Injury Report: Matt Murray is day-to-day - Head Injury

[kb]

Trade a 1st round pick to unload him.

Failpost. Congrats!!!

 

[ToneDog]

So, what do we do with Murray next year?

If Kyle gets a GM job elsewhere, he'll probably take him for a 5th and trade it for 2 7ths..

 

[DarkKnight]

the same ottawa fans who thought they won the offseason getting Giroux?

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this Ottawa? near the bottom of the league?

A thousand laugh emojis doesn’t make it funnier, just more immature. Thanks for coming out though.

 

[Al14]

How can you say this “trade was a clear loss for Dubas”, and then follow with, “we need to see if he’ll even be available to play in the playoffs. That will tell us the complete story “. So you’re ready to state it’s a loss before knowing the complete story? It just don’t make sense.

Hockey is a results oriented entertainment business. What happens in the playoffs is really what would sway the deal for Murray towards the positive in the end, however only if he is factor in our Leafs going deep.

Thus far, Murray has continued with the oft-injured history with our Leafs. Availability is an important factor when acquiring players in trades. Dubas took a chance on Murray, and thus far it hasn't worked out IMHO.

With Murray's injury history, obtaining his services in the first place was why I thought that the trade was a loss for Dubas. If Ottawa had coughed up a 1st round draft pick to get Murry off their cap, then that would have been a better incoming asset for taking a part time player from a rival divisional team.

It cost Dubas a 1st round pick to get Marleau off of our salary cap. I think Ottawa should have paid the same price, especially because of the extra year on Muuray's contract and his obvious history of recent injuries.

This is my opinion, and everyone else is entitled to theirs.

Go Leafs Go !!!

 

[Kiwi]

There are so many scenarios possible. He still young: he could regain his health: he could go on ltir for stretches during the season and that gets Woll more reps: he could be traded straight up (not likely if he's just a cap dump) maybe just with retention so we eat a bit, Ottawa is already eating a bit and suddenly he's more appealing as what he makes matter less that what the team is paying him in actual dollars.
My point to this is that there are positive possibilities to this as well as negative and those bridges will be crossed when we get there.
Could it end up being a loss, yes but I don't think it will, but that's just my opinion.

Let's take these one at a time

He's a skating bandaid so that seems like very wishful thinking
He's making way to much to be a glorified backup
Doubt anybody's taking that contract on without inducement
We're trying to ice the best lineup possible so every dollar counts, retaining is completely unacceptable

You seem extremely optimistic, my opinion is reality is going to kick you in the pills

 

[saltming]

Let's take these one at a time

He's a skating bandaid so that seems like very wishful thinking
He's making way to much to be a glorified backup
Doubt anybody's taking that contract on without inducement
We're trying to ice the best lineup possible so every dollar counts, retaining is completely unacceptable

You seem extremely optimistic, my opinion is reality is going to kick you in the pills

My view is that there are many possibilities that include yours, so really you are being pessimistic as your only believing the worst will be what happens

 

[Kiwi]

My view is that there are many possibilities that include yours, so really you are being pessimistic as your only believing the worst will be what happens

I'd call it realism

Murray is a depressed "asset" making plenty in a hard cap league
He's an anchor and if we want to keep Samsonov and Bunting we will probably need that money freed up

I'd happily trade that 3rd and 7th in the off-season to get rid of him

He just can't stay fit and that's a problem if you want the guy to be a starter

 

[Stephen]

I'd call it realism

Murray is a depressed "asset" making plenty in a hard cap league
He's an anchor and if we want to keep Samsonov and Bunting we will probably need that money freed up

I'd happily trade that 3rd and 7th in the off-season to get rid of him

He just can't stay fit and that's a problem if you want the guy to be a starter

The big issue with Murray is opportunity cost. One could argue another mediocre goalie option in a backup role at minimum dollars would have been a better use of cap, with the rest of the money used on more productive things like a non Kerfoot forward. Murray was spectacular in November, good in December and then disappeared again after a poor January.

Though we don't know if Samsonov has benefitted from having Murray as the guy to compete with to try and steal a number one role. That part of the equation is a bit of an unknown.

Hopefully we can move off him easily if he comes back and plays well. There are better things to spend the money on next year.

 

[Stephen]

Woll was okay in his season debut. Didn't get a lot of help from the Leafs, looked good at the start but things sort of unraveled for him after getting peppered.

 

[Lemontree]

Is anyone actually confident that if Murray was in net the game tonight would have been different? Woll was alright, not great. 3rd goal was on him but he played well enough to beat a bottom feeder.....team should have been more prepared and willing to make it an easy night on him.

 

[saltming]

I'd call it realism

Murray is a depressed "asset" making plenty in a hard cap league
He's an anchor and if we want to keep Samsonov and Bunting we will probably need that money freed up

I'd happily trade that 3rd and 7th in the off-season to get rid of him

He just can't stay fit and that's a problem if you want the guy to be a starter

When dealing with the future realism would say any of the possibilities are possible because they are. Yes some are more probable but none the less all are possible.
Pessimism would believe only the negative outcome is a foregone conclusion

 

[Antropovsky]

Is anyone actually confident that if Murray was in net the game tonight would have been different? Woll was alright, not great. 3rd goal was on him but he played well enough to beat a bottom feeder.....team should have been more prepared and willing to make it an easy night on him.

....its a cap problem not player problem. Leafs are paying among the least for their goalies, so they should be able to pull through without matthews, per Dubas scheme. Even without Matthews... We have two times the 11 million dollar players then the other 28 teams. We just got beat by one of the worst nhl team with less spent on their goalies and whom also are also dealing with injuries to high paid players. Sounds like we broke down once the game became playoff like...

We will see, they might be saving the grit for playoffs.

 

[Mess]

Every time the Leafs lose a game because they were forced to play their 3rd or 4th string goalie, you can essentially lay that loss at the feet of Matt Murray for missing another of his intended starts due to being unreliable and injury prone and by extension Dubas for putting the Leafs in this position knowing the high risk of bringing him in knowing his past history. IMO

The 11 games now played by Kallgren and Woll are missed Murray starts and opportunity losses by the team as result as that is the common denominator when doing the autopsy of the loss.

 

[Kiwi]

When dealing with the future realism would say any of the possibilities are possible because they are. Yes some are more probable but none the less all are possible.
Pessimism would believe only the negative outcome is a foregone conclusion

Come on now Salt

We've proven he's a problem, when he was in Ottawa there was still some doubt about what he was and currently is

That's gone, everybody knows what he is now and will look to avoid it

That's the problem

 

[saltming]

Come on now Salt

We've proven he's a problem, when he was in Ottawa there was still some doubt about what he was and currently is

That's gone, everybody knows what he is now and will look to avoid it

That's the problem

The only thing proven is he gets injured. Up to this point he's played better than he has in Ottawa. That could change by the end of the season, but we won't know until the end of the season

 

[BertCorbeau]

Every time the Leafs lose a game because they were forced to play their 3rd or 4th string goalie, you can essentially lay that loss at the feet of Matt Murray for missing another of his intended starts due to being unreliable and injury prone and by extension Dubas for putting the Leafs in this position knowing the high risk of bringing him in knowing his past history. IMO

The 11 games now played by Kallgren and Woll are missed Murray starts and opportunity losses by the team as result as that is the common denominator when doing the autopsy of the loss.

Or could you blame the team in front of Woll tonight for giving up more than 40 shots to the worst team in the league

You can’t say Woll hasn’t earned his shot.. he’s been outstanding this year so far with the Marlies.. to saying the Leafs are forced to play him is just misguided context

 

[Kiwi]

The only thing proven is he gets injured. Up to this point he's played better than he has in Ottawa. That could change by the end of the season, but we won't know until the end of the season

So he's good when he plays, he just never plays and has an injury history longer than my arm for about a half decade

He's not even fit now, nobody is changing there opinion of him based on this season
He's already shown what he is even with a change of scenery on a far better team with a quality backroom staff

He's broken

 

[Petrus]

Every time the Leafs lose a game because they were forced to play their 3rd or 4th string goalie, you can essentially lay that loss at the feet of Matt Murray for missing another of his intended starts due to being unreliable and injury prone and by extension Dubas for putting the Leafs in this position knowing the high risk of bringing him in knowing his past history. IMO

The 11 games now played by Kallgren and Woll are missed Murray starts and opportunity losses by the team as result as that is the common denominator when doing the autopsy of the loss.

Do you agree, we should blame Murray, Woll and Samsonov because all 3 were injured from Nov5th to Nov30th leading to 1 L and 2 OTL (7 starts in Total)?

 

[darrylsittler27]

Murray has back loaded contract and as such will get paid $8 mil in real dollars, while making $7 mil this year.

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Are you saying Dubas is an idiot?

 

[acrobaticgoalie]

Double post.

Woll impressed me tonight. Not much he could've done on the goals. A couple fluky bounces, a rebound play and a point blank shot in a scramble. 40 shots against.

I've been saying the last few years that Woll needed to clean up his game in order to be an NHL goalie. In the last few years between his time with the Marlies and his brief stint with the Leafs, he needed to slow his game down. Too much movement and a tendency to swim forcing him into desperation scramble saves Instead of being poised and In control of his movements, allowing him to constantly stay square and in position. He also had a tendency to always end up on his rear after saves. He should always have good balance and keep his body upright, to give him the best chance to always be ahead of the puck and be as big as possible.

Tonight, I saw a guy who looked big, looked poised, had an upright position the whole Game. He looked sharp and fast. I didn't see much excess movement. Wasn't having to make a lot desperation saves due to his positioning and control. He looks more like an NHLer.

 

[saltming]

So he's good when he plays, he just never plays and has an injury history longer than my arm for about a half decade

He's not even fit now, nobody is changing there opinion of him based on this season
He's already shown what he is even with a change of scenery on a far better team with a quality backroom staff

He's broken

He is on the Ir agreed but even this site shows that people have different opinions.
We got Timmins for Douglas so there was 2 opinions involved in that trade and they were vastly different.
What will become of Murray? Let's see is all in saying

 

[Dekes For Days]

The 11 games now played by Kallgren and Woll are missed Murray starts

Except that's not true.

 

[Mess]

Or could you blame the team in front of Woll tonight for giving up more than 40 shots to the worst team in the league

You can’t say Woll hasn’t earned his shot.. he’s been outstanding this year so far with the Marlies.. to saying the Leafs are forced to play him is just misguided context

NHL teams don't plan to play their AHL or 3rd and 4th string goalies in the NHL unless they're forced to.,

The Leafs plan was to go with a Murray (likely starter) and Samsonov (likely backup) with the best case perhaps a 50/50 split. Murray at $4.65 mil even after retention is not being paid as backup goalie in the NHL.

So with 54 games played and with a 50/50 split we should have seen both goalies getting around 27 games each +/- a few games if you went with a hot hand.

Sammy has given the Leafs 26 quality starts and 18 wins and done his part for his backup salary of $1.8 mil AAV ... So where is Leafs starting goalie ??

Now what has Murray given the Leafs 19 starts and 11 wins and his missing games on the part of his tandem which are forced to be played by Leafs AHL goalies due to his unreliability while on IR?

That is my position and context here and anyone that says Leafs paying Murray starter money and cap usage, and getting only 19 games can't be happy, by already seeing Kallgren start 10 games..

I'm simply not going to blame the guys asked to fill in for Murray while making $750k with little to no NHL experience, when Murray can't fulfill his expected commitment. Its looking more and more with each passing Murray injury the Leafs management made a big mistake gambling on him. IMO

Before this year is out Murray is going to be the focal point of this season one way or another and Dubas hitched his wagon to him and his fate will also be determined by this choice, and the backup AHL goalies only the fallout results of that decision, as they're not the guys expected to win the Leafs a playoff series, nor suppose to be a factor in the regular season either.

 

[Dekes For Days]

So with 54 games played and with a 50/50 split we should have seen both goalies getting around 27 games each +/- a few games if you went with a hot hand.

So 54 games. Average number of games league-wide from 3rd most played goalie is 4-5 games. So let's say 50 expected starts for these two. Split in half, that's 25 starts each. Add in a few games for Samsonov as the hotter hand (as you said), and we're at maybe 22 starts expected for Murray so far this year. He's at 19 games, so all this panic over 3 games less than you would have expected, even though he's played well when he's in.

Seems pretty silly when you break it down.

 

[Racer88]

Every time the Leafs lose a game because they were forced to play their 3rd or 4th string goalie, you can essentially lay that loss at the feet of Matt Murray for missing another of his intended starts due to being unreliable and injury prone and by extension Dubas for putting the Leafs in this position knowing the high risk of bringing him in knowing his past history. IMO

The 11 games now played by Kallgren and Woll are missed Murray starts and opportunity losses by the team as result as that is the common denominator when doing the autopsy of the loss.

Agreed 100%………