Friedman: Leafs do not see Marner making more than Kane

[Legion34]

See Corsica or Evolving wild which don't include empty net goals in their 5v5 total (aka no freebies). Matthews has scored more (non-freebie) EV goals than anyone in the league since he entered. All her numbers are accurate but NHL.com has a more basic approach so that's the difference you ran into. Matthews numbers are absolutely silly. The best goal scorer in the league hands down at EV strength with upside to boot. Jealous..

And the guy must lead the league in BS taken back goals.

 

[Legion34]

But that goes out the window when he made Matthews the 2nd highest paid player in the league and Matthews has never been top 20 in points. Or PPG.

He scores goals at the same rate as ovechkin. He signed for 13.5-14 percent of the cap

What do you think he should have got?

 

[Skinnyjimmy08]

To call those deals "insane" is pure hyperbole and just an indication you aren't to be taken seriously on this issue

Well seeing how livid majority of fans were after these deals were signed, i feel insane is a good word. Fans were losing their minds and were trashing Dubas like ive never seen before. Go back and read the thread when AM signed. Its quite entertaining

 

[Tripod]

See Corsica or Evolving wild which don't include empty net goals in their 5v5 total (aka no freebies). Matthews has scored more (non-freebie) EV goals than anyone in the league since he entered. All her numbers are accurate but NHL.com has a more basic approach so that's the difference you ran into. Matthews numbers are absolutely silly. The best goal scorer in the league hands down at EV strength with upside to boot. Jealous..

Ok, I appreciate that info. Even on NHL.com, it only changed by like 1 spot I think so no biggie but I now know why the difference. I still would not call EN goals freebie because you still need to score them. Hell, Tavaras had lots of "freebies" due to some sweet Marner passes.

As I said earlier, having 3 stars is a good thing to have. And stars cost big money. Cut 3 million by trading AJ and play Bracco instead. Keep your stars happy.

 

[Legion34]

Marner is one of the most entertaining players in the league

But 360’spins and diving like you have been shot blockijgna basic shot don’t make him better

Contracts are based on production. Not flash. Otherwise Marner should be behind mcdavid money

 

[Legion34]

Well seeing how livid majority of fans were after these deals were signed, i feel insane is a good word. Fans were losing their minds and were trashing Dubas like ive never seen before. Go back and read the thread when AM signed. Its quite entertaining

Were they actual fans?

 

[Skinnyjimmy08]

Were they actual fans?

Youll see all the usual posters that are leaf fans displaying their displeasure heavily

Plus the fans on the Leaf board were fired right up

 

[Martin Skoula]

Ok, I appreciate that info. Even on NHL.com, it only changed by like 1 spot I think so no biggie but I now know why the difference. I still would not call EN goals freebie because you still need to score them. Hell, Tavaras had lots of "freebies" due to some sweet Marner passes.

As I said earlier, having 3 stars is a good thing to have. And stars cost big money. Cut 3 million by trading AJ and play Bracco instead. Keep your stars happy.

Nah, Marner signs a fair deal or we get 4 1sts. Those are the only two options. Giving Marner more than market value to "keep him happy" is not one of those options.

 

[Legion34]

Youll see all the usual posters that are leaf fans displaying their displeasure heavily

Plus the fans on the Leaf board were fired right up

I don’t think many posters on the leaf board are actual fans

The winter soldier was the biggest poster for years. Most just want to complain

 

[Skinnyjimmy08]

Nah, Marner signs a fair deal or we get 4 1sts. Those are the only two options. Giving Marner more than market value to "keep him happy" is not one of those options.

He will get more than market tho to keep him happy unfortunately

IMO the kid will be worth every penny. VERY special player

 

[Mickey Marner]

Well seeing how livid majority of fans were after these deals were signed, i feel insane is a good word. Fans were losing their minds and were trashing Dubas like ive never seen before. Go back and read the thread when AM signed. Its quite entertaining

Some people on the Leafs board absolutely hate Dubas. Like, to them, Matthews and Nylander being overpaid by a few hundred-thousand totally off-sets the additions of Tavares and Muzzin and then some.

 

[Martin Skoula]

He will get more than market tho to keep him happy unfortunately

IMO the kid will be worth every penny. VERY special player

I'm sure whatever team pays him more than market value will be thrilled with him. The 4 1sts will sting but they'll get over it eventually

 

[The Podium]

Haha we will see

What was AM's leverage to get the contract he did? This is Dubas we are talking about. He hasnt done to well the last 2 big contracts. And from what ive seen on here and everywhere else, Leaf fans agree fully.

I havent seen so many Leaf fans on here actually as upset/pissed off as they were after those signings than when AM/Willy signed their insane deals. It was chaos

Matthews was a bad contract, Nylander's isnt bad at all. The only issue is the hold out, but thats more on Willy than on Dubas.

Also whether or not the other 2 were handled poorly have no barring here. Dubas literally cannot afford to overpay Marner.

 

[Martin Skoula]

I was responding to a Maple Leafs fan who has previously made this comment in a thread about Barzal and Marner:



I think he has watched more than 5 Leafs games as well, and he came to this conclusion. I’ve watched well over 5 games and I’ve come to the same conclusion.



My issue with his credibility is that I believe he is more of a fan with a check mark than he is an objective analyst. I provided some evidence

My issue with the methodology is he isn’t looking seriously enough at the Nylander comparison and the way that Toronto has been paying their players. It seems to me like he came to the conclusion that $9.16M for 6-7 years would be a fair contract for Marner, and that may be accurate, but he’s being dishonest with himself here if he honestly believes that is what Marner is taking.

So you are of the belief that Toronto's management team takes comparables, gets a contract value based off of those... And then adds X% to it for fun?

Is it maybe possible that you just don't understand who their comparables are and how much they make as a percentage of cap? No, of course it's more likely that the guy who wrote the CBA is giving out free money, you're JoeThorntonsRooster after all, he's just some nobody.

 

[JoeThorntonsRooster]

So you are of the belief that Toronto's management team takes comparables, gets a contract value based off of those... And then adds X% to it for fun?

Is it maybe possible that you just don't understand who their comparables are and how much they make as a percentage of cap? No, of course it's more likely that the guy who wrote the CBA is giving out free money, you're JoeThorntonsRooster after all, he's just some nobody.

Are you of the belief that Toronto’s management team did not pay John Tavares, William Nylander, and Auston Matthews more than their comparables? Are you of the belief that Jeff Veillette is correct, and that Marner will be paid $9.16M over 6-7 years?

 

[Menzinger]

Well seeing how livid majority of fans were after these deals were signed, i feel insane is a good word. Fans were losing their minds and were trashing Dubas like ive never seen before. Go back and read the thread when AM signed. Its quite entertaining

Some fans are dumb, or at least unrealistic when it comes to their expectations

 

[SupremeNachos]

He needs someone to set him up.That's a passenger.

That would apply to any player. Can't do anything with the puck if you don't have it.

 

[Snowpants]

Did you legitimately fail math class?

<=9.5 does is not the same as <9.

3 posts somehow means majority?

No I did okay in math... maybe you can help me with this problem:

If the goal posts are moved by Leafs fans two meters every time they comment on an HFBoards subject how far will they have moved after 40 pages?

Again, how much is Rantanen going to make and is that a comparable to Marner?

Oops the posts have moved two meters again better update that math above. Now suddenly it is about how much a player on a totally different will make and not the perfectly comparable contract on his own team. Strange how that keeps happening.

 

[Bank Shot]

Hes signed his contracts more or less within the market value of where they should be.

To make Marner the highest paid winger in the league would be unprecedented

He signed them for a little more every time.

Matthews and Tavares are 2 of the top 4 paid players in the league.

I see lots of Leaf fans that feel Marner is their best player.

How are the Leafs going to approach Marner and ask him to take less than the others?

 

[Nervousbreakdown]

He signed them for a little more every time.

Matthews and Tavares are 2 of the top 4 paid players in the league.

I see lots of Leaf fans that feel Marner is their best player.

How are the Leafs going to approach Marner and ask him to take less than the others?

By using actual stats and comparables in the negotiation as opposed to the gut feeling of morons?

 

[MLSE]

Marner is one of the most entertaining players in the league

But 360’spins and diving like you have been shot blockijgna basic shot don’t make him better

Contracts are based on production. Not flash. Otherwise Marner should be behind mcdavid money

Production like being 11th in points with 94 points at age 21.

He's going to get paid.

 

[Legion34]

Production like being 11th in points with 94 points at age 21.

He's going to get paid.

He will get paid. The question is. How much. Do you really think the 11th overall in league scoring should be the highest paid player in the league?

 

[Tripod]

He will get paid. The question is. How much. Do you really think the 11th overall in league scoring should be the highest paid player in the league?

Do you thing the 42nd leading scorer should be #2 paid player in the league?

Dubas did.

 

[McFlyingV]

By using actual stats and comparables in the negotiation as opposed to the gut feeling of morons?

Did they use those comparables in the Matthews negotiations?

 

[Legion34]

Do you thing the 42nd leading scorer should be #2 paid player in the league?

Dubas did.

When he scores at the same rate as ovechkin. And the cap went up...

Probably?