Proposal: Laf for Turcotte

[GoldenBearHockey]

How is this myth continued to be said time and time by our fanbase? I am told on our homeboard it's "sarcasm" whenever it is said, but it sure doesn't seem like it.

In the last couple of seasons.

Bjornfot currently in NHL at 20, NHL regular at 19 (played NHL games at 18)
Kaliyev currently in NHL at 20 (played NHL games at 19)
Byfield currently in NHL at 19 (played NHL games at 18)

How can you look at those guys and continue to say that LA refuses to put young players in the NHL?

Honestly? Because Turcotte.....

Also....because those are more recent examples vs the decades before......could they be outliers, could they be changing atmosphere, too soon to tell, next year if Clarke plays in the NHL, signifies more changing atmosphere than outliers, right?

 

[Herby]

Honestly? Because Turcotte.....

Also....because those are more recent examples vs the decades before......could they be outliers, could they be changing atmosphere, too soon to tell, next year if Clarke plays in the NHL, signifies more changing atmosphere than outliers, right?

Because Turcotte what? Turcotte got a chance in the NHL at 20 and was ineffective, others who have been more effective have stuck on the Kings roster as 19-20-21 year olds. Turcotte would be in the AHL on most teams, he has a long way to go.

Why should decades before matter when that was under a former GM?

Outliers? Rob Blake has been GM of the Kings five seasons and there have been four different players play NHL games as teenagers with multiple players becoming regulars at 19-20-21. It's almost an annual thing.

2018-2019
Jaret Anderson-Dolan (19)

2019-2020
Gabe Vilardi (20) (regular at 21)
Tobias Bjornfot (18) (regular at 19)
Mikey Anderson (20) (regular at 21)

2020-2021
Quinton Byfield (18). (regular at 19)
Arthur Kaliyev (19) (regular at 20)
Rasmus Kupari (20) (semi-regular at 21)

2021-2022
Alex Turcotte (20)

That is a lot of outliers.

There is absolutely zero basis in fact that the Kings don't consider players before they are 21. I know though, if the Kings had Seider or Zegras they would be in Ontario, that is the cool thing that everyone says!

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

Because Turcotte what? Turcotte got a chance in the NHL at 20 and was ineffective, others who have been more effective have stuck on the Kings roster as 19-20-21 year olds. Turcotte would be in the AHL on most teams, he has a long way to go.

Why should decades before matter when that was under a former GM?

Outliers? Rob Blake has been GM of the Kings five seasons and there have been four different players play NHL games as teenagers with multiple players becoming regulars at 19-20-21. It's almost an annual thing.

2018-2019
Jaret Anderson-Dolan (19)

2019-2020
Gabe Vilardi (20) (regular at 21)
Tobias Bjornfot (18) (regular at 19)
Mikey Anderson (20) (regular at 21)

2020-2021
Quinton Byfield (18). (regular at 19)
Arthur Kaliyev (19) (regular at 20)
Rasmus Kupari (20) (semi-regular at 21)

2021-2022
Alex Turcotte (20)

That is a lot of outliers.

There is absolutely zero basis in fact that the Kings don't consider players before they are 21. I know though, if the Kings had Seider or Zegras they would be in Ontario, that is the cool thing that everyone says!

Settle down big fella,

Vilardi a regular....Byfield is not a regular right now....etc,

If the argument is that the Kings don't play 19-20 year olds in at least one game, ok sure you would have a point,

Out of the 7 players you listed in what 4 seasons..... 3 have taken regular shifts with no issues.....You can maybe make an argument for Byfield, but I'd argue that due to injury and others, it took him more than half a season to become regular, and he's struggling at that...

 

[Herby]

Settle down big fella,

Vilardi a regular....Byfield is not a regular right now....etc,

If the argument is that the Kings don't play 19-20 year olds in at least one game, ok sure you would have a point,

Out of the 7 players you listed in what 4 seasons..... 3 have taken regular shifts with no issues.....You can maybe make an argument for Byfield, but I'd argue that due to injury and others, it took him more than half a season to become regular, and he's struggling at that...

Settle down what?

The argument that is constantly said on our board is not factually correct, period. It makes our entire fanbase look ignorant.

Vilardi played an entire season in the NHL last year, that constitutes being a regular. I'm sorry his play was so underwhelming that he was sent down to the minors, that doesn't mean he wasn't given a chance in the NHL at 20 and became a regular at 21. Byfield is not going back down to the minors, if that was the plan he would have been down by now with how he has played.

If you want to argue that Turcotte and Vilardi should be in the NHL that is fine, but lets not resort to factually incorrect myths to try and strengthen your arguments.

 

[Lays]

Why tf would NYR trade Lafreniere for Turcotte.

 

[Kurrilino]

Why tf would NYR trade Lafreniere for Turcotte.

Why is this gem even revived?
It was nicely burried

 

[Kurrilino]

How is this myth continued to be said time and time by our fanbase? I am told on our homeboard it's "sarcasm" whenever it is said, but it sure doesn't seem like it.

In the last couple of seasons.

Bjornfot currently in NHL at 20, NHL regular at 19 (played NHL games at 18)
Kaliyev currently in NHL at 20 (played NHL games at 19)
Byfield currently in NHL at 19 (played NHL games at 18)

How can you look at those guys and continue to say that LA refuses to put young players in the NHL?

Our peeps in general seem to have a hard time when a player is send back to the minors to polish the game.
It is somehow seen as instant bust situation.

I though by now, people would have learned by watching Kempe that player development judgement shouldn't be done
before a player is 26, when reaching the prime.
There is also no problem with keeping a player in the minors until 26 if the development stalls.

 

[Herby]

Our peeps in general seem to have a hard time when a player is send back to the minors to polish the game.
It is somehow seen as instant bust situation.

I though by now, people would have learned by watching Kempe that player development judgement shouldn't be done
before a player is 26, when reaching the prime.
There is also no problem with keeping a player in the minors until 26 if the development stalls.

Kurri,

Waivers hit at 23 years old. You can’t keep guys worth a damn in the minors beyond that.

 

[bernmeister]

Why tf would NYR trade Lafreniere for Turcotte.

I get everybody wants a buy low bargain. But this presumes seller is interested in moving product at present, now. NY seeing rewards of patiently waiting, LaF is beginning to deliver, and the main factor, as I and others have said, is increased mobility from better skating.
Also if moved, would be at a profit, not equal value, and not undersized maybe guys.

 

[Schmooley]

There is absolutely zero basis in fact that the Kings don't consider players before they are 21. I know though, if the Kings had Seider or Zegras they would be in Ontario, that is the cool thing that everyone says!

Kings have been bringing up dmen sooner but you think Seider would be getting the same opportunity as he is in Detroit?
Top pair minutes and 1st unit powerplay time over Doughty? You really think that would happen?
I suppose next year well find out with Clarke.
You think Zegras would be in LAs top six and top powerplay? JAD is getting a look there today so maybe it would have been him moved up mid season but I have my doubts.

 

[Herby]

Kings have been bringing up dmen sooner but you think Seider would be getting the same opportunity as he is in Detroit?
Top pair minutes and 1st unit powerplay time over Doughty? You really think that would happen?
I suppose next year well find out with Clarke.
You think Zegras would be in LAs top six and top powerplay? JAD is getting a look there today so maybe it would have been him moved up mid season but I have my doubts.

Yes. Both would be playing key roles in LA. Seider would be the second best d-man on LA and Zegras would be filling an offensive role in LA. This is the same organization that played Gabe Vilardi in a scoring line role all last season but wouldn’t find a role for the 2 best rookies in the NHL?

I never said their production would be identical, I just shot down the laughably bad take that has been made numerous times on our board that “both would be playing in Ontario”

 

[Schmooley]

Yes. Both would be playing key roles in LA. Seider would be the second best d-man on LA and Zegras would be filling an offensive role in LA. This is the same organization that played Gabe Vilardi in a scoring line role all last season but wouldn’t find a role for the 2 best rookies in the NHL?

I never said their production would be identical, I just shot down the laughably bad take that has been made numerous times on our board that “both would be playing in Ontario”

Yea thats true I dont think either of those guys would be in Ontario but not in the same roles they are in right now on their teams either. NHL roles affect development also.
I think a guy like Raymond would have been either a mid season call up or not given first line minutes on the Kings to start the year.
Zegras and Seider are kind of incomparable to other prospects as they look to be the cream of the crop so far.

 

[duhmetreE]

How about Nils Lundkvist for Turcotte?

 

[bsu]

Why tf would NYR trade Lafreniere for Turcotte.

Agreed....

 

[FSL KINGS]

How about Nils Lundkvist for Turcotte?

Nils &?

 

[duhmetreE]

Nils &?

I think it's a pretty fair deal. Turcotte is a solid prospect blocked in the big league. Nils is a solid prospect blocked in the big league. If you want to say Turcotte can play Center, therefore 'worth more', there could be a minor add. Whether it's a mid pick or a player like Hajek/Gauthier.

 

[FSL KINGS]

I think it's a pretty fair deal. Turcotte is a solid prospect blocked in the big league. Nils is a solid prospect blocked in the big league. If you want to say Turcotte can play Center, therefore 'worth more', there could be a minor add. Whether it's a mid pick or a player like Hajek/Gauthier.

Kings don't really need any more RD. They could use a LD, but with Mikey & Björn being young, a vet would be a better fit.

 

[OrangePMD]

I think it's a pretty fair deal. Turcotte is a solid prospect blocked in the big league. Nils is a solid prospect blocked in the big league. If you want to say Turcotte can play Center, therefore 'worth more', there could be a minor add. Whether it's a mid pick or a player like Hajek/Gauthier.

LA doesn't have a roster spot for Nils, and they have very good RHD prospects already. He'd be blocked there too.

 

[cwede]

How about Nils Lundkvist for Turcotte?

the thing is, LAK folks say they need LD not RD
(Clarke soon, and still Doughty, i get it)
and they want a young upside LD w size and skill

but the guy who NYR could offer that fits that description
(just turned 22, 6'4, 216#,107 NHL games, recently scored a wicked shootout goal, then next game a wicked wraparound),
would only possibly be made available for the perfect fit of skill, age, build and meets a need -
like a recent 2OA guy that LAK has no intention at all of moving

the deal that always seemed a fit to me was Zac Jones for Gabe or Kupari
but the vocal Kings posters always argue "too small"

 

[YP44]

How about Nils Lundkvist for Turcotte?

Kings easily say no, and I think you know that, but it is closer than Laf for Turcotte IMO

 

[Herby]

How about Nils Lundkvist for Turcotte?

Fair value, but the Kings are overloaded with young RH defenders.

 

[YP44]

the thing is, LAK folks say they need LD not RD
(Clarke soon, and still Doughty, i get it)
and they want a young upside LD w size and skill

but the guy who NYR could offer that fits that description
(just turned 22, 6'4, 216#,107 NHL games, recently scored a wicked shootout goal, then next game a wicked wraparound),
would only possibly be made available for the perfect fit of skill, age, build and meets a need -
like a recent 2OA guy that LAK has no intention at all of moving

the deal that always seemed a fit to me was Zac Jones for Gabe or Kupari
but the vocal Kings posters always argue "too small"

I'm actually getting pretty ok with LA's left side as well, assuming some of the righties can play their off wing. If LA is trading any of their top 5 prospects I think it needs to be part of a package for a top pair D under team control, or a legit Goalie prospect.

 

[jay from jersey]

LA doesn't have a roster spot for Nils, and they have very good RHD prospects already. He'd be blocked there too.

Robertson + Gauthier

I’m huge on Robertson, so I’d hate to see him go, I also think Turcotte is a wing in the NHL. But if I’m NYR, I’d take the gamble

 

[Kurrilino]

Kurri,

Waivers hit at 23 years old. You can’t keep guys worth a damn in the minors beyond that.

I never said anything like that.
I said players can't be judged before they hit 26.
If they are 23 and can't make anything happen in the AHL, there is a slim chance the player will make ever.

Beside that, if you don't give a player a contract right after draft, you win 1-2 more years of development.
Also waiver works only when moved from pro team down to minor team.
Nothing speaks against keeping a player in the minor until UFA age if contracts are signed.

Basically a player who signed an entry level contract will be waiver material after 160 NHL games or 5 years after signing. If you sign a player when 20, you can keep him for 5 years if he doesn't play 160 NHL games first.
Being 25 is a perfect age to judge the development

 

[kinghock]

How about Nils Lundkvist for Turcotte?

How many times should Kings say NO to Nils Lundkvist?