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Leon Draisaitl 3rd 110+ point season in 4 years...

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Hockey Outsider said:
With the disclaimer that this stat is (obviously) completely cherry-picked, here's a list of the only 12 players in NHL history who have scored 110+ points in at least three out of four seasons:
  • Adam Oates
  • Bobby Orr
  • Guy Lafleur
  • Jari Kurri
  • Marcel Dionne
  • Mario Lemieux
  • Mike Bossy
  • Paul Coffey
  • Peter Stastny
  • Phil Esposito
  • Wayne Gretzky
  • Leon Draisaitl
The last time a player did this was Adam Oates and Wayne Gretzky (after the 1993-94 season). It's been almost 30 years.
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Nice work on this, appreciate it. And justified this as a thread worthy topic. Pretty incredible.
 
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I am Canadian said:
The Western conference is weaker than the East this year, so I'm saying with the top two players in the world it's interesting that the Oilers wouldn't be on the top of the conference. Due to how complex hockey is as a team sport to find success.

Their record versus the Atlantic is not relevant as I'm talking about position within the conference. And if it was, they'd be #3 in the Atlantic as well anyway.

I'm not dunking on the Oilers, I'm not sure why you are so up in arms about my comment.
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West isn't weaker than East anymore.
 
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Video Nasty said:
Yeah, why recognize real life accomplishments? Let’s have another Peter Pan Neverland what if pace thread.
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Where was the thread for 105? Will there be one for 115? 120?

That's what the person was saying. We just had a 100pt thread for Draisaitl a week ago, which again is silly since I never see a McDavid 100pt or 110pt thread

Draisaitl has hit 100 every season idt theres a need to remind folks yearly about it, which doesnt happen with Kucherov or McDavid

But Im personally not saying it cant be here; I dont mind and if I did id just not participate. just pointing out what that person meant
 
Zur En Arrh said:
Lmfao, more like lemieux and kevin Stevens... Matthews >>Drai and it's NEVER been close..
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Which NHL player has the most goals in the NHL the last 5 years? The sniper Matthews? Ohh wait....the best in the game mcdavid.....oh wait....

Draistl is probably he best passer in the game, always takes the most faceoffs for the oilers, usually around 55%, is almsot always top 1 or 3 in GWG and of course the goals.

Mathews is an excellent player saying never close is an absurd comment.
 
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Olive Branch said:
Where was the thread for 105? Will there be one for 115? 120?

That's what the person was saying. We just had a 100pt thread for Draisaitl a week ago, which again is silly since I never see a McDavid 100pt or 110pt thread

Draisaitl has hit 100 every season idt theres a need to remind folks yearly about it, which doesnt happen with Kucherov or McDavid

But Im personally not saying it cant be here; I dont mind and if I did id just not participate. just pointing out what that person meant
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I suspect the thread was made because Drai has notched 110 on the nose 3 times now and it’s such a high water mark not matched by many other players over the past 35+ years.

There’s been only 12 other players in league history who have reached the mark more times than Drai (and McDavid) and they’re all legends.

Much like my own thread highlighting that he’s the only player since Gretzky to be top 4 in both goals and points for 4 seasons in a row and 10 games away from 5 seasons in a row, these are significant accomplishments and numbers that need to be acknowledged.

McDavid is held to a higher standard and we discuss him every day in multiple threads. The creation of threads works a little differently with him.
 
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Why do some Oilers fans insist on bringing up Matthews unprovoked?? I don’t get it, even as an Oilers fan myself. It’s cringy as hell.
 
Hockey Outsider said:
With the disclaimer that this stat is (obviously) completely cherry-picked, here's a list of the only 12 players in NHL history who have scored 110+ points in at least three out of four seasons:
  • Adam Oates
  • Bobby Orr
  • Guy Lafleur
  • Jari Kurri
  • Marcel Dionne
  • Mario Lemieux
  • Mike Bossy
  • Paul Coffey
  • Peter Stastny
  • Phil Esposito
  • Wayne Gretzky
  • Leon Draisaitl
The last time a player did this was Adam Oates and Wayne Gretzky (after the 1993-94 season). It's been almost 30 years.
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Drasaitl was also pacing for over 110 in the COVID season too. What a monster.
 
Fourier said:
Here is what you said :


The clear implication is that the better the player the more he inflates everyone's point totals. I simply showed you that as a blanket statement this is not true. You also took this incorrectly as a slight to McDavid. Again this is wrong. In fact it simply has to do with how a player's game changes when playing with McDavid. In Nuge's case he has tended to be very passive playing with McDavid focusing more on the defensive side. Away from McDavid, centering his own line, he is the guy who controls where the puck goes. So while the team scores more goals when McDavid and Nuge are on the ice together than they do when Nuge is centering his own line Nuge's own point totals 5 vs 5 don't generally go up with McDavid since he is involved in a much smaller percentage of the goals scored. Hence Nuge's 5 vs 5 scoring has historically declined playing with McDavid.

On the pp things are a little different. Nuge plays a key role here as he is the secondary puck handler on the Oilers pp. So while in the past he was the main ppqb he still gets a lot of high impact touches on the pp so in this case the extra goals the team scored over in previous years pretty much balanced out his modest decline in his role on the pp.

The key point is that no matter who you are when you play with McDavid your role becomes complementary. If you are a player whose game dictates that you need the puck a lot to put up points you may not do as well playing with McDavid as someone who is use to a more complementary role. So your blanket statement while seemingly intuitively clear is actually not correct. This is not just a McDavid thing either. Over the last three years Ratanen has a slightly higher scoring rate away from McKinnon than he does with.

Since this thread is about Leon one of the things that has impressed me the most about Leon is his ability to adapt his game to playing with McDavid. When they came out of Juniors their games were very much opposites of one another. Leon's tendency was always to slow the game down and control the puck. McDavid's game is transition and constant motion in the offensive zone. Leon was also very much a pass first player. Playing with McDavid Leon adapted to the high tempo transition game and became much more of a shooter. That one-timer from near the goal line is something he practiced like crazy. You could see it in the warm-up years ago. Leon would plant himself in that spot and he and McDavid would do there thing while everyone else went about their business. While I would still say he is complementary to McDavid he is so skilled that when they play together they feed off of one another almost equally. This year that has been somewhat less true than in the past few years as McDavid has elevated his game and with Draisaitl obviously not being 100% for much of the year.

At this point in his career Leon can play the game either way depending on who he is with. Play him on a line with a guy like Marner or Kane and he will be the trigger man. Play him with a sniper and he will be Backstrom with a much better shot.
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No player in the league has benefited from the PP this year more than Nuge and it’s not even close. He is the only player in the league to have more than half his points on the PP. You attempting to argue that he benefits more offensively by not playing on the PP with McDavid and being the PPQB is quite comical.
 
dwonger said:
Another insane stat. Leon has 53 Primary assists (tied for first) and only 13 Secondary assists which is an absolutely unheard of ratio.
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Arguably the best passer in the league. Off his backhand it’s not even debate, his backhand passing is incredible.
 
Yackiberg8 said:
No player in the league has benefited from the PP this year more than Nuge and it’s not even close. He is the only player in the league to have more than half his points on the PP. You attempting to argue that he benefits more offensively by not playing on the PP with McDavid and being the PPQB is quite comical.
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I am not sure if you did not read what I said or did not understand it. So I will review it for you.

1) I pointed out that 5 vs 5 Nuge was an example of a player who over the years has scored at a higher rate away from McDavid than with him. This counters your arguement that McDavid boosts every player scoring more than any other player in the league.

Specifically about the pp here is what I said:
On the pp things are a little different. Nuge plays a key role here as he is the secondary puck handler on the Oilers pp. So while in the past he was the main ppqb he still gets a lot of high impact touches on the pp so in this case the extra goals the team scored over in previous years pretty much balanced out his modest decline in his role on the pp.
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Note the use of the term "in previous years". The point being, until this year Nuge's scoring rate on the pp was similar in the past to what it was when he was the ppqb. You will note I said nothing about this year specifically.

As for this year...No one would argue that Nuge has not benefit immensely from McDavid on the pp. But what is true is that McDavid benefits from Nuge as well as he is a key component of the pp. Since I assume you watch all the Oilers games you must surely know this.

Bottom line is that you made a statement this is provably false and doubled down on it multiple times. If you find your own error amusing, then I am happy to have added some levity to your life.
 
Fourier said:
I am not sure if you did not read what I said or did not understand it. So I will review it for you.

1) I pointed out that 5 vs 5 Nuge was an example of a player who over the years has scored at a higher rate away from McDavid than with him. This counters your arguement that McDavid boosts every player scoring more than any other player in the league.

Specifically about the pp here is what I said:

Note the use of the term "in previous years". The point being, until this year Nuge's scoring rate on the pp was similar in the past to what it was when he was the ppqb. You will note I said nothing about this year specifically.

As for this year...No one would argue that Nuge has not benefit immensely from McDavid on the pp. But what is true is that McDavid benefits from Nuge as well as he is a key component of the pp. Since I assume you watch all the Oilers games you must surely know this.

Bottom line is that you made a statement this is provably false and doubled down on it multiple times. If you find your own error amusing, then I am happy to have added some levity to your life.
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You discuss Nuge’s 5v5 play with McDavid (a small sample) as if he doesn’t also play with him on the PP. Look at the Oilers near the top of the league in scoring. McDavid is the reason they are all having career years. He is the offensive driver of that time, multiple attempts to say otherwise is very bizarre. Check who is leading the league in points by a mile.

Nuge does not have the impact on the PP that McDavid does. I hate to be the one to break that to you bud. McDavid is the biggest reason for the Oilers PP success. You’re lying to yourself if you think otherwise.

McDavid generates the most offence in the league and it’s not close.
 
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Yackiberg8 said:
You discuss Nuge’s 5v5 play with McDavid (a small sample) as if he doesn’t also play with him on the PP. Look at the Oilers near the top of the league in scoring. McDavid is the reason they are all having career years. He is the offensive driver of that time, multiple attempts to say otherwise is very bizarre. Check who is leading the league in points by a mile.

Nuge does not have the impact on the PP that McDavid does. I hate to be the one to break that to you bud. McDavid is the biggest reason for the Oilers PP success. You’re lying to yourself if you think otherwise.

McDavid generates the most offence in the league and it’s not close.
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You seem to be having a difficult time understanding what I said and what I did not say, but more interestingly you seem to be challenged to understand what you said. The issue seems to be one of basic logic. Just because A is true does not mean that A implies B.

I have never said that McDavid is not the best offensive player in the league. he indisputably is. What I posted about was your assertion that this meant that McDavid would therefore increase everyone else's he plays with scoring more than anyone else in the league could.

Let me summarize...You made a statement involving a universal quantifier. I gave you a counterexample and hence your statement is provably false. The fact that you don't see that your rebuttal does not contradict this is again proof that both your argument is flawed and that you don't even understand what you are arguing in the first place.

(By the way the small sample is 5154 minutes Nuge played away from McDavid 5 vs 5 vs 1271 minutes with him over the last seven years. )
 
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