hockey20000
Registered User
- Dec 23, 2018
- 4,906
- 2,932
13.5million for 3 years is laughable the leafs need to just move on from these guys marner and matthews are not gonna win a cup there they only care about there own pockets.
Rumor: Kypreos says Matthews will be 13.5M (Haggling over term)
- Thread starter mkatcherin00
- Start date
- Status
Kobe Armstrong
Registered User
- Jul 26, 2011
- 15,760
- 6,731
Golden_Jet
Registered User
- Sep 21, 2005
- 26,376
- 13,682
How many points did Pettersson get in the playoffs. Oh wait….
Exactly.
Well, Pettersson and the Canucks only made it the one time so far, but Pettersson did put up 18 points in 17 GP. He's also coming off a 102 point season where he came in 7th in Selke voting. He's definitely in that elite upper tier, so I'm not really sure why he's getting hated on here.
Regarding Matthews, 13.5 MIL seems a bit over the top to me. This is especially true because this guy is going to set the bar for all other star players in Toronto, if he maximizes his earnings, why wouldn't they? If Matthews takes a bit of a discount, then I bet you Toronto management will be in a much stronger position to request that of their other star players when negotiating their extensions. I would think taking Mackinnon money should be kind of the cap, and I think that would represent a bit of a discount.
13.5M ouuffff that's too much for him. He's not even a top 10 player in the league...
Martin Skoula
Registered User
- Oct 18, 2017
- 12,225
- 17,212
Watching the Avs and Oilers, there are many nights where Makar/Rantanen and Drai are the best player on their team. MacK and McD have off nights or other players have good nights, what’s wrong with that?
BLONG7
Registered User
At this point though, none of those players are asking for more money.......it sounds like AM wants more money??
kevsh
Registered User
- Nov 28, 2018
- 3,671
- 5,154
From February of this year, while he was going through probably his least impressive season statistically:
McDavid, then who? Players, coaches, execs vote for NHL's top centers
The Oilers captain is a clear-cut No. 1 -- and then the debates begin. Here are the top 10 pivots in the league right now.
Of course this poll was limited to centers, but it's hard to argue that the #2 center as voted by NHL execs/players is not in the top 10 overall.
But I do agree that $13.5M is steep. If a longer term, fine as it's certain that salaries for top players are going to eclipse that number within a few years. But on a 4 or less year term, not a great number.
PainForShane
formerly surfshop
- Dec 24, 2019
- 2,869
- 3,301
To use your own example, would Adin Hill have gotten even close to 4.9m on a multi-year deal if Vegas hadn't won the cup. Of course not, before this year's playoffs Adin Hill was a fringe NHLer (maybe he still is), he's barely played 100 NHL regular season games in his entire career.
Please show me (and everyone else) another goalie who is not especially young nor a top prospect, has never played more than 30 reg season games in a year, and is getting paid almost 5m a year on a multiyear deal.
Assuming you can't (because you can't), that means strong playoff performances do affect player salaries / AAV. Which is obvious. To everyone.
Thanks.
***
P.S. And also, obviously no one is saying (or believes) Barbashev deserves 10 million or Marchy deserves McDavid money. So who is the one "just saying things," it certainly isn't me.
Ragamuffin Gunner
Lost in the Flood
It must feel pretty good for the other Leafs that have to take less money or be traded so that AM can get over 13M.
Cal Peterson. Merzlikins etc.
Regular season success is far more determinant of top salaries than playoffs.
It’s completely indisputable.
There are always some who get slightly overpaid for intangibles. Look at Perry foligno this year in the lower market.
But top players get paid regardless of playoff success.
Many top young players are getting 8 million and never even played a platoff game.
- Jan 22, 2007
- 14,665
- 7,787
Paying Matthews 13.5 is ludicrous tbh. Want to see how "out of whack" the Leafs salaries are? Which core would you rather have moving forward?
Leafs Core
Auston Matthews: 13.5 million (3-5 year deal)
William Nylander: 9 million (5-6 year deal)
Mitch Marner: 10.9 million (ready for new deal)
John Tavares: 11 million
Total: 44.4 million
vs.
Other core
Tim Stutzle: 8.3 million (just signed long-term)
David Pastrnak: 11.25 million (just signed long-term)
Matthew Tkachuk: 9.5 million (just signed long-term)
Jack Hughes: 8 million (just signed long-term)
Andrei Svechnikov: 7.75 million (half remaining on long-term)
Total: 44.8 million
Paying Matthews 13.5 on a short-term deal, plus the domino effect, will ensure the Leafs don't win a Cup while he's here.
Leafs Core
Auston Matthews: 13.5 million (3-5 year deal)
William Nylander: 9 million (5-6 year deal)
Mitch Marner: 10.9 million (ready for new deal)
John Tavares: 11 million
Total: 44.4 million
vs.
Other core
Tim Stutzle: 8.3 million (just signed long-term)
David Pastrnak: 11.25 million (just signed long-term)
Matthew Tkachuk: 9.5 million (just signed long-term)
Jack Hughes: 8 million (just signed long-term)
Andrei Svechnikov: 7.75 million (half remaining on long-term)
Total: 44.8 million
Paying Matthews 13.5 on a short-term deal, plus the domino effect, will ensure the Leafs don't win a Cup while he's here.
Mr Bill Waters
iq >170? then lower your tone when @ing me
You have to remember the cap is going up - alot. He will want 13.5x3 and Tre will want 13.5x5.
They will settle at 13.5x4 - fair market price which will look sweeter if he returns to MVP calibur seasons - and that's not out of the relm of possibility since he just entered his prime.
not sure any of the guys you listed are going to win a cup either, so not sure what that is proving.
Beukeboom Fan
Registered User
Agree with your last sentence. With that said, I'm not sure why it's relevant to compare the Leaf's core vs. 5 players from different teams who have some of the best contracts in the league? Are the Leafs trying to beat an all-star team?
Earlier in the thread, I caught heat for daring to compare AM to another #1C in Brayden Point. I get that AM has scored 60 goals, and won the Hart, which I consider to be at least partially to be a media popularity contest. When they're healthy though, I would expect them to produce similar offense numbers, and they're both very good defensively. If the contract rumors are true, AM is going to make 40% more, which is enough that the Lightning get to also have a couple legit NHL'ers on the roster instead of a guy making the league minimum. That makes a huge difference, and why I agree with your last sentence.
Golden_Jet
Registered User
- Sep 21, 2005
- 26,376
- 13,682
Well if you don’t think Matthew’s will win a cup, then maybe should move him.
BB88
Registered User
- Jan 19, 2015
- 41,497
- 21,884
McDavids contract is too old to mean anything relating Matthews next contract.
But Mackinnons contract should be where Matthews lands on 8 year deal and under that with 5 or less. Will never happen though
PainForShane
formerly surfshop
- Dec 24, 2019
- 2,869
- 3,301
Cal and Elvis were both clearly regarded as their team's future starters when they signed those deals. Their teams viewed them as top prospects / young players. On the other hand, Adin Hill was on his 3rd team in three years and probably not even on Vegas' long term depth chart when 2023 playoffs started, he was barely a backup goalie in the NHL. Clearly in Adin Hill's case, playoff performance is what got him paid.
But, like you said, obviously regular season success is far more determinant of top salaries (and salaries in general) than playoffs. No one is or ever was arguing this.
And also like you said, top players get paid regardless of playoff success. No one is or ever was arguing this either. It's also true many top young players are making 8m+... and no one is or ever was arguing this either.
***
What I am / have been arguing (and is obvious) is that players tend to get paid more if they have playoff success. Because playoff success is considered one of those intangibles you mentioned in your post above. This explains a few things, incl why a 38 year old Perry still continues to get contracts in this league (it's because he always raises his game in the playoffs), how MacK became the highest paid player in the world (role in cup run), why Adin Hill's deal was at least a couple mil higher than it should have been solely based on his regular season track record (obviously because he's a cup winning starter) etc etc.
***
No one knows why you've been going out of your way to argue against this basic idea for multiple posts. To use your own insult, you are just saying things.
Thx
Golden_Jet
Registered User
- Sep 21, 2005
- 26,376
- 13,682
He’s one of the listed players.
As to the 13.5 number, only way he should get that is for 8 years.
KrisLetAngry
MrJukeBoy
Honestly i am fine if the contract is 13.5 by 6 to 8 years.
The tricky part is how do you do 13.5 for 3 or 4 years meanwhile McKinnon signed for 12.6 for 8 years.
The tricky part is how do you do 13.5 for 3 or 4 years meanwhile McKinnon signed for 12.6 for 8 years.
drktmplr12
Registered User
which looks more like leadership?
AB + MT @ 19.5 AAV until 2030
AM + MM @ 25.4 AAV until 2025
AM is many good things. a leader he is not.
AB + MT @ 19.5 AAV until 2030
AM + MM @ 25.4 AAV until 2025
AM is many good things. a leader he is not.
KrisLetAngry
MrJukeBoy
If Tkachuk took a 1 year deal I wouldn't be shocked if that last year wouldn't have net him a 11 million a year.
Also taxes are different
Maple Leaf
VIP
- Sep 18, 2009
- 9,849
- 5,079
- Status
