBH lol) from back in the day that used to argue our crew wasn't very good. Ken was 'overrated' and Mick was 'a massive homer.' Those critiques were as ridiculous back then as they are today. This vote is a nice piece of vindication for Ken and Mick. They are indeed top notch.

 

[guinness]

So it's official:
Ferris State, Michigan State, Michigan Tech, Western Michigan make up 2022 GLI field as event moves to Grand Rapids, Mich. - College Hockey | USCHO.com

It's not "bad", adds some stability to the goofy schedule ever since the Wings and Pistons moved to LCA, but smaller for sure, and I hope that the teams rotate.

 

[Bondurant]

Too busy county TV deal and pizza money to care.

 

[DoMakc]

I'm not sure why are quoting Sportz, he is just a loud guy on twitter, not the most knowlegeable if i remember correctly - I think he was banned from the certain Tigers message board back in time. It's like somebody quoting Captain Bob/MBH to show how bad Red Wings are.

 

[izlez]

I don't know what a winning NFL organization actually looks like, but I really like what this staff is doing so far

 

[Ricelund]

I'm not sure why are quoting Sportz, he is just a loud guy on twitter, not the most knowlegeable if i remember correctly - I think he was banned from the certain Tigers message board back in time. It's like somebody quoting Captain Bob/MBH to show how bad Red Wings are.

Disagree, I think Gorosh knows quite a bit about baseball. And Avila's a horrible GM. It's not like he's saying anything that isn't obvious.

 

[FireBird71]

Casey Mize with Tommy John as expected

Casey Mize needs Tommy John surgery

DETROIT -- Tigers right-hander Casey Mize will undergo Tommy John surgery to replace the ulnar collateral ligament in his right elbow, manager A.J. Hinch announced Friday. Mize is expected to have the surgery next week. The rehab process will sideline the former No. 1 overall pick for the rest of

www.mlb.com

 

[RabidBadger]

Casey Mize with Tommy John as expected

Casey Mize needs Tommy John surgery

DETROIT -- Tigers right-hander Casey Mize will undergo Tommy John surgery to replace the ulnar collateral ligament in his right elbow, manager A.J. Hinch announced Friday. Mize is expected to have the surgery next week. The rehab process will sideline the former No. 1 overall pick for the rest of

www.mlb.com

If I'm a young pitcher with upside I would be avoiding Detroit at all costs. Mize, Fulmer, Perez, Norris, etc. all became 45 year old men in this orginization.

 

[Ed Ned and Leddy]

Little Casesars supplants Pizza Hut as the NFL's official pizza sponsor

The NFL has one Commissioner, but two caesars.

profootballtalk.nbcsports.com

A bit frustrating when: a) the Wings have one of the lowest payrolls in the NHL, b) the Tigers have a below average payroll and are in the midst of a catastrophic season, and c) the District Detroit promises, which were a major crux of the argument for tax funding the LCA, is still mostly parking lots.

 

[WingedWheel1987]

Little Casesars supplants Pizza Hut as the NFL's official pizza sponsor

The NFL has one Commissioner, but two caesars.

profootballtalk.nbcsports.com

A bit frustrating when: a) the Wings have one of the lowest payrolls in the NHL, b) the Tigers have a below average payroll and are in the midst of a catastrophic season, and c) the District Detroit promises, which were a major crux of the argument for tax funding the LCA, is still mostly parking lots.

I understand your frustration, but what's the point in spending to the cap if you are the Tigers or Wings? Teams that are rebuilding should not be spending to the cap. It negatively impacts your ability to rebuild.

I really can't blame the Ilitch family for taking free handouts. Why spend your own money when someone else is willing to pay?

They are really nice parking lot though. They have ground and fences. Those are some premium amenities.

As for the Tigers...How does Avila still have a job? The man has accomplished nothing, and it's not like in the case of the Wings and Holland where you could point to his previous successes to justify keeping him around.

 

[Ed Ned and Leddy]

I understand your frustration, but what's the point in spending to the cap if you are the Tigers or Wings? Teams that are rebuilding should not be spending to the cap. It negatively impacts your ability to rebuild.

I really can't blame the Ilitch family for taking free handouts. Why spend your own money when someone else is willing to pay?

They are really nice parking lot though. They have ground and fences. Those are some premium amenities.

As for the Tigers...How does Avila still have a job? The man has accomplished nothing, and it's not like in the case of the Wings and Holland where you could point to his previous successes to justify keeping him around.

I agree regarding the Wings, and honestly I'm not especially worried about ownership for the Wings. The salary cap keeps payroll so artificially low that I think ownership is smart enough to recognize that the branding benefits that come from operating and paying for a successful team, when the time comes, outweigh the cost savings of paying closer to the floor.

The Tigers' situation is unique I think because the AL Central is a mess. Cleveland and Kansas City have basically proven that they're not interested in paying for a competitive team, and will really only compete when they get a great mix of cost-controlled, home-grown players. The Twins are a pretty mediocre club in every facet. That leaves the Sox as our biggest competition in the division, and while they're willing to run a higher payroll, they're still not exactly an expertly run club.

Obviously every club is going to have to go through rebuilds or retools at certain points, and that's usually going to lower payroll, but I'm disappointed in ownership's reluctance to utilize its financial muscle to improve the Tigers.

On the LCA issue, I agree that it's a good business decision to bait and switch tax payers into funding your stadium. I just think it's scummy, and pretty emblematic of why southeast Michigan's economy is pretty bush league compared to more well-rounded cities in the States.

 

[SpookyTsuki]

Sounds like the Tiger players had a secret meeting

 

[bedtime20]

Can somebody ELI5 why the Tigers are so bad this year (i follow 0 baseball). I thought they were going to be pretty decent. Team chemistry or bad management, what’s wrong?

 

[jkutswings]

Can somebody ELI5 why the Tigers are so bad this year (i follow 0 baseball). I thought they were going to be pretty decent. Team chemistry or bad management, what’s wrong?

Decent pitching, historically bad hitting. There are questions whether their decent hitting last year was more a function of the juiced baseballs than the actual talent (or now lack thereof).

 

[Ricelund]

Can somebody ELI5 why the Tigers are so bad this year (i follow 0 baseball). I thought they were going to be pretty decent. Team chemistry or bad management, what’s wrong?

The bullpen has been great despite several injuries.

The starting pitching has been decent despite several injuries.

The offense has been absolutely putrid. Like historically bad. They're getting nothing from their veterans, including Baez, who was their big FA signing this offseason. Cabrera's been their best hitter at age 39. Torkelson (#1OA in 2020) hasn't done anything. Greene (their other top prospect) has been out all season with an injury but should be back in the lineup soon.

They've scored 168 runs in 62 games, putting them on pace for 439 runs this season. To put that in perspective, the 2003 team that lost 119 games scored 591 runs.

The whole team has hit 31 home runs this year. Aaron Judge (Yankees) has hit 25 home runs already.

Hinch is a good manager. They have one of the best pitching coaches in baseball. I think it's just a lack of talent in the lineup.

 

[bedtime20]

Decent pitching, historically bad hitting. There are questions whether their decent hitting last year was more a function of the juiced baseballs than the actual talent (or now lack thereof).

The bullpen has been great despite several injuries.

The starting pitching has been decent despite several injuries.

The offense has been absolutely putrid. Like historically bad. They're getting nothing from their veterans, including Baez, who was their big FA signing this offseason. Cabrera's been their best hitter at age 39. Torkelson (#1OA in 2020) hasn't done anything. Greene (their other top prospect) has been out all season with an injury but should be back in the lineup soon.

They've scored 168 runs in 62 games, putting them on pace for 439 runs this season. To put that in perspective, the 2003 team that lost 119 games scored 591 runs.

The whole team has hit 31 home runs this year. Aaron Judge (Yankees) has hit 25 home runs already.

Hinch is a good manager. They have one of the best pitching coaches in baseball. I think it's just a lack of talent in the lineup.

Thank you, that explains it.

 

[Hen Kolland]

They're getting nothing from their veterans, including Baez, who was their big FA signing this offseason

Baez is easily on pace to go down as the worst free agent signing in the history of the Tigers, if not all of baseball.

 

[Ricelund]

Double post

 

[Ricelund]

Baez is easily on pace to go down as the worst free agent signing in the history of the Tigers, if not all of baseball.

Yeah, when Al's been allowed to spend he's done an absolutely awful job. He needs to be fired. He probably should've been fired after the disastrous 2015 FA signings:

- Justin Upton ($106 million/5)
- Mark Lowe ($11 million/2)
- Mike Pelfrey ($16 million/2)
- Jordan Zimmermann ($110 million/5)

I mean, look at the posts in this thread around the time they signed Baez:

Do not want Baez.

I’d go with Story or Semien before Baez for sure.

Alright, so hoping Correa is still realistic, possibly Seager too though that one feels even less likely. Otherwise hoping for Story here.

I already agreed with ya about Baez being less desirable than the other 4 big names, but the more I've looked at it, the more I hate the idea of Baez. Of the 5, his game has the highest probability of falling off the most and the soonest. Some have said he may sign for as little as 3-4 years, but there are signs his game has already begun to drop off. Please steer clear, Detroit.

This would prove my fears absolutely valid by allowing Avila to coast as long as he has. He hasn’t had to make any major decisions that we have to watch. The trades were underwhelming, but baseball prospects are extremely hard to predict. We’ve yet to see a strong knowledge of ANYTHING from Avila other than managing to keep payroll at poverty levels.

I’m terrified of letting Al Avila run this franchise. Baez would double down on that fear.

Yeah, I've never been anything but lukewarm toward Avila. I'm not a fan of the EdRod signing, and Baez would certainly be worse. Horrible consolation prize if it's decided Correa is too expensive.

Semein signing that deal should end any wishful thinking that Baez would accept a short term deal for less.

My main gripe is that I believe Baez would be a bad fit in this ballpark. But I also understand the fear of giving Correa an empty check when that money can be used to other pieces to the roster. Tigers need to improve their defense which crosses out Seager as he seems destined for 3B. Which then leaves Correa, Baez and Story.

I'll be disappointed if they strike out on all three. They need to land one. But the Tigers also can't bid against themselves here.

i'd be okay with Story too, I want Correa but any of those 3 and i'm happy

Semien(because he's already 31) and Baez were the two I wanted to avoid and one of those is gone now

Story would come with two red flags: He hit much better at Coors than away (but players often adjust to different environments, yet this is no given). As pointed out on blessyouboys.com in the discussion about Baez, Story obviously has some arm issues, since his throws are becoming less accurate from year to year.

While I am still hoping for Correa (with little optimism now), I do not want the Tigers to sign either Story or Baez for the amounts projected by MLBTR and Fangraphs (which were actually exceeded for SSs). Sign Galvis for one or two years, see what Kreidler can contribute and hope for better luck next year...

Gruß,
BSHH

View attachment 485542

2018 might as well have been 20 years ago for Baez, he's never reaching that performance again. I like Baez, but this is very disappointing.

This is big time "Hey, they signed Zimmermann instead of Scherzer so they can spend money elsewhere" energy.

well that's irritating to wake up to

would have much rather they shelled out the extra like 7-9 million a year or whatever for Correa or at least signed Story for a similar price to this

Yeah, the big fish in hockey make about half of what Baez will make annually. With a hard salary cap in place, I don't think we should worry about the new era Ilitiches spending on the Wings.

The Baez signing is a bit concerning, I agree that it sort of reflects the Zimmerman>Scherzer logic (not that that logic never has merit, but it hasn't worked out for us in the past).

Baez himself can be pretty electric on his day, I'm sure he'll have good moments. But this is not really the splash I wanted to see.

 

[Konnan511]

Yeah, when Al's been allowed to spend he's done an absolutely awful job. He needs to be fired. He probably should've been fired after the disastrous 2015 FA signings:

- Justin Upton ($106 million/5)
- Mark Lowe ($11 million/2)
- Mike Pelfrey ($16 million/2)
- Jordan Zimmermann ($110 million/5)

I mean, look at the posts in this thread around the time they signed Baez:

Correa should finish the season with a 5 WAR and an outstanding 141 OPS+. Baez on the other hand will finish around a -1 WAR and an absolutely atrocious 50ish OPS+. Correa is absolutely worth the extra 15mil a season.

 

[Hen Kolland]

Correa should finish the season with a 5 WAR and an outstanding 141 OPS+. Baez on the other hand will finish around a -1 WAR and an absolutely atrocious 50ish OPS+. Correa is absolutely worth the extra 15mil a season.

You can just look at the numbers for Javy and it's just downright sad.

Career worst in:
SLG%
OPS/OPS+
BABIP
ISO
HR%
Exit Velo
Hard Hit%
Ground Ball %
Chase rate
UZR - this is another damning aspect because all we hear about is how his defensive play is high end.

His first negative WAR number since his rookie year
Worst average since rookie year
Worst OBP since rookie year
He hasn't generated a defensive run saved this year - same comment as UZR

And it's not like any of us were blind to what problems he carried. The major issue here is that all the problems he was bringing with him have gotten worse.

 

[ricky0034]

I never liked signing Baez but I find it difficult to be too upset over his performance the way everyone on the team has fallen apart offensively this year

it just feels so much bigger than any one player and while i'd definitely much rather have Correa I feel like he'd be doing worse than he is right now if he were here too

 

[Reality Check]

Tigers weren't even a good offense team last year. Which is why I was just hoping for a .500 season

It was pure hopium to put all this faith in Greene and Torkelson prior to the season.

 

[Ricelund]

Tigers weren't even a good offense team last year. Which is why I was just hoping for a .500 season

It was pure hopium to put all this faith in Greene and Torkelson prior to the season.

Yeah, they got some fluke seasons out of Grossman, Haase, and Baddoo last year too.

They’re just a poorly run team.

 

[guinness]

Looking at the box score Brieske pitched a good game, but a team isn't usually going to win scoring a run, and Soto is going to have a bad game.

They need to send Torkelson down to Toledo, keeping him up is going to stunt his growth. There are lots of other players they could send down as well, couldn't be any worse at this point could it?