Management Thread | Who needs draft picks Edition

[VIPettersson]

It is real..the team is retooling..not rebuilding.

Yes but why would he say that. Its literally the only two options you can do with draft picks? OF COURSE U EITHER TRADE THEM OR DRAFT PLAYERS.

 

[credulous]

here's what 1 july 2024 looks like if you assume they qualify all of hronek, beauvillier and pettersson:

brock boeser	$6,650,000
connor garland	$4,950,000
oel	$7,260,000
jt miller	$8,000,000
tucker poolman	$2,500,000
ilya mikheyev	$4,750,000
elias pettersson	$8,820,000
quinn hughes	$7,850,000
andrei kuzmenko	$5,500,000
anthony beauvillier	$4,980,000
filip hronek	$5,280,000
thatcher demko	$5,000,000
committed	$71,540,000
cap (estimated)	$87,500,000
space (estimated)	$15,960,000

that's using the old (pre bally's bankruptcy) cap estimate. could be even worse

 

[Pastor Of Muppetz]

Yes but why would he say that. Its literally the only two options you can do with draft picks? OF COURSE U EITHER TRADE THEM OR DRAFT PLAYERS.

What was the question that he answered on that comment ?

 

[LickTheEnvelope]

Yup. Allvin just said "look at all our good players. they just need to learn to play as a team."

*sigh*

 

[Hodgy]

Bit concerning that Alvin noted in his press conference that Hronek was cost controlled for the next two years.

 

[Pastor Of Muppetz]

Why the heck didn’t they unload Miller?? They said they need a centre? Miller is a good winger but a terrible centre.

What position did he play last season ?

 

[Hodgy]

LOLOL. Alvin just comparing us to Tampa because we don't have capspace.

 

[kanucks25]

Really dislike Allvin's media availabilities lol.

Most of his answers have nothing to do with the actual question.

 

[just22]

Yup. Allvin just said "look at all our good players. they just need to learn to play as a team."

*sigh*

We’re gonna run it back again with Boeser, Myers and OEL next year, aren’t we?

 

[NoShowWilly]

assuming pearson and poolman are done. We are at 75.1m with 4 defensemen, no backup, not counting bonuses, no upgrades that address our abysmal penalty kill, no 3rd line centre, no real 4th line centre. Going be scraping min contracts to fill out the bottom half of our team like it is 2013-2014.

Im not seeing this team making the playoffs.

 

[LickTheEnvelope]

LOLOL. Alvin just comparing us to Tampa because we don't have capspace.

Hey we have an elite goalie and many elite players. So that's good. Nevermind the being a bottom 10 team in the league and having no cap, no prospects and few picks. Time to compete with Tampa.

 

[3rd Sedin]

That was not a good press conference. Epic ending by deflecting the cap crunch we consistently put ourselves under, and comparing it to Tampa who is always competitive and tight against the cap.

 

[LickTheEnvelope]

assuming pearson and poolman are done. We are at 75.1m with 4 defensemen, no backup, not counting bonuses, no upgrades that address our abysmal penalty kill, no 3rd line centre, no real 4th line centre. Going be scraping min contracts to fill out the bottom half of our team like it is 2013-2014.

Im not seeing this team making the playoffs.

Apparently Poolman is back skating.

10:30 a.m.

Tucker Poolman, who has been on IR forever with migraine issues, Travis Dermott, who has been out for a month with a recurrence of his post-concussion symptoms, and Ethan Bear, who took a puck to the mouth last week, which swelled his lip up so bad he could barely speak, are all on the ice for a skate.

Canucks trade deadline: J.T. Miller and Brock Boeser stay put

The 2023 NHL trade deadline is over. Here's how it all went down for the Vancouver Canucks.

theprovince.com

 

[Hodgy]

Hey we have an elite goalie and many elite players. So that's good. Nevermind the being a bottom 10 team in the league and having no cap, no prospects and few picks. Time to compete with Tampa.

Its just sad that he totally missed the point of the question.

Tampa is fine not taking advantage of deals because they don't have cap space because they already have great players.

 

[4th line culture]

Wouldnt want to be that terrible Colorado team having cap space to get toews

 

[Pastor Of Muppetz]

Well that's it. Trading for Hronek and not trading Miller lock this team into "be competitive now" mode rather than build the future mode. If ever there was any doubt about whether this team could be future oriented, we have our answer.

And for those who say they need to build around EP and QH because they won't stay for a rebuild this is the thing, this team is not yet close to being competitive. Adding Hronek and losing Horvat isn't going to all of a sudden make this team a contender.

So, we have a choice between two options as I see it: 1. stop following the team/become disinterested, or 2. embrace the win now mentality.

For those who choose 2, I hope you appreciate that this management is now under pressure to do some serious constructing around QH and EP to build a team that is actually competitive. And I hope that all of the unknowns, Kravtsov, Raty, Podkolzin, EP2, turn into legit NHLers closer to their upside than there downside. Because all of this has to happen.

I have yet to decide whether I'm choosing 1 or 2. But I am guarded by what we've witnessed over and over again, hope is not a plan.

There are only two options..
1. Retool around our current core (EP,QH,JTM,TD),change up complimentary players.
2. Rebuild...move out the the current core (EP,QH,JTM,TD), hoard picks, and start again.

Really dislike Allvin's media availabilities lol.

Most of his answers have nothing to do with the actual question.

Agreed, he's pretty good at compressing a whole bunch of words, while conveying absolutely nothing..lol

 

[iFan]

Really dislike Allvin's media availabilities lol.

Most of his answers have nothing to do with the actual question.

To be fair our media asks pretty dumb questions

 

[Gurn]

Funny- Alvin says it's on him, that the team didn't make the play offs.
In which case, why did they fire the coach?

I get that English is not his first language, but man oh man.

 

[Ita]

No I don't. They need to add two top four defensive defense men, a legit 3C, a solid backup, and a high end 2C within one to two years as MIller gets older. And they need to do that without having draft capital or strong prospect assets. In otherwords, they need to get extremely lucky with the development of players in their system or in adding college FAs as NY did with Fox.

I agree. Everything pretty much has to go perfectly AND they need to uncover free elite assets like Fox for them to even have a chance of in becoming a contender.

Realistically, the chance of everything happening so perfectly is very slim. It's much more likely for this team to be stuck in mediocrity for the next decade.

 

[Seattle Totems]

I dont care what Pettersson and Hughes want. They won't want to be here when the team continues to miss the playoffs either.

I would gladly blow up this lame duck season and go all in for the 1st overall pick. The Canucks could have acquired two or three 1st round picks in this draft. They will miss the playoffs either way.

They could have used those assets to force a trade for the 1st overall pick who is rumored to possibly not want to play for a number of franchises. Or they pick 3 times in the 1st round on a very good draft.

My gut however says the Canucks do not like that player and they would trade that pick if he somehow landed in their lap. Either way, they have wasted this and every opportunity to rebuild while they were a non playoff team. It's been more than ten years of this.

If they had acquired picks like any normal franchise and rebuilt during their down cycle we would not be having this conversation. All the Canucks have done is extend their losing period and turn off their fanbase.

 

[SelltheTeamFrancesco]

Jeez... Jim Benning is such a bitch for trading for OEL and prioritizing Pearson instead of getting Petey on a long term contract (among all the other disastrous deals he made).

Boeser, Myers, Pearson, and Poolman all have to go. Poolman probably LTIR. OEL the Canucks are stuck with until he LTIRetires

Really OEL is really the only contract new management can bitch about. They signed Boeser, Miller, Mikheyev, Kuzemenko turned Horvat into 8+ million (on the books next season probably would have cost less to sign him). Pearson and Poolman will probably be on LTIR for the remainder of their time as Canucks. Myers should be an easy contract to get rid of because of the actual money owed you just have convince the owner to pay the bonus then trade him. What are we still crying about Garland. Jim Benning left them in a awful position but they have gotten fortunate with injuries and could have been patient and been in much better position with the salary cap. Alvin sitting up their saying we don't have salary cap flexibility to take advantage of capitalizing on other teams salary cap crunches well it's because of your decisions.

 

[logan5]

So I guess everybody figures we should be following the Avalanche model?

 

[Jovofan]

I dont care what Pettersson and Hughes want. They won't want to be here when the team continues to miss the playoffs either.

I would gladly blow up this lame duck season and go all in for the 1st overall pick. The Canucks could have acquired two or three 1st round picks in this draft. They will miss the playoffs either way.

They could have used those assets to force a trade for the 1st overall pick who is rumored to possibly not want to play for a number of franchises. Or they pick 3 times in the 1st round on a very good draft.

My gut however says the Canucks do not like that player and they would trade that pick if he somehow landed in their lap. Either way, they have wasted this and every opportunity to rebuild while they were a non playoff team. It's been more than ten years of this.

If they had acquired picks like any normal franchise and rebuilt during their down cycle we would not be having this conversation. All the Canucks have done is extend their losing period and turn off their fanbase.

Ding, ding, ding! We have a winner.

Instead of the constant "retool" "compete" "playoffs or bust" mindset that our incompetent owner subjected our equally incompetent and inept GM with when it was obvious this team was a dumpster fire headed nowhere years ago we might actually be somewhere today. But this "our fanbase won't accept a rebuild" garbage has resulted in 8 missed playoffs in the past 10 years (and would've been 9 if we weren't "saved" by the bubble) with many of those being at the very bottom of the league, like not just missing out but missing so badly we were amongst the absolute worst franchises in the league. I don't think the fanbase accepts that either, I sure as hell don't.

But, if we had an actual plan, maybe we would've only missed 5 of those playoffs but would've had a cupboard full of prospects, picks and movable assets with enough cap space to sign those gems we did unearth to longterm deals while continuing the mine for more. But no, we had to sacrifice years on Jay Beagles and Antoine Roussells and extending others to anchor contracts that are dragging us down.

It's been 12 damn years since we were in Game 7 of the Stanley Cup Final and we are further away from that goal now than we were when Aquilini decided to fire Gillis and replace him with Benning. We're onto a completely new regime now and still seeing the same results, hearing the same BS at Trade Deadline Pressers without any end in sight. It is absolute madness.

 

[mriswith]

The cap situation is every bit as bad right now as it was for Benning's entire tenure.

I remember writing about how much cap space was being wasted in the Eriksson/Beagle/Roussel era and it's no different today 4 years later. Amazing.

So I guess everybody figures we should be following the Avalanche model?

There's no such thing as the avalanche model. There's a bunch of isolated things they did well to learn from but it's not a model any team can follow.

You have to look at your franchise and ask yourself where is the cap advantage going to come from? How are you going to get from your current position to a position where the roster is more efficient than its cap hit?

The answer to those questions is not "buy at the deadline while 6th last and with 26M of dead cap on the roster".

There's no specific model that fits this team at this point. We are closest to the pre-McDavid Oilers and the Eichel era Sabres except there's no miracle coming to save this franchise like both of those franchises received.

 

[krutovsdonut]

This can't be real. "Allvin: I'm not collecting picks just to collect picks. Mentions he either collects them to draft hockey players or trade them." This is one of the dumbest things I have ever heard from a professional sports team front office member.

he is just rhetorically saying don't fetishize picks for their own sake. i am ok to criticize this guy but for god sakes let's not embrace a ruthervin on empty culture here where we twist everything they say into hilarious gaffes and then after a while start to believe our own disingenuity.