Management Thread | Who needs draft picks Edition

[credulous]

LOL. Just because he said so.

Sometimes fans act like they're a GM or something...

The truth is, nobody knows unless you're closely connected to the situation. If Allvin says he has options to dump cap, we should at least give him some benefit of the doubt.

i think you're misquoting allvin. he said they have options to be cap compliant. that's a way lower bar than 'dump cap'

they can be cap compliant right now if they just trade beauvillier and go with the current roster

 

[JohnHodgson]

That trade makes zero sense for Anaheim. Henrique probably their best two way forward and is on pace for just under 50 points per 82. I agree that Anaheim needs to improve their defence, but Tyler Myers is not an improvement.

The trade would be basically to save $5M for Anaheim without losing cap hit money.

Henrique is a far better player than Myers yes.

But Anaheim has 2 NHL defenseman on their roster for next year. Myers suck but he's still a warm body that can play 20 minutes a night.

i think you're misquoting allvin. he said they have options to be cap compliant. that's a way lower bar than 'dump cap'

they can be cap compliant right now if they just trade beauvillier and go with the current roster

That's semantics bud.

Dump cap, cap compliant

Doesn't matter any way you slice it.

the dead money hit years 3 and 4 are a problem.

I rather have dead cap of $4.5M than OEL making $7.1M in years 3 and 4.

Wouldn't you say so?

 

[arttk]

i think you're misquoting allvin. he said they have options to be cap compliant. that's a way lower bar than 'dump cap'

they can be cap compliant right now if they just trade beauvillier and go with the current roster

There is no reason for him to come out and say he has useless players he needs to dump. Doesn’t do him any good. Saying they will be cap compliant at least gives a sense to other GMs that he is trading players away with value to be cap compliant.

You guys would be terrible poker players.

 

[Vector]

myers doesn't want to leave vancouver. his list is going to be all bottom feeders and teams that would likely take a flyer on his last year

I have a suspicion that the Capitals would be interested in Myers and are unlikely to be on his list. His a prime candidate to be retained on as well.

 

[credulous]

There is no reason for him to come out and say he has useless players he needs to dump. Doesn’t do him any good. Saying they will be cap compliant at least gives a sense to other GMs that he is trading players away with value to be cap compliant.

You guys would be terrible poker players.

he literally said this about boeser two days ago

 

[arttk]

he literally said this about boeser two days ago

He said boeser needs to play better.
We have other players that we need to get rid of for cap reasons too. Garland, Myers for example. We don’t need them to announce that to the everyone. I rather they maintain a fake facade of wanting to keep them if it means getting us better return.

Same shit they did with Stillman.

 

[Jerry the great]

I have a suspicion that the Capitals would be interested in Myers and are unlikely to be on his list. His a prime candidate to be retained on as well.

if it brought back something of value, sure. if not, i'd kick that can to the TDL and look to shed elsewhere. Myers at the deadline will be worth something.

 

[Vector]

if it brought back something of value, sure. if not, i'd kick that can to the TDL and look to shed elsewhere. Myers at the deadline will be worth something.

What you’ll get at the deadline is going to be barely better than trading him on the off-season but with lost opportunity of using gas cap space and roster spot on a different player.

 

[SeawaterOnIce]

I don't think we need a 1st to dump Boeser. Granlund just went for a 2nd - a worst player with similar contract got traded for no retention and actually got assets.

Just need to retain down to $4.5-5M and we should be able to get assets.

That still saves us a bunch of cap, even if not optimal.

Don't think we'll need picks to dump Myers if we trade him after signing bonus. Contract is going to be very attractive to bottom feeders.

Pearson's probably going to be LTIR but let's see.

Doubt that we need to pay asset to get rid of Boeser. I can see one of the teams that want to break out of their losing cycle going after Boeser.

Not sure why you would want to pay to dump Pearson when he might be LTIR next season.

Pearson had hand surgery. If he can skate, he will probably try and draw into the lineup. Also no sure bet that Poolman is LTIRed either, it's a probablility but he could also try and make one more attempt if his symptoms clear.

On Boeser....He is a 1 dimensional winger making over 6.5 mil. Like it or not, we are sending assets with him to clear his salary. Granlund is meh too, but he has a track record of being a two-way C and is making 1.7mil less.

 

[Jerry the great]

What you’ll get at the deadline is going to be barely better than trading him on the off-season but with lost opportunity of using gas cap space and roster spot on a different player.

Depends. if you have to retain and don't get anything of value back (busted prospect) then I'd look to shed elsewhere. If you get a return by retaining a bit of salary then do it.

 

[JohnHodgson]

Pearson had hand surgery. If he can skate, he will probably try and draw into the lineup. Also no sure bet that Poolman is LTIRed either, it's a probablility but he could also try and make one more attempt if his symptoms clear.

On Boeser....He is a 1 dimensional winger making over 6.5 mil. Like it or not, we are sending assets with him to clear his salary. Granlund is meh too, but he has a track record of being a two-way C and is making 1.7mil less.

OEL buyout would save the Canucks near $7M.

The buyout alone is sufficient for the team to get better and still be compliant.

A retained Boeser should be able to net a mid round pick at least. He's better than Granlund so he should be able to get a value similar.

 

[RandV]

So you guys think FAQ will pay 5M for a Myers bonus just to trade him AND eat 20M on OEL?

Not to sound like a broken record but not happening imo. The team can still make additions (not many but a few) by moving Myers and Boeser.

OEL yes but I don't see an issue with Myers, as would still be a hockey trade.

Didn't see where it was mentioned but I wouldn't count on a Myers/Henrique trade though. If the cap goes up then with a pretty barren free agent market Anaheim would probably be able to move Henrique pretty easily if they wanted to as he's actually a good player. For the Canucks the same logic applies with Myers but you have to hope there's a sucker available who's not on his NTC list.

 

[Vector]

Depends. if you have to retain and don't get anything of value back (busted prospect) then I'd look to shed elsewhere. If you get a return by retaining a bit of salary then do it.

Just clearing a roster spot and 3m in space is a win. The team’s stated goal is to return to the playoffs and you do that by maximizing each roster spot and ice time. Next season, Myers is a 3rd pairing defender being paid 6m. Just getting out from that and shifting a portion of that to someone else just as capable or more capable is huge. The positive value accumulates over the course of the season too.

 

[JohnHodgson]

OEL yes but I don't see an issue with Myers, as would still be a hockey trade.

Didn't see where it was mentioned but I wouldn't count on a Myers/Henrique trade though. If the cap goes up then with a pretty barren free agent market Anaheim would probably be able to move Henrique pretty easily if they wanted to as he's actually a good player. For the Canucks the same logic applies with Myers but you have to hope there's a sucker available who's not on his NTC list.

It was just an idea.

Myer's contract after his SB should be attractive to bottom tier teams.

They can also flip him at the deadline for picks.

 

[andora]

I would also stop expecting the cap to rise quick enough and by enough to give us breathing room

Whatever happens happens but with this setup, i think you need to approach it as if the cap is going raising a million for the while

Or hope for something to seriously go bad and the league does a compliance buyout grace again

 

[arttk]

Pearson had hand surgery. If he can skate, he will probably try and draw into the lineup. Also no sure bet that Poolman is LTIRed either, it's a probablility but he could also try and make one more attempt if his symptoms clear.

On Boeser....He is a 1 dimensional winger making over 6.5 mil. Like it or not, we are sending assets with him to clear his salary. Granlund is meh too, but he has a track record of being a two-way C and is making 1.7mil less.

He had like 5? Wrist/hand surgeries. Who the hell know how he is doing but the last report was like this looks bad enough to be potential career ending.

Boeser is a 1 dimensional scorer and there are a boat load of teams that needs scoring help. In the off-season, there will be a bunch of teams looking for scoring help, especially shitty teams that can’t score. like I said before, this trade deadline should make it clear that GMs value players differently than we do and a lot of the times it doesn’t look like it makes any sense.

 

[krutovsdonut]

the main thing i got out of last night's game is that pettersson is genuinely happy that miller is still around. that smile after the first shorty was the biggest grin i have seen on him in a while.

i had assumed any regard pettersson had for miller staying on the team was purely anaytical based on him being helpful offensively. ep actually liking the guy is not a thing i had factored into my do we trade miller math. it really confuses me how the room works after so many months of everyone scowling.

 

[Burke's Evil Spirit]

I suspect the cap compliance plan is move Beauvilier at the draft after pumping his stats with Petey, Myers after his bonus is paid, and Pearson with a sweetener if he doesn't go to LTIR.

Which is disappointing. I think they should move one more big ticket out - preferably Boeser.

 

[Jerry the great]

Just clearing a roster spot and 3m in space is a win. The team’s stated goal is to return to the playoffs and you do that by maximizing each roster spot and ice time. Next season, Myers is a 3rd pairing defender being paid 6m. Just getting out from that and shifting a portion of that to someone else just as capable or more capable is huge. The positive value accumulates over the course of the season too.

Our glut of salary and personnel is on the wing. Hronek isn't taking on both Myers' and Schenn's minutes.....so if you're paying Myers $3mm to play elsewhere and paying his replacement.... i don't see how that puts us further ahead at all. Makes more sense to retain on Garland or Boeser IMO. Getting Livingstone might change this if it turns out he can play right away. All that said, it is precisely the scarcity of RHD that makes me think the market for Myers will be bigger than some of the doomers suggest and we won't have to retain much, if at all.

 

[Raistlin]

yes i just had to talk a buddy down of the ledge after the Hronek trade and it was pretty funny but my words of wisdom were it's just entertainment. I can watch Netflix for 2hrs or watch a Canucks game.

What i like about the Canucks is it's in real time and unfolding in real life but at the end of the day if i hate the team, hate Aquilini the last thing i want to be doing is dragging my life down because of it or spewing vitriol to others for how they fan. And in social circles people will just laugh at you if you go off about a sports team. It has legit nothing to do with real life and most people get that and dont care. They treat games like going to a movie.

I love to speculate and follow the developments. I've detached myself from the idea that some Cup raising moment will do anything great for my life or that i really care that much for the players as cool as it is. I like hockey and it's fun to watch games like last night but this MUST WIN CUP or BE THE BEST is a little fleeting to say the least. Just enjoy the ride brothers if it's good keep on keepin on if it brings you anger and hate your as much of the problem. Look in the mirror

Im glad you made it clear. Winning a cup is not important to you, Aqualini has a lifelong fan right here.

 

[Reverend Mayhem]

Im glad you made it clear. Winning a cup is not important to you, Aqualini has a lifelong fan right here.

Nah, he just has healthy boundaries around the team. I think we could all take a page from his book.

 

[Seattle Totems]

Show us how you think they could get Bedard. No team that has the option of picking Bedard is going to care about these 2 extra late first round picks that you somehow acquired. A lot of the tank for Bedard folks seem to think being slightly worse than this team currently is means Bedard is a Canuck. It's not a given the lottery works out no matter how bad this team is.

They attempt to aquire the first overall pick the same way Brian Burke aquired the Sedin twins and Pittsburgh aquired Jaromir Jagr. Aquire assets, talk to the player agent and use leverage to force a trade.

Players have no obligation to sign with the team that drafts them. If a player decides he will not sign that decreases his value to the team that holds his rights. This happens frequently in sports with top athletes and there are a number of examples in the NHL.

Obviously this is too late now and the Canucks by some account appear to have no interest in this player but:

1. Go all in on the draft. Let Boudreau ride out the season. Trade away any veterans and pending free agents that teams want. Fill these holes with prospects, players on the farm and open up slots to sign college free agents. Aim for a bottom 5 finish or lower.

2. Trade Horvat, Miller, Kuzmenko to aquire 1st round picks. 2 of those players would have been the top TDL acquisitions. Three to four 1st round picks were feasible at this draft.

2. Talk to the agent about where he wants to play. Tell them the Canucks are commited and best positioned to make a trade for the 1st overall pick if he decides not to sign with the club that drafts him.

3. Talk to other GM's. Tell them that the Canucks are walking out of the draft with the 1st pick like Burke did.

That gives the Canucks leverage to engineer a trade. Four 1sts for a player that doesn't want to sign with your organization can be stomached.

Many teams in pro sports have engineered trades like this. Jagr for instance told teams he would not be available to play but told the Penguins on the side that he would play for them. The Canucks were one of the teams that he didn't want to play for.

The Sedins told a number of teams at the draft that they wanted to play together and would not sign. This allowed Brian Burke to make a trade for the first pick. Then he made other moves to ensure the Canucks would draft the Sedins at 2nd and 3rd overall.

This was entirely doable. At worst if they were unable to engineer the trade they would have a number of top assets to target players in the offseason when player acquisition would cost significantly less. The Canucks unfortunately are at the mercy of their owner who has no vision and their management does not appear to like this player so I guess it's more of the same.

 

[AwesomeInTheory]

Lazy analysis . Benning acquired all your 4 player core.

He also whiffed hard on 2 top 10 picks. Recent history indicates it is really hard to f*** up when drafting that high.

You would think a “master talent evaluator” (remember, this is how Benning was sold to us) would have a better track record.

But no, we got Virtanen, Juolevi and a slew of other horrendous picks and contracts.

It’s very hard to 100% f*** up every single move. Law of averages dictates that some of the shit Benning flung would work.

That does not mean he did a good or even competent job, and I am stunned people are still hugging his nuts.

 

[Hit the post]

And he also spent like multiple draft worth of assets to assemble one of the most expensive and yet useless D.

@#%#% Dave Do Nothing Nonis assembled a far better blueline in fewer years than Jethro Bodine.

 

[Seattle Totems]

I would love to have Bedard as much as the next guy, but there are teams blatantly designed to lose games ahead of us in that regard...I would also agree with you thats in the organizations best interest to lose games down the stretch (thats why I was in favour of keeping Boudreau till the end of the year)....There are no guarantees in the draft though.

The reality is that we have a young-ish elite core in place (some of the best players in Canuck history)...These guys have not had the correct complimentary players in place , and the contracts of these current complimentary players has knee capped the team with no room to maneuver...The other option is to rebuild, and be pick focussed, and sell off our current elite core group (who have stated that they wont stick around for that)..That would be unprecedented....I'll take the former over the latter mystery box rebuild.

The proper rebuild should have commenced a decade ago when the Canucks were swept in the playoffs by SJS, when they fired AV...and blatantly apparent when beaten by the Flames a few years later.

Thanks for taking the time to express your thoughts on the team.

The reality is that the owner mentality is at odds with this fanbase. They are tired of trading the future to aquire other teams cast offs and term.

My issue is that this was a once in a lifetime moment for this franchise. They will never be in a position again to draft a home town generational player. It was doable. They should have made the most of their lame duck season and at least waited for prices to come down in the summer.

Poor asset management, no vision, no future, no excitement or engagement.