Confirmed with Link: Kyle Dubas Not Returning

[Mess]

I'm guessing Brendan Shanahan current biggest regret based on the results of the past 5 years and now the conclusion is that he walked away for HOF GM Lou Lamoriello.

Lou Lam inherited an 80 point non- playoff NYI team, and lead them to back to back final 4 appearances in 2019-20 & 2020-21 (Losing both times to Cup Champs TB) while being named Exec of year both times. Dubas managed teams were embarrassing losing to Columbus and Montreal during this same time period.

That doesn't even factor in that Lou Lam gifted Dubas his #1C and franchise player Tavares to stack the deck even further for Toronto potential success.

What if he had just stuck with Lou these last 5 years and allowed him to benefit from drafting Auston Matthews what would things have been like?

I wish we could turn the clock back 5 years and have a DO OVER and pretend the Dubas Era in TO never happened and I suspect so does Shanny now.

 

[Sypher04]

Shanahan chose Dubas.

Shouldn't Shanahan be fired, too?

There is a distinction. Dubas was not fired, they just did not extend him. I would say Shanahan is on the clock. He’s got 2 seasons to right this or he’s gonna get the same treatment

 

[Donnie740]

I am waiting and waiting and waiting for Shanahan's next presser, announcing the new GM.

I’m waiting for him to announce that Bozo the Keefe will be joining his buddy in the unemployment line.

 

[Sypher04]

I'm guessing Brendan Shanahan current biggest regret based on the results of the past 5 years and now the conclusion is that he walked away for HOF GM Lou Lamoriello.

View attachment 711453 View attachment 711459

Lou Lam inherited an 80 NHL playoff NYI team and lead them to back to back final 4 appearances in 2019-20 & 2020-21 (Losing both times to Cup Champs TB) while being named Exec of year both times.

That doesn't even factor in that Lou Lam gifted Dubas his #1C and franchise player Tavares to stack the deck even further for Toronto potential success.

What if he had just stuck with Lou these last 5 years and allowed him to benefit from drafting Auston Matthews what would things have been like?

I wish we could turn the clock back 5 years and have a DO OVER and pretend the Dubas Era in TO never happened and I suspect so does Shanny now.

This post is pretty garbage in a lot of ways, but it is fair to say we’ll never know for sure what may have happened.

That said, likely doesn’t change that much. Our failure is predominantly on the core forwards here. Dubas had his role, but even if we saved a mil or two combined between Matthews, Marner, Nylander it would not have changed much if our core guys cannot muster the will to win.

Highly unlikely Lou passes on JT.

 

[go_leafs_go02]

There is a distinction. Dubas was not fired, they just did not extend him. I would say Shanahan is on the clock. He’s got 2 seasons to right this or he’s gonna get the same treatment

No he was fired. His contract expired in the next little bit and he's no longer employed as of today.

 

[The Masters]

Friedge contacted his source at MLSE: "It's like Game of Thrones right now"

Lol

 

[acrobaticgoalie]

Dude Tverberg is a 5'11 forward who doesn't bring grit and size and wasn't a productive player in the NCAA (never had a pt/game season).

How many late prospects go on to become tangible contributors in the NHL if they can't become even ppg as a 3rd year in NCAA?

I don't see what makes him much different than Dakota Johsua (2014 draft) or Domnic Tonianto (2012 draft) level prospect. Both those guys were 5th rounders, while Tverberg is a few rounds later at 7th

His ceiling is a 11th best forward on the team and it will likely take another 2-3 years before he gives us that.

Niemela and Hirvonen are potential top 4D/Top 9 forwards from 2020. Amirov was trending to be a 2nd - 3rd liner prior to getting diagnosed.

His best drafts are 2018 and potentially 2022 as that KHL kid looks to have big boom potential

Every scouting profile and article I've read says Tverberg finishes every check, likes to throw big hits, forechecks hard and takes the puck hard to the net. Seen a few articles saying he's comparable to Acciari.

Maple Leafs Might Have Another Late-Round Gem in Tverberg - The Hockey Writers Latest News, Analysis & More

The Maple Leafs signed 2020 seventh round pick Ryan Tverberg to an entry-level deal and he could get an opportunity to play soon.

thehockeywriters.com

 

[Sypher04]

No he was fired. His contract expired in the next little bit and he's no longer employed as of today.

Semantics. His contract was ending, they weren’t renewing it, so he has been let go early. I’ll agree it’s somewhere between the two things we said. It’s clear, if Dubas wasn’t negotiating for a new deal this summer and he had not handled it the way he did that he’d have still be here based on Shanahans comments.

Either way, doesnt change my point on Shanahan being a different situation

 

[notbias]

Every scouting profile and article I've read says Tverberg finishes every check, likes to throw big hits, forechecks hard and takes the puck hard to the net. Seen a few articles saying he's comparable to Acciari.

Maple Leafs Might Have Another Late-Round Gem in Tverberg - The Hockey Writers Latest News, Analysis & More

The Maple Leafs signed 2020 seventh round pick Ryan Tverberg to an entry-level deal and he could get an opportunity to play soon.

thehockeywriters.com

You're replying to someone who has never watched any of the prospects he is talking about clearly.

It is pointless.

 

[57 Years No Cup]

Adding a NMC after bending over on term and dollars is a train wreck.

Yup. The Dubasites have to wrap their heads around this: Dubas already screwed us on the Matthews, Marner, and to a lesser extent Nylander NMCs/NTCs.

The only question now is how much that damage can be mitigated.

 

[Apex Predator]

Look in my eyes
What do you see?
The cult of personality
I know your anger, I know your dreams
I've been everything you want to be
Oh, I'm the cult of personality
Like Mussolini and Kennedy
I'm the cult of personality
The cult of personality
The cult of personality
Neon lights, a Nobel prize
When a mirror speaks, the reflection lies
You won't have to follow me
Only you can set me free
I sell the things you need to be
I'm the smiling face on your TV
Oh, I'm the cult of personality
I exploit you, still you love me
I tell you, one and one makes three
Oh, I'm the cult of personality
Like Joseph Stalin and Gandhi
I'm the cult of personality

 

[notbias]

Yup. The Dubasites have to wrap their heads around this: Dubas already screwed us on the Matthews, Marner, and to a lesser extent Nylander NMCs/NTCs.

The only question now is how much that damage can be mitigated.

No, it isn't that. The senile old folks here just have no clue how cap hit vs cap hit % works, don't realize Dubas wanted the 5, Matthews wanted 8, don't understand how many players get NMC, etc...

It is embarrassing that they will be presented with this stuff and still push their own narrative. I am giving them the benefit of the doubt that in their old age they forget these things.

 

[CaptainCrunch17]

The same ownerships board that approves 24 million + salaries for guys on the Jays and 35 million + for guys on the Raptors probably isn't going to suddenly tighten the purse strings for the Leafs.

Especially if the alternative is trading the biggest star this franchise has had in decades for draft pick and lesser assets.

Imo too many people are coming at this issue from their own pov, and not enough time thinking about how an ownership group that's not as emotionally attached to the team is going to behave

The Blue Jays and the Rogers Center (Skydome) are wholly owned by Rogers Communications.

MLSE is owned by Rogers (37.5%), Bell (37.5%) and Larry Tanenbaum 25%.

 

[hamzarocks]

You're replying to someone who has never watched any of the prospects he is talking about clearly.

It is pointless.

No, I just don't comment on prospects with heavy homer glasses like yourself. Your still reeling from Dubas being gone so understandable

I commented that Tverberg is Hyman/bunting type of grit, but he hasn't had the production in the NCAA that makes you think he will make the NHL. Being below ppg as a 3rd year in the NCAA is very rare for a prospect who will be an impact player (Hyman was one of them, and that could be Tverberg if all goes perfectly).

Playing a physical game at 5'11 in the NCAA and trying to do the same in the NHL while being limited in production, will likely equate to a 4th line grinder, not a prospect that is worth pointing to as a hit yet.

 

[notbias]

No, I just don't comment on prospects with heavy homer glasses like yourself. Your still reeling from Dubas being gone so understandable

I commented that Tverberg is Hyman/bunting type of grit, but he hasn't had the production in the NCAA that makes you think he will make the NHL. Being below ppg as a 3rd year in the NCAA is very rare for a prospect who will be an impact player (Hyman was one of them, and that could be Tverberg if all goes perfectly).

Playing a physical game at 5'11 in the NCAA and trying to do the same in the NHL while being limited in production, will likely equate to a 4th line grinder, not a prospect that is worth pointing to as a hit yet.

a 7th rounder who is a 4th line grinder is a hit.

 

[hamzarocks]

Every scouting profile and article I've read says Tverberg finishes every check, likes to throw big hits, forechecks hard and takes the puck hard to the net. Seen a few articles saying he's comparable to Acciari.

Maple Leafs Might Have Another Late-Round Gem in Tverberg - The Hockey Writers Latest News, Analysis & More

The Maple Leafs signed 2020 seventh round pick Ryan Tverberg to an entry-level deal and he could get an opportunity to play soon.

thehockeywriters.com

Exactly, he is a 4th line-type prospect, is what I was saying. Acciari/Tonanito/Joshua type prospect.

He isn't someone you consider a hit unless he steps into the NHL and makes a larger impact than expected.

a 7th rounder who is a 4th line grinder is a hit.

A 7th rounder who may become a 4th line grinder is inconsequential and isn't a prospect worth noting as signs of strong drafting under Dubas

Hirvonen/Niemela have top 4D and top 9 forward potential, those are players if the Leafs can get onto the team will be valuable contributors, and point to guys who either help us win or are valuable enough to trade for a nice addition. Those are picks looking to be good and worth praising, not Ryan Tverberg

If we're praising this pick, then Dakota Joshua was a gem from Burke/Nonis

 

[Menzinger]

Friedge contacted his source at MLSE: "It's like Game of Thrones right now"

Lol

I think people are likely really underestimating how chaotic things are going to be in the front office for a few weeks. Even after Shanny eventually finds the next GM,.they'll need time to settle things and sort their own people out ect.

Hopefully they have time to figure out the Matthews contract in the meantime

 

[saffronleaf]

Florida Panthers:

1 "Analyst"
2 "Assistant General Managers"
1 "Video Coach"
1 "Director of Player Personnel"
2 "Director of Hockey Operations"

3 fans

 

[Jimmy Firecracker]

The fact that the MLSE Board was heavily involved makes this situation even worse. Ownership meddling when it comes to this franchise is never good.

 

[TheDoldrums]

Yup. The Dubasites have to wrap their heads around this: Dubas already screwed us on the Matthews, Marner, and to a lesser extent Nylander NMCs/NTCs.

The only question now is how much that damage can be mitigated.

Every franchise is giving talents like Matthews a NMC as soon as its allowed. This is the cost of doing business with superstars. I feel like people have no idea the amount of NMC/NTC out there around the league. Theres no world where Matthews signs an extension without it.

 

[Stephen]

What’s interesting is Dubas wanted to “streamline” the reporting process because he felt like the reporting structure was too complicated. Having to run things up to Shanahan and then the board, then all the way back down and that would be an issue during this seasons negotiations.

How could that possibly be if Shanahan could fire Dubas within 24 hours of the contract demand over a Thursday evening to a full press conference?

 

[leafs in five]

I think if we put our heads together we could come up with a good name for people who agreed with many of the decisions Kyle Dubas made when he was GM of the Toronto Maple Leafs

 

[Stephen]

The fact that the MLSE Board was heavily involved makes this situation even worse. Ownership meddling when it comes to this franchise is never good.

I dunno. Notice how almost everyone at MLSE that wasn’t a Kyle subordinate or hire seemed to be problematic at one point or another? Or the fact that Kyle was willing to come back despite everyone’s dysfunction? Dubas isn’t an innocent here. He’s in it to win it and that’s not exclusive to the product on the ice.

 

[Racer88]

I’m waiting for him to announce that Bozo the Keefe will be joining his buddy in the unemployment line.

I’m thinking the new GM will have that delicious pleasure

 

[Donnie740]

I think if we put our heads together we could come up with a good name for people who agreed with many of the decisions Kyle Dubas made when he was GM of the Toronto Maple Leafs

The Dubas Fan Boi Club didn’t just “agree” with many of his decisions - - they insisted he was an infallible new age thinker and that every move was a brilliantly crafted decision backed by analytics.