Salary Cap: Marner Contract Discussion - Less than 2 weeks to camp

[Nineteen67]

That's irrelevant to my question.

Sorry, but that appears to be his reasons.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Anyone remember that time Marner pulled through in game 7 to get us into rd2? How the other kids did the same?

Obviously a big old Nope, but clearly they are all worth the highest paid contracts age vs performance. No PO accomplishments or anything. What a joke.

Every time team accomplishments (or lack thereof) are brought up when discussing contracts for individual players, I just roll my eyes. Can you figure out why that is?

 

[Notsince67]

Dubas clearly goofed up. He has made many mistakes. A huge one if We do not resign Tyson. Giving up Kadri for one year of Tyson is a very steep price. Same as giving up a first to get rid of Marleau.

Marner could have been signed last summer for 8 years for less money that he is going to get for 5 or six years. Dubas was offering what Nylander is signed for and Marner countered with 9m per. A 8.5 per x 8 years is what I suggested last summer.

Those numbers are what i am and was thinking.

 

[BoredBrandonPridham]

Every time team accomplishments (or lack thereof) are brought up when discussing contracts for individual players, I just roll my eyes. Can you figure out why that is?

Even many accomplishments that people think are individual accomplishments are mostly related to team accomplishment:

Hart - Usually best player on team that went deep into the playoffs
Art Ross - Best forward that got top 10 PP time on team that got most PP time
Rocket - Best scoring forward that got top 10 PP time on team that got most PP time

 

[Notsince67]

So...just want to be clear here...are you advocating blowing the cap out to give Marner "whatever he wants"...just want to know how seriously to take your comments lol

We know what the upper limit of his contract is (Matthews). We know they dont have the cap to pay him those dollars so he will be paid less for less term. The notion of blowing the cap is hyperbole. They know the number so the question is term.

 

[Notsince67]

I’m sure at some point they talked numbers? Sure. But what you think or I think a lowball according to Ferris is in no way a sure thing.

It would not surprise me for a second if they thought 9 x 8 was a lowball.

I’m not surprised if they think 11.5 x5 is a lowball.

It is highly unlikely. 9 x 8 as a lowball would assume an ask of something like 11 x 8 last summer. These kinds of numbers are silly.

 

[jrgtml67]

Well Dubas quoted as saying "he will be here a long time."

Sounds like hes trying his all to get 7 or 8yr deal in place with the bridge a last resort. Which makes sense because Friedman reported they were pretty close on a 3yr deal.

I really think CBJ tried to get Marner to sign a 7yr offersheet and he said no. How else did CBJ say and figure "well he didn't want 7yrs, that said we also feel he doesnt want to leave Toronto." Only one way they know that..they had sheet ready with term and $ and he wouldn't sign it. A team would be hush hush about saying they did do an offersheet that the player rejected.

The other thing ..all the other high profile RFAS haven't signed. Connor, Laine, Boeser, Raatenen, Point, Tkachuk. Two of those are close to Marners capabilities (wingers) Rat and Tkachuk. We maybe in luck if one or both sign a LT deal worth anything under 10.5 mill. Tkachuk wont get that but Rat could.

I'd be more than fine with Marner getting 11.65m but over max term or 7yrs even. Jt got 11 over 7, yes I know hes a center but Marner is way younger and ceiling isn't quite a known..whereas JT is in his prime and hit his ceiling, though his pt totals may keep going up with Marner on his wing.

I agree with McDavid. With so many guys not signed itll take 1 or 2 to go then slowly, or quickly the rest will sign. Marners camp had better hurry, in the sense that if he doesnt set the bar another guy (mainly Rat) could set what he makes. I know many will say ya but he wants AM money, well there's nothing but rumors to suggest that he even asked for that. Point is there are a couple winger comparables..and actually more than Tkachuk..Connor is most like Marner.

In any case, I could care less about him in camp at the start, if he makes it with a couple weeks left before game 1 of the regular season I think itll be ok

 

[Cleetus]

Is there a fan amongst us that didn’t think Marner would get over paid? Seriously...after the Nylander roll over and the Matthews gift, it was always going to be an overpay. So why get pissed at the next horse at the Dubie dollar trough? Don’t get it.

this is exactly it! strange posters turning on Marner because he is asking to much, but apparently they think the Matthews and Nylander's contract are good deals I dont get it!

 

[kb]

this is exactly it! strange posters turning on Marner because he is asking to much, but apparently they think the Matthews and Nylander's contract are good deals I dont get it!

What I don't get is why people want Marner to be vastly overpaid and hinder their cup chances?

I don't get that!!

 

[Cleetus]

What I don't get is why people want Marner to be vastly overpaid and hinder their cup chances?

I don't get that!!

he is worth what he is worth, funny he is the highest point producer for the leafs last year but trying to get him to take less than his worth is stupid. Dubas started this with paying willy 7 mill than imo over paying Matthews on a 5 year deal I dont think its the posters that are hindering there cup chances lol.

 

[moon111]

Every time team accomplishments (or lack thereof) are brought up when discussing contracts for individual players, I just roll my eyes. Can you figure out why that is?

Nylander scored at the same rate, only ended up a +1 in the playoffs rather then a -4.
Of course, one had weaker linemates and probably weaker Quality of Opposition as well.
But they were on the same team, so why should Marner be handed a contract based on playing
pond hockey during the regular season alone. Marner looked entertaining, I know that counts
for something. Look at Kapanen speeding along with his two career assists being put on
the first line last season. It's not always about the numbers.

 

[Suntouchable13]

he is worth what he is worth, funny he is the highest point producer for the leafs last year but trying to get him to take less than his worth is stupid.

Funny thing there is a thing called a "cap" and after those guys signed, there is not that much left.

 

[Legion34]

It is highly unlikely. 9 x 8 as a lowball would assume an ask of something like 11 x 8 last summer. These kinds of numbers are silly.

Agreed. The way the marner camp has addressed
His value is silly.

Remember the dreger 13-14 million ask?

 

[18leafsfan18]

this is exactly it! strange posters turning on Marner because he is asking to much, but apparently they think the Matthews and Nylander's contract are good deals I dont get it!

What I don't get is why people want Marner to be vastly overpaid and hinder their cup chances?

I don't get that!!

I don't get how Matthews and Nylander's contracts are so bad based on comparable contracts.

Posters put too much stock in term. Yes, term changes the AAV but no one really knows how much.

Their AAVs are in line with league comparable contracts, this whole "term makes them bad contracts" is just speculation, based on how much they will make on their next contract. No one knows what their next contracts are going to be.

 

[kb]

he is worth what he is worth, funny he is the highest point producer for the leafs last year but trying to get him to take less than his worth is stupid.

You can thank Tavares for some of that. On his own without a finisher, he gets nowhere near 94 points. Don't pay him based on being propped up by an elite C. Plus he's a 22 goals, 87 point player if you take away the empty net scoring.

 

[Cleetus]

Funny thing there is a thing called a "cap" and after those guys signed, there is not that much left.

yes there is its too bad we got so many forwards making so much money but I would much rather have Marner on my team than Nylander but that's just my opinion. we cannot have it all I suppose. I just dont understand trying to squeeze Mitch when he was our highest point producer.

 

[Cleetus]

You can thank Tavares for some of that. On his own without a finisher, he gets nowhere near 94 points. Don't pay him based on being propped up by an elite C. Plus he's a 22 goals, 87 point player if you take away the empty net scoring.

did he not get 94 points? get off it. lol so now empty net points dont count really? another horrible take.

 

[Suntouchable13]

yes there is its too bad we got so many forwards making so much money but I would much rather have Marner on my team than Nylander but that's just my opinion. we cannot have it all I suppose. I just dont understand trying to squeeze Mitch when he was our highest point producer.

Dubas is not prepared to throw Willy overboard. Marner has to sign closer to the Leafs number if he wants to be a Leaf.

 

[Cleetus]

Dubas is not prepared to throw Willy overboard. Marner has to sign closer to the Leafs number if he wants to be a Leaf.

that is his decision its why he gets paid to be the gm of the leafs, but I doubt they are losing Marner would be an epic fail for the leafs.

 

[kb]

did he not get 94 points? get off it. lol so now empty net points dont count really? another horrible take.

He got 94 points playing predominantly with Tavares. So let's pump the brakes on Marner's production and give credit to someone who has inflated the stats of his linemates since he entered the NHL. Switch Marner and Matthews' linemates, and see who does better.

 

[diceman934]

Nylander scored at the same rate, only ended up a +1 in the playoffs rather then a -4.
Of course, one had weaker linemates and probably weaker Quality of Opposition as well.
But they were on the same team, so why should Marner be handed a contract based on playing
pond hockey during the regular season alone. Marner looked entertaining, I know that counts
for something. Look at Kapanen speeding along with his two career assists being put on
the first line last season. It's not always about the numbers.

Nylander and Marner are not comparable in any way. Why post this nonsense.

 

[PromisedLand]

My 1st visit to Toronto was with a buddy of mine back in the summer of '91...We stayed at the Neill-Wycik 'hotel' for a handful of nights

Was walking around the nearby area during the day, and stumbled across this place known as Maple Leaf Gardens...Doors were wide open as it was a warm sunny day so we ventured in...The guys who were watching the front door/s didn't have a problem when asked if we could walk around a bit since we were fans, and were visiting from the States...It was great - we wandered around the Gold seats for a bit, the concourse, and then chatted up with an 'old salt' custodian/maintenance guy who had been an employee of MLSE for 30 plus years...It's sumthin I'll never forget.

thats pretty cool story man.....

 

[diceman934]

He got 94 points playing predominantly with Tavares. So let's pump the brakes on Marner's production and give credit to someone who has inflated the stats of his linemates since he entered the NHL. Switch Marner and Matthews' linemates, and see who does better.

Just who had more points. JT or Marner. Marner right so who inflated who’s stats. JT had more goals then assists for the first time ever as he had a superior talent then himself playing with him.

 

[Suntouchable13]

Just who had more points. JT or Marner. Marner right so who inflated who’s stats. JT had more goals then assists for the first time ever as he had a superior talent then himself playing with him.

JT produced the same amount of points he usually does, while Marner's point totals went up significantly.

 

[jrgtml67]

What I don't get is why people want Marner to be vastly overpaid and hinder their cup chances?

I don't get that!!

I feel AM contract but for 7 to 8yrs for Marner is what it should be. Nylander only got 350k or so above what many thought was fair so that deal is good to me. As for AM slightly more 650k above proper value but I guarantee someone offersheets him if he went RFA hes a center.

Marner will happen. I feel like if it gets too close to the regular season it's a bridge...but Dubas said today that Marner will be here for a long time and they continue to work toward that. I think itll be between 6 and 8yrs..if its max on term and he gets 11.65 on the button that's fine, his AAV would be way lower over 8yrs than 5,6,7...even 3 depending on the $