LW Anthony Mantha - Val d'Or, QMJHL (2013, 20th overall, Detroit)

[member 202355]

Very talented player. I can see why the Wings are so high on him, he's been awesome in the World Juniors.

 

[Sonofamitch]

He's a good Prospect. Let's see how it translates to the NHl.

 

[JohanFranzenstein]

Can't remember the last time our organization was buzzing so much about a prospect. Hope he brings size and scoring touch to the NHL level.

 

[Heraldic]

This might not be the popular opinion but Im not sure Grigorenko is more of a sure thing. Both of these guys are offensive types but for all his hype Grigorenko fell quite a bit in his draft year. Mantha was picked a few picks later in a strong er draft, I think draft position wise theyre pretty even all things considered.

But as offensive types Mantha has produced more and even in this tournament where Grigorenko has experience, Mantha is putting on a way better showing offensively. Mantha has a more physical/feisty side to his game and has scrapped a bit as well. I'm not sure I would say Grigs is a more sure thing than Mantha at this point at all

Yes, they both fell for similiar reasons. Skill/potential-wise Mantha could have been a lot upper, but he showed some "flag"-indications and fell. Same thing with Grigorenko.

Mantha has produced more in this tournament, yes. Mantha has also played with better linemates. Grigorenko is THE forward in Russian's team. He doesn't have support from players like Drouin or Laughton in his line.

Disagree totally. Mantha imo will be the better player.

If they both develop according to their full potential, there is no doubt that Grigorenko will be the more valuable player. Elite-level playmaking centers with ability to score are a lot more valuable than extremely one-dimensional "floating" goal scorers.

 

[SimplySolace]

If they both develop according to their full potential, there is no doubt that Grigorenko will be the more valuable player. Elite-level playmaking centers with ability to score are a lot more valuable than extremely one-dimensional "floating" goal scorers.

Psst, your bias is showing.

 

[Nemesis Prime]

Hated the Mantha pick on draft day, still hate it today.

 

[Heraldic]

Psst, your bias is showing.

It's your decision to grab on to individual words and ignore the rest.

Of course Mantha can develop into something like elite goal scorer. I just don't think he has the same potential as for example Thomas Vanek (who can also be a "floater" unfortunately often).

As a center Grigorenko is obviously mandated to be more active and participated, if he is to be succesfull. To put it short - Grigorenko has more responsibilities, which makes him more valuable.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

Yes, they both fell for similiar reasons. Skill/potential-wise Mantha could have been a lot upper, but he showed some "flag"-indications and fell. Same thing with Grigorenko.

Mantha has produced more in this tournament, yes. Mantha has also played with better linemates. Grigorenko is THE forward in Russian's team. He doesn't have support from players like Drouin or Laughton in his line.



If they both develop according to their full potential, there is no doubt that Grigorenko will be the more valuable player. Elite-level playmaking centers with ability to score are a lot more valuable than extremely one-dimensional "floating" goal scorers.

Well that wouldn't be developing to his full-potential. That is certainly an area the Wings are hoping to help round out.

Also watch the Russian team, if you think Grigs is alone on the talent level that is an extremely laughable position.

I wouldn't really compare him to a center, the only center he reminds me of is Jeff Carter who has converted out to wing anyway. A James Neal or Jeff Carter would be his ceiling type projection, guess you can call those guys floaters, I wouldn't though. They can be quiet for stretches and absolutely grab the game by the throat with bursts of brilliance. They are tough checking assignments with lightning releases that don't need a whole lot of space and for bigger men they skate and protect the puck very well. Both can get criticized for not being physical enough, but a part of their impact in the game is they like to find dead areas from time to time and don't always finish checks. You aren't going to push them around though or take away scoring chances from them by trying to get physical with them.

We will see what he becomes, but he has a lot of tools. He is fast for a man his size, has room for growth still and hopefully the Wings can help work out some of the rough areas that is certainly the plan.

Grigorenko is likewise far from a final player. Luckily from what we know of the Wings Mantha will not have even close to the same hap-hazard development strategy Buffalo seems to be attempting.

 

[Heraldic]

Well that wouldn't be developing to his full-potential. That is certainly an area the Wings are hoping to help round out.

Okay. Let's then take this Gandalf-treatment position, and say that Grigorenko developing to his full-potential would be all that said before addition with perennial selke-candidate level of defensive game.

Also watch the Russian team, if you think Grigs is alone on the talent level that is an extremely laughable position.

I didn't say he is playing with garbage, but Slepyshev and Buchnevich are FAR away from Drouin and Laughton.

I wouldn't really compare him to a center, the only center he reminds me of is Jeff Carter who has converted out to wing anyway. A James Neal or Jeff Carter would be his ceiling type projection, guess you can call those guys floaters, I wouldn't though. They can be quiet for stretches and absolutely grab the game by the throat with bursts of brilliance. They are tough checking assignments with lightning releases that don't need a whole lot of space and for bigger men they skate and protect the puck very well. Both can get criticized for not being physical enough, but a part of their impact in the game is they like to find dead areas from time to time and don't always finish checks. You aren't going to push them around though or take away scoring chances from them by trying to get physical with them.

We will see what he becomes, but he has a lot of tools. He is fast for a man his size, has room for growth still and hopefully the Wings can help work out some of the rough areas that is certainly the plan.

Grigorenko is likewise far from a final player. Luckily from what we know of the Wings Mantha will not have even close to the same hap-hazard development strategy Buffalo seems to be attempting.

Well, I wasn't the one making the comparison. That was an answer to DatsyukianDekes statement. I don't say that one-dimensional goal scoring wingers don't have any value. I just say that they have less value than playmaking and scoring centers.

It's hard to say which would have been the best route for Grigorenko. As I said, him and Mantha are almost same age, therefore Grigorenko couldn't play in AHL after the first season after his draft. Two years in Q wold have been pretty brutal for his development, because he was already dominating the Q like Mantha is doing now. Dominating in juniors does nothing good to anyone's progress.

 

[Birko19]

Can't remember the last time our organization was buzzing so much about a prospect. Hope he brings size and scoring touch to the NHL level.

I would have said when Zetterberg broke into the league but the I remembered that same year right after, Grigorenko dominated the WJC before his accident and was hyped a lot. That was the last time the Wings had a buzz around a prospect like this.

 

[PensBandwagonerNo272*]

People acting like Grigorenko is a bust even though he's still playing in the freakin WJC

Pulling for that kid hard even though I otherwise couldn't care less

 

[JohanFranzenstein]

Hated the Mantha pick on draft day, still hate it today.

Can I ask why?

 

[GoAwayDanCleary]

Okay. Let's then take this Gandalf-treatment position, and say that Grigorenko developing to his full-potential would be all that said before addition with perennial selke-candidate level of defensive game.



I didn't say he is playing with garbage, but Slepyshev and Buchnevich are FAR away from Drouin and Laughton.



Well, I wasn't the one making the comparison. That was an answer to DatsyukianDekes statement. I don't say that one-dimensional goal scoring wingers don't have any value. I just say that they have less value than playmaking and scoring centers.

It's hard to say which would have been the best route for Grigorenko. As I said, him and Mantha are almost same age, therefore Grigorenko couldn't play in AHL after the first season after his draft. Two years in Q wold have been pretty brutal for his development, because he was already dominating the Q like Mantha is doing now. Dominating in juniors does nothing good to anyone's progress.

Mantha hasn't played with Laughton at all. And Grigorenko was not dominating the Q the way Mantha is this year.

 

[mindfly]

Can I ask why?

If you're not a "heavy" 200ft forechecking, aggressive player, you SUCK.

 

[Revo]

Okay. Let's then take this Gandalf-treatment position, and say that Grigorenko developing to his full-potential would be all that said before addition with perennial selke-candidate level of defensive game.



I didn't say he is playing with garbage, but Slepyshev and Buchnevich are FAR away from Drouin and Laughton.



Well, I wasn't the one making the comparison. That was an answer to DatsyukianDekes statement. I don't say that one-dimensional goal scoring wingers don't have any value. I just say that they have less value than playmaking and scoring centers.

It's hard to say which would have been the best route for Grigorenko. As I said, him and Mantha are almost same age, therefore Grigorenko couldn't play in AHL after the first season after his draft. Two years in Q wold have been pretty brutal for his development, because he was already dominating the Q like Mantha is doing now. Dominating in juniors does nothing good to anyone's progress.

I beg to differ (bold part). Grigorenko never dominated the Q the way Mantha is. You would have a hard time finding anyone credible that follows the league and that would agree with you on that one.

 

[newfy]

Yes, they both fell for similiar reasons. Skill/potential-wise Mantha could have been a lot upper, but he showed some "flag"-indications and fell. Same thing with Grigorenko.

Mantha has produced more in this tournament, yes. Mantha has also played with better linemates. Grigorenko is THE forward in Russian's team. He doesn't have support from players like Drouin or Laughton in his line.



If they both develop according to their full potential, there is no doubt that Grigorenko will be the more valuable player. Elite-level playmaking centers with ability to score are a lot more valuable than extremely one-dimensional "floating" goal scorers.

I definitely wont go on record saying one or the other will be better, theyre both great prospects. I just didnt agree earlier when it sounded like Grigorenko is clearly ahead theyre definitely comparable. But if youve been watching, Mantha has been Canada's best forward in the tournament as well, outplaying higher talent than Grigorenko has to to be Russias top dog. Mantha also isnt playing with Laughton, and even though hes playing with Drouin (it obviously helps) the fact that hes been more impressive and easy to compare to him is a positive sign for me.

Laughton isnt with Mantha and Drouin either, its Leier and Hudon.

As for your last paragraph, ya your bias is showing. You act as if because one is a center he wont float, but thats exactly what Grigs does a lot of and it hurts a center even more. If I were a fan of Buffalo I would be worried about that more than a floating winger. A winger can get away with some floating, will the center ever be able to handle his assignments?

As for production, no Grogorenko hasn ever dominated the Q like Mantha has and hes not dominating the World Juniors nowlike Mantha is. Quit acting like Grigorenko is ahead of Mantha for some reason, theyre definitely on the same level

 

[tony d]

Guy has looked pretty good during the World Juniors and has been one of the best players on Team Canada. Detroit sure has a budding future star in him.

 

[Henkka]

Guy has looked pretty good during the World Juniors and has been one of the best players on Team Canada. Detroit sure has a budding future star in him.

I've heard that Detroit doesn't have anybody good in the system, after Datsyuk and Zetterberg retires.

 

[DatsyukianDeke*]

I've heard that Detroit doesn't have anybody good in the system, after Datsyuk and Zetterberg retires.

That's not good. What will we do when Steve and Feds retire ?

 

[mindfly]

My french isn't the best, but I guess this is the list for most points at the WJC for a Quebecois? Could become the best with 3 more points in 2 games... far from impossible.

Meilleurs Québécois dans l’histoire du CMHJ

Patrice Bergeron (2005) 13 pts
Anthony Mantha (2014) 11 pts
Eric Dazé (1995) 10 pts
Martin Gendron (1994) 10 pts
Mario Lemieux (1983) 10 pts
Yanick Dubé (1994) 10 pts
Alexandre Daigle (1995) 10 pts

 

[Mathletic]

My french isn't the best, but I guess this is the list for most points at the WJC for a Quebecois? Could become the best with 3 more points in 2 games... far from impossible.

Meilleurs Québécois dans l’histoire du CMHJ

Patrice Bergeron (2005) 13 pts
Anthony Mantha (2014) 11 pts
Eric Dazé (1995) 10 pts
Martin Gendron (1994) 10 pts
Mario Lemieux (1983) 10 pts
Yanick Dubé (1994) 10 pts
Alexandre Daigle (1995) 10 pts

yeap, most points at the WJC by a Québecois

 

[WesNichols14]

I beg to differ (bold part). Grigorenko never dominated the Q the way Mantha is. You would have a hard time finding anyone credible that follows the league and that would agree with you on that one.

Numbers don't lie

Mikhail Grigorenko
11-12 59GP, 40G, 45A, 85P 1.44 PPG 0.67 GPG
12-13 33GP, 30G, 24A, 54P 1.63 PPG 0.90 GPG

Anthony Mantha
12-13, 67GP, 50G, 39A, 89P 1.32 PPG 0.74 GPG
13-14, 32GP, 35G, 38A, 73P 2.28 PPG 1.09 GPG

not only that but Grigs had Erne and Duclair on his team. Mantha is his team.

 

[DatsyukianDeke*]

Numbers don't lie

Mikhail Grigorenko
11-12 59GP, 40G, 45A, 85P 1.44 PPG 0.67 GPG
12-13 33GP, 30G, 24A, 54P 1.63 PPG 0.90 GPG

Anthony Mantha
12-13, 67GP, 50G, 39A, 89P 1.32 PPG 0.74 GPG
13-14, 32GP, 35G, 38A, 73P 2.28 PPG 1.09 GPG

not only that but Grigs had Erne and Duclair on his team. Mantha is his team.

but Grigs was drafted lower. That must mean something.... right ?

 

[Scotty B]

Totally forgot about Daze but Mantha does remind me a lot of him now that it is mentioned. Rare combo of size, skating, and sniping but plagued by inconsistency. Ripped up the Q too - though not to the degree Mantha is - and had several 30 goal seasons during the DPE. Best comparison I've heard for Mantha so far...

I remember Daze from our 1995 WJ dream team ( wasn't it? ), He definitely had a knack for scoring, just like Mantha, Big Kid, back issues ruined his career as I recall. But listening to Daze talk, he never sounded very bright. Not so Mantha...

 

[Scotty B]

Mantha and Hudon have both been very good. No idea what Canada was thinking having them as bubble guys.

Because they ( Hockey Canada ) have that cookie cutter mentality where the ( potential ) top 6 guys have to be this type...& the potential 3rd/4th line checker/ energy guys gotta be this type blah, blah, blah

Can't mustn't think outside the box, oh no...can't have 4 lines that can score...course not...

So a lesser talent like Gauthier's got it made in the shade...Meanwhile two vastly superior guys like Mantha and Hudon ( who made it last yr, barring injury ) are life/ death to make the team

Makes perfect sense to me....NOT!