57 Years No Cup
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Salary Cap: Marner contract discussion XVI (continued)
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1specter
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Notsince67
Papi and the Lamplighters
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I say F Marner and god bless the other 100+ RFA's that have yet to sign. Marner is greedy but everyone else is exercising their collective bargaining rights
shakes
Pep City
Maybe when you are making 50-70 million dollars, maybe, just maybe the player might decide that this extra million isn't worth it to play on a competitive team. Demanding a ridiculous contract after coincidentally blossoming when paired with John Tavares after putting up mid to late 60s points the first two years, knowing full well that doing that will force the team he loves oh so much to jettison players that would help the team is ridiculous. Seriously, how much money does someone need?
But to answer your own question, 10 is a lot higher than 1 times the number of years. So if he signs for 7 years, he's guaranteed $70 million dollars which is more than enough for generations of his family to live comfortably whereas 1 million is a 7 million dollar total. Now 7 million is a lot of money regardless but, in this day and age, it's really not generations kind of money. Marner is only doing this out of greed and a bizarre perception of "lack of respect". I mean, I wish someone would disrespect me enough to offer me $70 million dollars to play a sport for my childhood team but to Marner, that's just not enough for his ego.
IN the REAL world. Matthews is top in goals since being drafted. Marner is 12th in assists and 22nd in points.
Marners stats dont cut in the real world of ELITE players. Let alone his salary demands.
Marner is screwed.
ToDavid
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He lead both teams in goals through the first round, scoring at a near 60 goal pace...
shakes
Pep City
Maybe if people were fans of other teams and cared about those other players, they might have stronger opinions. Maybe if we didn't have to hear about how much Marner LOVES the Leafs from his agent and various media sources we wouldn't think he's being greedy. He should just say that then instead of trying to blow smoke up people's asses. I would respect him a hell of a lot more if he did.
Bluelines
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57 Years No Cup
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I have no problem with this. Real stats. Not some extrapolated "what if" stuff.
Plus, please don't put me in the "I wanna overpay Marner" camp. I want them to give him what he's worth, which is under $10 million. The problem is that Dubas overpaid the other two amigos already so there's no way for him to go to Mitch and ask him to take less than (or even equal to) market value with a straight face.
Martin Skoula
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I know you're going to start screeching about consistency on getting paid for goals or your full ELC numbers or whatever, but 6.9 is in line with his comparables, at least within a negligible margin or error that accounts for less than a league minimum fourth liner.
57 Years No Cup
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JayfromNB1219
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Maybe I am reading your posts wrong but it seems like you have quite the hate on for Matthews...
DarkKnight
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Marner didn’t create Dubie dollars. Amazes me how the blame game works around here.
It’s funny, because any commentary I hear on sports radio can completely see why Marner has a high ask given the other contracts. You can disagree, use different stats to cobble together various arguments, but to suggest the kid is out of line asking for big money after how Matthews cashed in, well...
I want the most team friendly deal possible, because it benefits the Leafs. That said, I don’t see either the Nylander or Matthews deals as anything but maximum benefit to the player. Now Marner comes up with these precedents set, internal team metrics, and it’s suddenly greed. A lot of commentary operates in a vacuum.
It’s funny, because any commentary I hear on sports radio can completely see why Marner has a high ask given the other contracts. You can disagree, use different stats to cobble together various arguments, but to suggest the kid is out of line asking for big money after how Matthews cashed in, well...
I want the most team friendly deal possible, because it benefits the Leafs. That said, I don’t see either the Nylander or Matthews deals as anything but maximum benefit to the player. Now Marner comes up with these precedents set, internal team metrics, and it’s suddenly greed. A lot of commentary operates in a vacuum.
CantLoseWithMatthews
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Nylander's contract is pretty fair. As far as Matthews goes, he's clearly valued more highly by the team. Judging by a lack of an offer sheet, it seems like no team in the league values Marner the way he values himself
TheDoldrums
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this is an appeal to the worst possible authority
KuleminFan41
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And? The minority, doesn't speak for the majority. Using Chicago as an example kind of cherry picking because they've signed Toews and Kane to identical contracts twice now. That doesn't really happen. The same would be if you brought up Crosby , who has had the exact same caphit once he left his ELC.
The Stamkos situation is pretty easy to explain. Stamkos signed his deal 3 years ago. Since that time, the cap has increased every season, as well as the introduction of the Golden Knights to the league. It's rather silly to compare the two because the NHL and the cap are in 2 different places when they were signed.
When you rank forwards in terms of who gets paid, it goes centres, then goal scorers. If you're a goal scoring centre, you're valued even more. 7 of the top 10 highest earning forwards this up coming season are centres. 5 of those 7, scored 35 or more goals last season. Low scoring wingers who have high assist totals don't tend to get paid as much as you'd think. Marchand is at 6.1 , Gaudraeu is at 6.7 , Aho(moved to centre now?) is at 8.4 etc etc . Marchand, Gaeudreau and Aho mind you, all have scored 30 or more, unlike Marner. Not to mention, your earlier example of Kucherov who scored 40 goals , got paid 9.7 million. So I'm not sure where you're getting this idea that its propaganda to suggest centres and goal scorers get paid.
But it does though, as evident by the fact that people are judged by quarters, not by daily production. Not to mention, they're also judged by projections too
So is so true it hurts. But now we are up against the CAP so last guy may get screwed a little. I mentioned this to Paul recently at a pool party and he did not say anything back. Waiting to go last has benefit of further understanding the market but downside of being up against the CAP. and CAP went down 1.5M AAV lower than expected so that hurt too. and when Point signs for 9.5M people are going to freak out even more because they don't understand the tax side of it. and they will say Marner is not as good as Point and they will be right.
thewave
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How many agents live in Toronto? Lots of wine and lots of dining with scoops and other goodies to grease our media... Wendelllll Clarkson baaaby!!
Muskoka 5 2.0
JayfromNB1219
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Which is why at least half of your answers are half finished...stop hating on Matthews...Marner is an Assists guy...he doesn't put the puck in the net, he makes sure other people have that opportunity...thus he is literally at the mercy of his line mates...Tavares and Hyman go stone cold and Marner stops getting points...not every goal Marner was involved in was a tap in on an open net...some of them were and they were amazing plays but you are discounting the work Marners linemates have to do to finish...Matthews is perfectly capable of putting the puck in the net by himself if need be, which he has done on more than one occasion...
Screw it I say bridge Marner 2-3 years 5-7M per year and let his play speak for itself...if he continues to do what he has done then there can be no excuses not to open up the bank account for the kid at the end of his bridge deal...this result keeps the "Marner is god" crew happy as if he is as good as they are betting he should make a sht ton more money on the next contract and Dubas and the Leafs will literally have no leg to stand on...while still acknowledging that Matthews has the contract he has for valid reasons...
BET ON YOURSELF MITCH and then take Dubas to the cleaners (with full fan support not that it means anything and your brand perfectly intact) should his play continue to rise
Best of both worlds...stops this ludicrous Marner Matthews comparison gets him signed with the knowledge that if he is everything he seems to be Dubas better open the checkbook
DarkKnight
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It’s actually a more detached perspective because they aren’t fans. But think what you need to, if it doesn’t fit the angry narrative here. It’s irrelevant.
Well there's your first problem. Sports radio is like getting your world view from Fox News.
TheDoldrums
Registered User
One thing from that Friedman piece I really liked
"Toronto and Marner have talked about a short term deal of two or three years and they’ve talked about six. I think Marner might want something a little bit different, but that’s kind of where they are."
Those are the right terms to be negotiating with from the Leafs perspective.
"Toronto and Marner have talked about a short term deal of two or three years and they’ve talked about six. I think Marner might want something a little bit different, but that’s kind of where they are."
Those are the right terms to be negotiating with from the Leafs perspective.
DarkKnight
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