OT: MIchigan Sports Thread: UM wins Natty Championship

[newfy]

I watch like 3-4 NFL games a week and there isn't a week that goes by I'm not shaking my head at the outcome of a game. This Lions one is more memorable, and yes they got screwed obviously, but this shit is happening all over. It's why NFL fans are so disgruntled about the reffng and want accountability for a change.

The Lions are special because they are division champs now. Not because they are some kind of persecuted franchise. Shake off that loser mentality. Show some pride in your current status, brother.

This kind of shit isnt happening all over though. Yes there are missed call everywhere, there isnt calls like this where all the sports media across the country are up in arms to the point the NFL has to drop a video trying to explain why it wasnt actually their fault. You see plays where videos like that have to come out often? Now on top of how bad of a call it was, this one had massive playoff implications making it even worse. That call likely cost the Ford family a few million dollars and made Jerry Jones a couple

I dont think the Lions are persecuted, I think by some wild bad luck theyve ended up on the shit end of some of these calls way too often. I also think there are teams in this league that get more benefit of the doubt than others with the calls going their way.

I like @jaster s comment above though and it kinda applies to the officiating apologists in here. Jim Joyce shouldnt be bitched about by Tigers fans on the Galarraga perfect game because a) umps miss calls all the time, as if missed balls and strikes are comparable to that level of missed call and b) well there were other ways he could've executed to get the runner out. Why make Joyce have a tougher time making the call when he could've caused a routine fly out to 1st base?

 

[Axel Sandy Pelikan]

This kind of shit isnt happening all over though. Yes there are missed call everywhere, there isnt calls like this where all the sports media across the country are up in arms to the point the NFL has to drop a video trying to explain why it wasnt actually their fault. You see plays where videos like that have to come out often? Now on top of how bad of a call it was, this one had massive playoff implications making it even worse. That call likely cost the Ford family a few million dollars and made Jerry Jones a couple

I dont think the Lions are persecuted, I think by some wild bad luck theyve ended up on the shit end of some of these calls way too often. I also think there are teams in this league that get more benefit of the doubt than others with the calls going their way.

I like @jaster s comment above though and it kinda applies to the officiating apologists in here. Jim Joyce shouldnt be bitched about by Tigers fans on the Galarraga perfect game because a) umps miss calls all the time, as if missed balls and strikes are comparable to that level of missed call and b) well there were other ways he could've executed to get the runner out. Why make Joyce have a tougher time making the call when he could've caused a routine fly out to 1st base?

Meh, Jim Joyce shouldn't be bitched about because he made a call that he himself said was wrong when he watched it back. He correctly acted (even if the call was wrong) by saying "This is my decision and I'm sticking with it" on the field. Everyone respected him a hell of a lot more because he was clearly the guy who felt the worst about making the call. He came out immediately upon watching it back and said "I kicked it. I feel terrible for that kid, but I kicked it." Any Tigers fan freaking out on him after that point is an asshole.

If Brad Allen came out in the pool report and said "I screwed up, 68 checked in, and I lost focus because 70 had been eligible for so many other plays..." Everyone would now be like yeah, humans make mistakes. But he didn't do that. He dug in and double and tripled down on his incorrect call and the NFL fell in line behind him with a shame film to say "This is your fault, Detroit, not Brad Allen's."

It's so fundamentally different between how Jim Joyce and MLB handled the Galarraga perfect game and Brad Allen and the dipshits at the NFL league offices did as to be ridiculous.

 

[newfy]

Meh, Jim Joyce shouldn't be bitched about because he made a call that he himself said was wrong when he watched it back. He correctly acted (even if the call was wrong) by saying "This is my decision and I'm sticking with it" on the field. Everyone respected him a hell of a lot more because he was clearly the guy who felt the worst about making the call. He came out immediately upon watching it back and said "I kicked it. I feel terrible for that kid, but I kicked it." Any Tigers fan freaking out on him after that point is an asshole.

If Brad Allen came out in the pool report and said "I screwed up, 68 checked in, and I lost focus because 70 had been eligible for so many other plays..." Everyone would now be like yeah, humans make mistakes. But he didn't do that. He dug in and double and tripled down on his incorrect call and the NFL fell in line behind him with a shame film to say "This is your fault, Detroit, not Brad Allen's."

It's so fundamentally different between how Jim Joyce and MLB handled the Galarraga perfect game and Brad Allen and the dipshits at the NFL league offices did as to be ridiculous.

I dont disagree with this stance at all. Joyce bawling his eyes out bought back a tonne of credibility for him and the league. Instead the NFL and Allen grabbed shovels and started digging the hole deeper for themselves.

The comparison with Galarraga is more to also just show how dumb the "players should've executed better" angle as if specific plays/calls dont have drastically larger impacts on certain games. Like saying you watch a lot of football and see missed calls every week and compare it to a play that has drawn national outrage from sports pundits everywhere, the NFL having to release statements about it etc etc

 

[jkutswings]

Now on top of how bad of a call it was, this one had massive playoff implications making it even worse. That call likely cost the Ford family a few million dollars and made Jerry Jones a couple

This is a HUGE assumption. Looking at the entire season rather than just one game, Detroit would likely lose to SF / PHI / DAL in the playoffs, regardless of venue. Their defense is simply too inconsistent, particularly against mobile quarterbacks and teams with a good passing game.

Was it a really bad call? Yes.
Did the league have a lousy response? Yes.

But Detroit isn't a Super Bowl contender this season, regardless of their seeding. (And that's ok, because Rome wasn't built in a day, and I expect a great off season and a team better equipped to truly contend next year, even with a harder schedule that may result in 1-2 fewer regular season wins.)

 

[Bench]

And you say that this applies to all teams in the league. So...... show us?

Dude I'm not going to go through years of playoff calls just so you can stop feeling like your team is somehow victimized. Good gravy.

It happens to all the teams at some point and often with far bigger implications than whatever aspirations the struggling Lions were playing for.

But hey, here's the most obvious example in recent years that completely f***ed the Saints in a way that's more meaningful that anything the Lions have experienced.



You can go have a pity party with Saints fans now. What could have been!

You know who doesn't think there's a problem with that Saints call above? Jared Goff.



Here's Goff saying, "No, it wasn't pass interference. And I've had a million pass interferences that weren't called."

Goff gets it. This shit happens to everyone. And when he's the beneficiary, as he was in LA, he's like "yup that shit happens, deal with it."

Maybe you'll listen to your QB more than me.

 

[izlez]

Dude I'm not going to go through years of playoff calls just so you can stop feeling like your team is somehow victimized. Good gravy.

It happens to all the teams at some point and often with far bigger implications than whatever aspirations the struggling Lions were playing for.

But hey, here's the most obvious example in recent years that completely f***ed the Saints in a way that's more meaningful that anything the Lions have experienced.



You can go have a pity party with Saints fans now. What could have been!

You claimed it happens as much to all teams. 1 example is pretty far short of 300

But, since you picked the saints, lets just start with about 9 more from them


I'll also add that I've said "I'm not so sure about that one" and "wow, that's a bad call" in calls that favored the Lions 10X more in the past season and a half than the last 20 years combined. Funny how having the refs on your side can help turn the tides

 

[jkutswings]

You claimed it happens as much to all teams. 1 example is pretty far short of 300

But, since you picked the saints, lets just start with about 9 more from them

1) "It happens to all teams at some point" <>"It happens as much to all teams".

2) You're still missing the point. Even if there was indisputable evidence that, over the entire history of the NFL, egregious calls happened to The Detroit Lions disproportionately more often...

...So what? Is the point to just complain about it? Or even to claim there's a conspiracy? The argument of, "We got hosed, we're the victim" doesn't accomplish anything. It actually reminds me of the scene in Liar Liar, where Jim Carrey is whining about the ridiculous cost of repairs to his car, and (since he cannot lie) then just begins shouting about how he can't really DO anything about it, and just has to accept the fact that he got screwed.

So the Lions got screwed. Put it in the rearview mirror and go beat Minnesota.

 

[izlez]

Here's Goff saying, "No, it wasn't pass interference. And I've had a million pass interferences that weren't called."

Goff gets it. This shit happens to everyone. And when he's the beneficiary, as he was in LA, he's like "yup that shit happens, deal with it."

Maybe you'll listen to your QB more than me.

Debatable pass interference calls aren't what we are talking about. At all.

There is value in the team moving on and focusing on practicing. He should do that. I don't think my role as a fan is that important.

1) "It happens to all teams at some point" <>"It happens as much to all teams".

2) You're still missing the point. Even if there was indisputable evidence that, over the entire history of the NFL, egregious calls happened to The Detroit Lions disproportionately more often...

...So what? Is the point to just complain about it? Or even to claim there's a conspiracy? The argument of, "We got hosed, we're the victim" doesn't accomplish anything. It actually reminds me of the scene in Liar Liar, where Jim Carrey is whining about the ridiculous cost of repairs to his car, and (since he cannot lie) then just begins shouting about how he can't really DO anything about it, and just has to accept the fact that he got screwed.

So the Lions got screwed. Put it in the rearview mirror and go beat Minnesota.

I don't play football.

I am currently on a sports message board where fans discuss sports. I am discussing sports. That is the point. What does "not playing the victim and focusing on Minnesota" accomplish?

 

[Konnan511]

I'm tired of this back and forth. Can we move on and beat the Vikings? Then beat the Rams or Cowboys in the playoffs?

 

[Bench]

Debatable pass interference calls aren't what we are talking about. At all.

Did you actually watch the video? Debatable pass interference?

Like I thought I was talking to normal fans, not the dudes who have their shirts off at the stadium.

 

[izlez]

Did you actually watch the video? Debatable pass interference?

Like I thought I was talking to normal fans, not the dudes who have their shirts off at the stadium.

I agree on that call. My issue was introducing Goff mentioning "a million pass interference calls" into the conversation.

That was a terrible call. It was a clearly botched call that resulted in national news and rule changes.

There was the fail mary.

And there were several for the Lions that were national news, resulting in rule changes, or acknowledged f***ups by the NFL

 

[jkutswings]

I am currently on a sports message board where fans discuss sports. I am discussing sports. That is the point. What does "not playing the victim and focusing on Minnesota" accomplish?

Perhaps anything egregious enough should have an indefinite statue of limitations then. I hear the Abdelkader contract was pretty bad - let's "discuss" that some more.

If you choose to still be upset about it, you're entitled to your opinion. But even the worst blown call has a fairly short shelf life in the grand scheme of public discussion.

 

[ricky0034]

Perhaps anything egregious enough should have an indefinite statue of limitations then. I hear the Abdelkader contract was pretty bad - let's "discuss" that some more.

If you choose to still be upset about it, you're entitled to your opinion. But even the worst blown call has a fairly short shelf life in the grand scheme of public discussion.

dude it's been like less than 5 days

the Lions straight up haven't even played another game yet since it happened

 

[jkutswings]

dude it's been like less than 5 days

the Lions straight up haven't even played another game yet since it happened

And some folks are acting like the 1972 Miami Dolphins had perfection stolen from them by the zebras. It's one (really) bad call in a regular season game.

 

[FabricDetails]

Mo naming Jack Reacher, . Also, think about it, have you ever seen Kane and Hayden Christensen in the same room?

 

[Ben Grimm]

NFL officiating is broken, according to coaches and executives. Inside a fractured system with no imminent fix

Oversight from league headquarters in New York and team owner sentiment are the top impediments, sources tell Yahoo Sports. And there's no reason to believe it will change anytime soon.

sports.yahoo.com

 

[Axel Sandy Pelikan]

And some folks are acting like the 1972 Miami Dolphins had perfection stolen from them by the zebras. It's one (really) bad call in a regular season game.

I don’t want to start the argument all over again, but the game is likely to be the difference in home field for Philly, Dallas, and Detroit.

Anyways, my problem isn’t that they got a game stolen. Bad calls happen. My problem is Brad Allen and the NFL proudly thumping their chests that they were right and basically saying “we reviewed ourselves and found us to not be wrong, so we will not be better in the future”.

There is no reason for reporting eligible to be anything except an application on an iPad for some team staffer to press a button and do so. There is no need for that process to be something that you can obfuscate. Doesn’t change Brad Allen borking it or whatever, but honestly, we have technology to signal something like that.

 

[Bench]

I don’t want to start the argument all over again, but the game is likely to be the difference in home field for Philly, Dallas, and Detroit.

I guess the problem I have is acting like this is new or unique to the Lions. The Fail Mary for the Packers completely changes the playoff seeding, meaning they traveled on the road instead of getting a home game.

So like... shit happens.

 

[ricky0034]

I don’t want to start the argument all over again, but the game is likely to be the difference in home field for Philly, Dallas, and Detroit.

Anyways, my problem isn’t that they got a game stolen. Bad calls happen. My problem is Brad Allen and the NFL proudly thumping their chests that they were right and basically saying “we reviewed ourselves and found us to not be wrong, so we will not be better in the future”.

There is no reason for reporting eligible to be anything except an application on an iPad for some team staffer to press a button and do so. There is no need for that process to be something that you can obfuscate. Doesn’t change Brad Allen borking it or whatever, but honestly, we have technology to signal something like that.

this is what I don't get about the whole "look at all the really bad calls that happen to other teams" thing

like....yeah this isn't even the first time this year Brad Allen specifically has been involved in boneheaded controversial stuff

that doesn't make it better....if anything it makes it worse

 

[SantosHalper]

Mo naming Jack Reacher, . Also, think about it, have you ever seen Kane and Hayden Christensen in the same room?

But which? Tom Cruise or that steroid monster on Amazon?

 

[Bench]

They may surprise people at just how badly they fall apart. Their running game should still be good on paper, but Jordan Love under center means there will be 8 or more in the box on every play.

 

[jkutswings]

Kudos on a successful year for your new QB. But looking back, it's also going 9-8 against what now appears to be a very soft schedule. You play the games you're given, but I still don't fear the Pack whatsoever - if and when they do put it all together, it'll be after Detroit's window of contention anyway.

Now having said that, feel free to upset Dallas. Because even before this latest game, I'd rather any team in the league win than Dallas. F 'dem Cowboys.

 

[Bench]

Kudos on a successful year for your new QB. But looking back, it's also going 9-8 against what now appears to be a very soft schedule. You play the games you're given, but I still don't fear the Pack whatsoever - if and when they do put it all together, it'll be after Detroit's window of contention anyway.

Now having said that, feel free to upset Dallas. Because even before this latest game, I'd rather any team in the league win than Dallas. F 'dem Cowboys.

You're talking like we had any expectations for this Green Bay team of rookies. So don't walk back what the team accomplished after you give your kudos. You asked me how many wins I expected the team to have before the season and I said 9 and that they had a favorable schedule. And today they won their 9th game on the tail end of that favorable schedule.

Green Bay isn't some top contender and I never asserted that.

I said that they wouldn't suck and that Love would be good. And here we are. The team doesn't suck enough to miss the playoffs and Love will finish as a top 10 QB by every measurable stat. And over the back half of the season his stats were top 3 with Dak and Purdy. Love has a lot to prove yet and he's just getting started... but I told you Love can ball and that's all I wanted people to recognize. Respectfully.

And also respectfully I'm calling you out specifically because you're fun to talk to about this stuff.

 

[jkutswings]

You're talking like we had any expectations for this Green Bay team of rookies. So don't walk back what the team accomplished after you give your kudos. You asked me how many wins I expected the team to have before the season and I said 9 and that they had a favorable schedule. And today they won their 9th game on the tail end of that favorable schedule.

Green Bay isn't some top contender and I never asserted that.

I said that they wouldn't suck and that Love would be good. And here we are. The team doesn't suck enough to miss the playoffs and Love will finish as a top 10 QB by every measurable stat. And over the back half of the season his stats were top 3 with Dak and Purdy. Love has a lot to prove yet and he's just getting started... but I told you Love can ball and that's all I wanted people to recognize. Respectfully.

And also respectfully I'm calling you out specifically because you're fun to talk to about this stuff.

Ugh. THIS guy. Over the moon that Quarterback University has yet another graduate.

No worries. I just want to see Detroit with a statement win over the Rams, and it'll be a chef's kiss of a season.

 

[Frk It]

You're talking like we had any expectations for this Green Bay team of rookies. So don't walk back what the team accomplished after you give your kudos. You asked me how many wins I expected the team to have before the season and I said 9 and that they had a favorable schedule. And today they won their 9th game on the tail end of that favorable schedule.

Green Bay isn't some top contender and I never asserted that.

I said that they wouldn't suck and that Love would be good. And here we are. The team doesn't suck enough to miss the playoffs and Love will finish as a top 10 QB by every measurable stat. And over the back half of the season his stats were top 3 with Dak and Purdy. Love has a lot to prove yet and he's just getting started... but I told you Love can ball and that's all I wanted people to recognize. Respectfully.

And also respectfully I'm calling you out specifically because you're fun to talk to about this stuff.