tom_servo
Registered User
Was Seravelli wrong? He said Dubas turned down GM job. Dubas is not the GM.
Confirmed with Link: Kyle Dubas named President of Hockey Operations
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Ryder71
Registered User
- Nov 24, 2017
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To me that's what makes it all the more delicious, yes!
Yes he's interim GM. Don't try to move the goal posts please.
Turin
Erik Karlsson is good
- Feb 27, 2018
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Gurglesons
Registered User
Seravalli never said Dubas turned down the GM job.
He cited Madden’s story and then he said he had heard from sources that Dubas had turned down the job, but he didn’t have enough confirmation to go either way.
Ryder71
Registered User
- Nov 24, 2017
- 25,236
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It's a shame we can't give people credit, not because they are wrong, but because we don't like them. Integrity is in short supply these days.
Clearly putting a guy in a defensive shutdown role when he's never excelled in such a role before was more important than speed.
He's on Twitch playing Fortnite talking about how Mike Sullivan is the answer while putting up an impressive kill/death* ratio.
*The kill/death ratio is about Mike and how he's destroyed careers vs them destroying the facade he's put up making blokes think he's a good coach.
tom_servo
Registered User
What goal posts? I'm not even in a debate here.
I was going by this tweet which is just a summary of what Seravalli said, I guess
farscape1
Registered User
Well is been 24hrs and Dubas hasn't done a single trade or sign any RFA. Dudes a bum. Joking of course.
Anya6687
Registered User
- Jul 12, 2015
- 252
- 244
Nice start kyle....don't stop there
@frank_seravalli
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One of Kyle Dubas' first orders of business in Pittsburgh was to make front office changes: Alec Schall (dir of hockey strategy), Teena Murray (SVP of sports science/performance) and Kerry Huffman (dir of pro scouting) were all fired on Thursday. All three were Hextall hires.
@frank_seravalli
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One of Kyle Dubas' first orders of business in Pittsburgh was to make front office changes: Alec Schall (dir of hockey strategy), Teena Murray (SVP of sports science/performance) and Kerry Huffman (dir of pro scouting) were all fired on Thursday. All three were Hextall hires.
mephisto1812
Registered User
- Mar 28, 2013
- 293
- 190
I know the answer before I even ask it.... but any chance you can just let it go and move on? Enough already... please. Everyone is fully aware of your stance. Move to preemptive critique of the new staff, there is plenty to discuss there without rehashing what is now in the rear view mirror ad nauseam.
Zirakzigil
The Global Hangman wishes he could be
Yohe: The Penguins get their man and Fenway Sports Group makes its mark
Fenway Sports Group got its man in Kyle Dubas and, along the way, showed a serious commitment to the Penguins.
theathletic.com
For the past 48 days, they had no general manager. No president of hockey operations. The sense around the hockey world was that the Penguins lacked direction — a franchise potentially on a serious decline.
Along came Dubas. Suddenly, the Penguins feel very relevant. They didn’t just fill a void. They recruited and landed the most desired person on the market.
Give Fenway credit. Hours after the hire, the Penguins’ ownership group made more waves. Following Dubas’ media availability, the Penguins cut ties with three employees Hextall had hired. Alec Schall (director of hockey operations and salary cap management), Kerry Huffman (director of pro scouting) and Teena Murray (senior VP, integrated performance) were all fired, said team sources, who spoke under the condition of anonymity. All had at least one more year on their contracts.
Finally, this group is starting to assert itself.
...............
So, sure, it was the right move to hire him. Anyone who debates that is simply looking for a debate.
That doesn’t mean the hire was simple. Ownership still had to sell Dubas on a highly difficult job, given the mess that the previous administration made.
Some other quick points:
• We don’t know Dubas’ financial compensation.
Make no mistake, he’s fabulously wealthy. Dubas was in a position to essentially name his job over the next year or two. That’s how coveted he is. Landing him required a significant financial commitment. FSG is wealthy, sure. Well, so is Bob Nutting. Some owners are willing to go above and beyond financially. FSG is one of those ownership groups.
• It’s important for ownership groups and the people in management to be on the same page.
Dubas is smart. He’s young. He’s analytical, to a point. This is directly out of the FSG playbook. He’s the kind of thinker the Penguins’ owners believe in. He became available, and they immediately pursued him. It’s good business sense.
• FSG is stable. They’ve made it known that they’re in this for the long haul.
Rumors have popped up that Dubas might have been interested in working for the Ottawa Senators, his favorite boyhood team. The Senators, however, are as stable as the weather in March. The Penguins have been stable for a while now, and FSG’s presence only makes them feel like a safer destination.
• FSG still had to close the deal, and not just financially. It’s largely about likability.
Dubas said he visited with FSG executives more than a week ago. He got to know them. Whatever they said to Dubas was the right thing.
It’s not FSG’s fault the Penguins are old, nor is it their fault that an incompetent management group was in charge when they purchased the Penguins. They inherited these realities.
But it is FSG’s responsibility to give the Penguins every available platform to jump beyond their current selves. A brilliant front office mind can produce that magic. Dubas is the guy, and FSG got him.
The Penguins feel a little more relevant today. Dubas brings hope and, without hope, a fan base and the team it supports has nothing.
FSG delivered that hope and deserves a considerable amount of praise.
Jaded-Fan
Registered User
Hate to give him credit, but Madden wrote a very good piece about the hire.
triblive.com
Mark Madden: Here's what makes Kyle Dubas a great hire for Penguins
Kyle Dubas is the Penguins’ new president of hockey operations. It’s a great hire. I told you it would be in March. Here’s what I like: • Dubas isn’t some blockhead ex-player hanging on by way of a second act. At 37, he’s a career executive. Dubas learned the craft
triblive.com
mephisto1812
Registered User
- Mar 28, 2013
- 293
- 190
Not a fan of his, but that article is direct and to the point. I agree with many if not most of his takes.Hate to give him credit, but Madden wrote a very good piece about the hire.
Mark Madden: Here's what makes Kyle Dubas a great hire for Penguins
Kyle Dubas is the Penguins’ new president of hockey operations. It’s a great hire. I told you it would be in March. Here’s what I like: • Dubas isn’t some blockhead ex-player hanging on by way of a second act. At 37, he’s a career executive. Dubas learned the craft
Malkinstheman
Registered User
- Aug 12, 2012
- 10,473
- 10,548
It really surprises me that Madden is such a fan of Dubas. I dont know why but I would have thought that Madden would be calling Dubas some analytics geek who didnt win anything in Toronto
:format(webp)/https://www.thestar.com/content/dam/thestar/sports/leafs/opinion/2023/06/02/the-boy-wonders-does-kyle-dubas-know-what-hes-getting-into-with-the-penguins/dubas.jpg)
Opinion | The boy wonders: Does Kyle Dubas know what he’s getting into with the Penguins?
Pittsburgh has an old, tired group and the cupboards are bare.
In Pittsburgh, the team essentially has no top young prospects. The Penguins haven’t had a top-20 pick in a decade. When they had the No. 8 and No. 22 picks in 2013, the Penguins screwed up both, taking Derrick Pouliot and Olli Maatta, passing on the likes of Jacob Trouba, Filip Forsberg, Tom Wilson and Andrei Vasilevskiy.
Pittsburgh’s cupboard is bare. The Penguins have the No. 14 pick next month in the draft, and no second-rounder. That pick was dealt to Nashville for veteran Mikael Granlund, one of the last of the pointless moves made by the Brian Burke/Ron Hextall regime.
The good news is that Crosby, Malkin and Letang are all still very good players, if no longer what they once were. Crosby was 16th in league scoring this season, while Malkin was 26th. Jake Guentzel, meanwhile, had 36 goals, Rickard Rakell had 27 and Jason Zucker scored 26. Still, the team missed the Stanley Cup playoffs in the final week because it couldn’t beat awful Chicago or horrible Columbus.
As Burke and Hextall could tell Dubas, the new owners of the Penguins aren’t interested in a teardown or a rebuild. They want whoever is running the team to take another run at a Cup, as unrealistic as that might be to everyone outside of Pittsburgh. That probably means more moves like the Granlund deal, and no possibility of moving one of the stars for some badly needed futures.
Dubas has no experience with this type of situation. With the Leafs, he had to take a young group, augment it with other players, and try to get the team to a level of success it hadn’t experienced in 20 years. Outside of the regular season, he failed.
Obviously the Penguins saw in that failure glimpses of brilliance that convinced them Dubas was the best choice to take over their hockey department. His age, expertise in analytics and preference for a puck-possession style of hockey may have been what made the Penguins believe he is their future.
He has already won over the local media, which went gaga over his hiring on Thursday, calling him “one of hockey’s most famous people” and a “genius.” Perhaps those qualities were obscured somewhat in Toronto while his teams were losing in the first round six years in a row.
It’s interesting that the common element between Toronto and Pittsburgh is that, in both places, Dubas didn’t get to pick his own coach but instead inherited an experienced head coach with a record of championships. In Toronto, that was Mike Babcock. In Pittsburgh, it’s Mike Sullivan.
We know Babcock and Dubas weren’t on the same page, and Dubas won that MLSE political battle. Sullivan, however, is a more formidable personality on the Pittsburgh scene, and he is extremely well-connected inside the organization and throughout the sport.
Maybe he and Dubas will see eye to eye, although this perception that they embrace exactly the same style of hockey may require further analysis. If the team stumbles next season, Sullivan shouldn’t count on more support than Babcock got. At least Sheldon Keefe isn’t waiting in the wings. Not yet, anyway.
Most people would agree Dubas did good work in Toronto. But the job ahead in Pittsburgh looks to be much more complex and difficult, even if the glare of the spotlight is less. As well, Dubas no longer has a buffer between himself and ownership like he did in Toronto with Brendan Shanahan.
Dubas must meet the expectations of immediate success set down by the Fenway Group and simultaneously start restocking the team’s depth chart with talented young players. Plus, he may have to find a goalie, never his strong suit in Toronto.
Maybe he is a genius. In Pittsburgh, he’s going to have to be.
tom_servo
Registered User
Dangle and friends discuss Dubas, review Pens cap situation (player by player), etc. Thinks we should acquire Ilya Samsonov or Karel Vejmelka
44:00 in
44:00 in
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I've been poking and prodding at this all evening because I'm super cool and here's what seems to make sense to me...
The traditional GM role is too big for one person. That's not exactly news given there's a whole front office to help them do it, but even with that, it's too big.
The traditional GM role has always had someone to answer to as well in terms of ownership. The issue is a lot of owners aren't super educated.
A PoHO and GM split should solve both issues.
The GM takes care of day to day running of the team's roster - trades, contracts, pro scouting, call ups, and so on.
The PoHO takes care of, well, everything else. Running amateur scouting, hiring analytics and sports science departments and talking to them, player development coaches - and, crucially, talking to ownership and then acting as their proxy when talking to the GM.
The GM loses power, but gets to focus on the meat and potatoes of their position without distractions, and (theoretically ideally) gets an educated sympathetic peer to talk their decisions with through and defend them to the lunatics with the money as needed. And they are still a GM in most ways.
The PoHO gains power, and also gains the ability to lead a more relaxed life - I don't see why the PoHO has to travel to every road game - as well as focusing on all the many hockey related parts of the org. Which, for a nerd like Dubas, seems a draw. The more relaxed stuff seems to as well.
There's lots of ways for that to fall down but if you've got two guys who are good at their job and who work well with each other, it seems to offer plenty of strengths.
Whether that's what we'll actually get, who knows. I look forwards to endless mailbag answers from our beat reporters as to how they don't have a bloody clue.
Turin
Erik Karlsson is good
- Feb 27, 2018
- 24,626
- 29,423
Opinion | The boy wonders: Does Kyle Dubas know what he’s getting into with the Penguins?
Pittsburgh has an old, tired group and the cupboards are bare.www.thestar.com
In Pittsburgh, the team essentially has no top young prospects. The Penguins haven’t had a top-20 pick in a decade. When they had the No. 8 and No. 22 picks in 2013, the Penguins screwed up both, taking Derrick Pouliot and Olli Maatta, passing on the likes of Jacob Trouba, Filip Forsberg, Tom Wilson and Andrei Vasilevskiy.
Pittsburgh’s cupboard is bare. The Penguins have the No. 14 pick next month in the draft, and no second-rounder. That pick was dealt to Nashville for veteran Mikael Granlund, one of the last of the pointless moves made by the Brian Burke/Ron Hextall regime.
The good news is that Crosby, Malkin and Letang are all still very good players, if no longer what they once were. Crosby was 16th in league scoring this season, while Malkin was 26th. Jake Guentzel, meanwhile, had 36 goals, Rickard Rakell had 27 and Jason Zucker scored 26. Still, the team missed the Stanley Cup playoffs in the final week because it couldn’t beat awful Chicago or horrible Columbus.
As Burke and Hextall could tell Dubas, the new owners of the Penguins aren’t interested in a teardown or a rebuild. They want whoever is running the team to take another run at a Cup, as unrealistic as that might be to everyone outside of Pittsburgh. That probably means more moves like the Granlund deal, and no possibility of moving one of the stars for some badly needed futures.
Dubas has no experience with this type of situation. With the Leafs, he had to take a young group, augment it with other players, and try to get the team to a level of success it hadn’t experienced in 20 years. Outside of the regular season, he failed.
Obviously the Penguins saw in that failure glimpses of brilliance that convinced them Dubas was the best choice to take over their hockey department. His age, expertise in analytics and preference for a puck-possession style of hockey may have been what made the Penguins believe he is their future.
He has already won over the local media, which went gaga over his hiring on Thursday, calling him “one of hockey’s most famous people” and a “genius.” Perhaps those qualities were obscured somewhat in Toronto while his teams were losing in the first round six years in a row.
It’s interesting that the common element between Toronto and Pittsburgh is that, in both places, Dubas didn’t get to pick his own coach but instead inherited an experienced head coach with a record of championships. In Toronto, that was Mike Babcock. In Pittsburgh, it’s Mike Sullivan.
We know Babcock and Dubas weren’t on the same page, and Dubas won that MLSE political battle. Sullivan, however, is a more formidable personality on the Pittsburgh scene, and he is extremely well-connected inside the organization and throughout the sport.
Maybe he and Dubas will see eye to eye, although this perception that they embrace exactly the same style of hockey may require further analysis. If the team stumbles next season, Sullivan shouldn’t count on more support than Babcock got. At least Sheldon Keefe isn’t waiting in the wings. Not yet, anyway.
Most people would agree Dubas did good work in Toronto. But the job ahead in Pittsburgh looks to be much more complex and difficult, even if the glare of the spotlight is less. As well, Dubas no longer has a buffer between himself and ownership like he did in Toronto with Brendan Shanahan.
Dubas must meet the expectations of immediate success set down by the Fenway Group and simultaneously start restocking the team’s depth chart with talented young players. Plus, he may have to find a goalie, never his strong suit in Toronto.
Maybe he is a genius. In Pittsburgh, he’s going to have to be.
The Toronto Star is cancer
You quoted a Yohe article. Why the f*** would you do something dumb like that?Yohe: The Penguins get their man and Fenway Sports Group makes its mark
Fenway Sports Group got its man in Kyle Dubas and, along the way, showed a serious commitment to the Penguins.
For the past 48 days, they had no general manager. No president of hockey operations. The sense around the hockey world was that the Penguins lacked direction — a franchise potentially on a serious decline.
Along came Dubas. Suddenly, the Penguins feel very relevant. They didn’t just fill a void. They recruited and landed the most desired person on the market.
Give Fenway credit. Hours after the hire, the Penguins’ ownership group made more waves. Following Dubas’ media availability, the Penguins cut ties with three employees Hextall had hired. Alec Schall (director of hockey operations and salary cap management), Kerry Huffman (director of pro scouting) and Teena Murray (senior VP, integrated performance) were all fired, said team sources, who spoke under the condition of anonymity. All had at least one more year on their contracts.
Finally, this group is starting to assert itself.
...............
So, sure, it was the right move to hire him. Anyone who debates that is simply looking for a debate.
That doesn’t mean the hire was simple. Ownership still had to sell Dubas on a highly difficult job, given the mess that the previous administration made.
Some other quick points:
• We don’t know Dubas’ financial compensation.
Make no mistake, he’s fabulously wealthy. Dubas was in a position to essentially name his job over the next year or two. That’s how coveted he is. Landing him required a significant financial commitment. FSG is wealthy, sure. Well, so is Bob Nutting. Some owners are willing to go above and beyond financially. FSG is one of those ownership groups.
• It’s important for ownership groups and the people in management to be on the same page.
Dubas is smart. He’s young. He’s analytical, to a point. This is directly out of the FSG playbook. He’s the kind of thinker the Penguins’ owners believe in. He became available, and they immediately pursued him. It’s good business sense.
• FSG is stable. They’ve made it known that they’re in this for the long haul.
Rumors have popped up that Dubas might have been interested in working for the Ottawa Senators, his favorite boyhood team. The Senators, however, are as stable as the weather in March. The Penguins have been stable for a while now, and FSG’s presence only makes them feel like a safer destination.
• FSG still had to close the deal, and not just financially. It’s largely about likability.
Dubas said he visited with FSG executives more than a week ago. He got to know them. Whatever they said to Dubas was the right thing.
It’s not FSG’s fault the Penguins are old, nor is it their fault that an incompetent management group was in charge when they purchased the Penguins. They inherited these realities.
But it is FSG’s responsibility to give the Penguins every available platform to jump beyond their current selves. A brilliant front office mind can produce that magic. Dubas is the guy, and FSG got him.
The Penguins feel a little more relevant today. Dubas brings hope and, without hope, a fan base and the team it supports has nothing.
FSG delivered that hope and deserves a considerable amount of praise.
The fact that he wants to work with Sullivan to find the right players made me laugh and it also made me feel good in boycotting the games.
I will be stress free all season. It'll be magical.
Lmao..
Just...
Lmao
Cancer or not, the star paints a better picture than the verbal handjob by Yohe the f***ing loser.Opinion | The boy wonders: Does Kyle Dubas know what he’s getting into with the Penguins?
Pittsburgh has an old, tired group and the cupboards are bare.
In Pittsburgh, the team essentially has no top young prospects. The Penguins haven’t had a top-20 pick in a decade. When they had the No. 8 and No. 22 picks in 2013, the Penguins screwed up both, taking Derrick Pouliot and Olli Maatta, passing on the likes of Jacob Trouba, Filip Forsberg, Tom Wilson and Andrei Vasilevskiy.
Pittsburgh’s cupboard is bare. The Penguins have the No. 14 pick next month in the draft, and no second-rounder. That pick was dealt to Nashville for veteran Mikael Granlund, one of the last of the pointless moves made by the Brian Burke/Ron Hextall regime.
The good news is that Crosby, Malkin and Letang are all still very good players, if no longer what they once were. Crosby was 16th in league scoring this season, while Malkin was 26th. Jake Guentzel, meanwhile, had 36 goals, Rickard Rakell had 27 and Jason Zucker scored 26. Still, the team missed the Stanley Cup playoffs in the final week because it couldn’t beat awful Chicago or horrible Columbus.
As Burke and Hextall could tell Dubas, the new owners of the Penguins aren’t interested in a teardown or a rebuild. They want whoever is running the team to take another run at a Cup, as unrealistic as that might be to everyone outside of Pittsburgh. That probably means more moves like the Granlund deal, and no possibility of moving one of the stars for some badly needed futures.
Dubas has no experience with this type of situation. With the Leafs, he had to take a young group, augment it with other players, and try to get the team to a level of success it hadn’t experienced in 20 years. Outside of the regular season, he failed.
Obviously the Penguins saw in that failure glimpses of brilliance that convinced them Dubas was the best choice to take over their hockey department. His age, expertise in analytics and preference for a puck-possession style of hockey may have been what made the Penguins believe he is their future.
He has already won over the local media, which went gaga over his hiring on Thursday, calling him “one of hockey’s most famous people” and a “genius.” Perhaps those qualities were obscured somewhat in Toronto while his teams were losing in the first round six years in a row.
It’s interesting that the common element between Toronto and Pittsburgh is that, in both places, Dubas didn’t get to pick his own coach but instead inherited an experienced head coach with a record of championships. In Toronto, that was Mike Babcock. In Pittsburgh, it’s Mike Sullivan.
We know Babcock and Dubas weren’t on the same page, and Dubas won that MLSE political battle. Sullivan, however, is a more formidable personality on the Pittsburgh scene, and he is extremely well-connected inside the organization and throughout the sport.
Maybe he and Dubas will see eye to eye, although this perception that they embrace exactly the same style of hockey may require further analysis. If the team stumbles next season, Sullivan shouldn’t count on more support than Babcock got. At least Sheldon Keefe isn’t waiting in the wings. Not yet, anyway.
Most people would agree Dubas did good work in Toronto. But the job ahead in Pittsburgh looks to be much more complex and difficult, even if the glare of the spotlight is less. As well, Dubas no longer has a buffer between himself and ownership like he did in Toronto with Brendan Shanahan.
Dubas must meet the expectations of immediate success set down by the Fenway Group and simultaneously start restocking the team’s depth chart with talented young players. Plus, he may have to find a goalie, never his strong suit in Toronto.
Maybe he is a genius. In Pittsburgh, he’s going to have to be.
HandshakeLine
A real jerk thing
I mean, I get the logic behind it; one of my new positions was created with exactly the same kind of thinking and it's kicked off an insane power struggle because of it. Perhaps that's why I'm so cynical about it.
The logic behind making the PoHO the real brains behind the team is fine. I'm just doubtful it's going to make any difference except promote the kinds of operations we're seeing JR do in Seattle. And if PoHO has this much power, then we are going to get exactly the same calibre of GMing in proportion to it. That's what I mean. You're not going to get the kind of candidates who we want, who would a that job where they don't make decisions and don't have much input except on minor things.
In practice we've just neutered the GM position, which is fine, but we should take that into account.
BusinessGoose
Registered User
Obviously just trying to get into Dubas' good graces so he can get insider info....
... He'll turn on him once that doesn't happen
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