It seems like the Pens are going to hover around a spot all year, so I don't see how Jake gets moved.
Confirmed with Link: Kyle Dubas named President of Hockey Operations
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Coastal Kev
There will be "I told you so's" Bet on it
I would bet my left nipple they are locking jakey up with an NMC within 3 weeks.
99% of GMs would not trade Guentzel if they're in a playoff race this season, given all the other considerations and noises from ownership. I'm not going to hold him doing what everyone else would do against him.
Turin
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So far I'd say
Karlsson: A-
Eller: A
Nedjelkovic: A+
Smith: C+
Graves: C-
Karlsson: A-
Eller: A
Nedjelkovic: A+
Smith: C+
Graves: C-
tom_servo
Registered User
You seem a little more charitable with Graves than most.
Jarry also is a C- at best (only because his numbers this season have been pretty good. But with the emergence of Ned, it's looking like Jarry's money is a waste)
Turin
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He's not F bad, he's playable, he's just been disappointing. He's got 7 points and a +12, I mean it could be way worse. The Pens PK is also quite a bit improved.
Nah.. I vastly disagree w/ you on Jarry. We have no idea what Ned would do in a full starter role. Jarry is a B at worst right now - he's been a top 10 goalie in the league, and having two good goalies this season is a massive reason why this season didn't go right off the rails after November.
Honour Over Glory
Fire Sully
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What an absolute shitty thing this ended up being. Another f***ing Sully ass licking drone that Mario and FSG wanted.
I'd say Jarry has been a solid B+ and Ned a B+ as well. Behind this defense they're doing better than most would and that's just facts given their stats and metrics.
The shitting on of Jarry is one of the dumbest things on our board dating back to the weird hate for Sprong.
I'd say Jarry has been a solid B+ and Ned a B+ as well. Behind this defense they're doing better than most would and that's just facts given their stats and metrics.
WickedWrister
Registered User
Yeah hard not to give Ned an A or an A+ right now. 8-3-2 and some important wins at that (BOS, NYI, PHI). Massive bargain at 1.5m. Smaller sample size but he's 5th in the league in SV%
Giving Jarry a B or B+, he's held to a higher standard as the starter given his contract. 11-12-2. Still think it was too much term. Will be judged on his playoff performance (if we get there) moreso than regular season.
Giving Jarry a B or B+, he's held to a higher standard as the starter given his contract. 11-12-2. Still think it was too much term. Will be judged on his playoff performance (if we get there) moreso than regular season.
DesertedPenguin
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Mario hasn't been involved with this team since the moment the ink dried on the sale to FSG. Anyone paying attention knows that Mario has been MIA since. He used to be a fixture at the rink; multiple reports have said he's shown up to one game since the sale, and that was when his fantasy camp was going on.
There are questions he's going to show for Jagr's banner raising.
Dude is completely checked out, yet you want to blame him for Dubas?
Sullivan has some of you so out of sorts you couldn't find your rear end with a map and a flashlight.
Honour Over Glory
Fire Sully
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I just threw his name in there because under him and FSG, the Gms have gone out of there way to romance us into thinking Sullivan is amazing af.
I don't know who it is that's telling them to go out of their way to do it but it's bizarre as shit that JR, Burke, and Dubas all did to quell any negative talk during rough periods - essentially putting blame on themselves in the process.
That is f***ing weird. Now relax, you read way too f***ing much into that Mario part.
Also no other coach in the f***ing league has had 3 separate upper management blokes wax poetic about how amazing he is as a coach. That is f***ing weird. Gms will answer questions about the coach during a rough stretch but Sullivan's defense from two Gm's and a Hockey Ops bloke like Burke was unsolicited. It was like they had to do it a few times a season.
Rest of your shit, f*** off. Put me on ignore or just f*** off.
DesertedPenguin
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That's what GMs do? They put out fires. That's where the dreaded vote of confidence cliche comes from - GM publicly says he believes in his coach, cans him two weeks later saying things changed.
What so many of you fail to acknowledge is that the Pens have legit excuses for most of their recent failures. There are very few GMs who are going to blame a coach for Jarry's performance against the Isles three years ago or for the Pens losing to the Rangers with Dominique in net.
And I'll be blunt, there aren't many GMs who would honestly look at how Hextall managed the roster last year and then blame Sullivan for the Pens missing the playoffs.
The stuff fans blame Sullivan for, outsiders and other people in hockey don't. Does a coach have input, especially one like Sullivan? Sure. But the final decisions always rest in the GMs lap.
Sullivan has his faults. He deserves criticism. And if they miss the playoffs again, I think Dubas should look at replacing him.
But he's not some omnipotent Boogeyman who has every GM and member of ownership wrapped around his finger. He's always been well-regarded around the NHL and pretty much everyone views him as a Jon Cooper type who will require a lot to be fired.
Honour Over Glory
Fire Sully
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The Pens media have never really taken Sullivan to task at all. A few questions where Sullivan whines but the interviews are preemptive. They aren't putting out fires. They're controlled burns in case anyone even thinks about starting a fire.
Out of all the coaches in situations similar to Sullivan's where you miss the playoffs or losing streaks, they feel pressure from the media and articles yet Sullivan has zero. I'd be shocked if you could find even 3 articles that speak about a coaching change and moving on from Sullivan.
Bylsma was also a long tenured coach that had less first round exits and a ton of regular season success and was fired for his inability to push the team forward. To be in the same situation and double down on doing nothing is bizarre.
Even a dipshit like Bylsma didn't miss the playoffs and kept his job, he was fired after a 51-24-7 record and a second round exit. Sullivan was eliminated in the play in for the playoffs and didn't make it last year. Yet, Teflon. Bylsma now has the higher win percentage comically. Both suck.
The rest of your post I don't care to address.
DesertedPenguin
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There aren't many coaches who are in similar positions to Sullivan. Like it or not, his status as a two-time Cup winner changes the conversation. The closest comp is Cooper, who was head coach for six years, missed the playoffs one of those years and suffered an embarrassing sweep at the hands of Columbus another year, before he finally got Tampa over the hump and won a Cup.
Cooper's job wasn't in question.
Barry Trotz lasted 15 years in Nashville without ever getting to the conference finals.
Quenneville was fired in Chicago and could be a comparison, but he had numerous clashes with management that became public.
Finally, Bylsm and Sullivan aren't in the same position. Bylsma lost the room. By all accounts, the core still likes Sullivan. Bylsma also had the core in its prime. There was a greater sense of urgency. Sullivan is coaching them in their final years.
Firing Sullivan may ultimately be the right move, but his situation isn't really comparable to others.
Gurglesons
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pistolpete11
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I still think Dubas did well overall.
Karlsson, Ned, Eller, and Jarry have all been great-to-solid so far.
Graves has looked shaky for sure, but he's +12. He needs to get better, but I'm not going to call it a bust yet. Not all that long ago, Petts was the whipping boy around here and look at him now.
Probably overpaid for Acciari, but he's a +2 getting damn near 90% D-zone starts. Same for Nieto who's +5.
Smith is the tough one for me. As great as he was at the beginning of the year, he's been that bad for the last bit. But he's been a consistent 50-point guy his entire career and is not at the age where he should be dropping off yet. It hasn't worked to this point, but I'm not sure I can blame Dubas for that.
They are in the position they are in because of PP1. Now that the PP has turned around a bit, we are seeing what they are capable of. 7-2-1 in their last 10 and slowly but surely catching the teams in front of them.
Karlsson, Ned, Eller, and Jarry have all been great-to-solid so far.
Graves has looked shaky for sure, but he's +12. He needs to get better, but I'm not going to call it a bust yet. Not all that long ago, Petts was the whipping boy around here and look at him now.
Probably overpaid for Acciari, but he's a +2 getting damn near 90% D-zone starts. Same for Nieto who's +5.
Smith is the tough one for me. As great as he was at the beginning of the year, he's been that bad for the last bit. But he's been a consistent 50-point guy his entire career and is not at the age where he should be dropping off yet. It hasn't worked to this point, but I'm not sure I can blame Dubas for that.
They are in the position they are in because of PP1. Now that the PP has turned around a bit, we are seeing what they are capable of. 7-2-1 in their last 10 and slowly but surely catching the teams in front of them.
DesertedPenguin
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Zbynek
Jarry friggin sucks dude
Despite the Jarry contract I still like him a lot more than Sleepy. I expect him to make a move or two at the deadline. If he can bring some snarl to the top-9, that may cancel out the lukewarm 4th line he assembled over the summer. We just need our depth guys like DOC and Puusti to stay in the mix.
I'm not sure what can be done for the defense. The top-4 is pretty locked in. I do think this board is pretty harsh on Graves. He's pretty much done his assignment and Pens are 4th in the league in GA, ahead of teams like Boston and Vegas. I may be biased because I've liked him since his Colorado/Jersey days but he eats minutes and PKs. Not sure what else you want from a top-4 LD with Letang and Karlsson on the other side.
I'm not sure what can be done for the defense. The top-4 is pretty locked in. I do think this board is pretty harsh on Graves. He's pretty much done his assignment and Pens are 4th in the league in GA, ahead of teams like Boston and Vegas. I may be biased because I've liked him since his Colorado/Jersey days but he eats minutes and PKs. Not sure what else you want from a top-4 LD with Letang and Karlsson on the other side.
Gurglesons
Registered User
Not sure he lost the room anymore than Sullivan did.
Also this is the same writer who gave us the “that’s not how we do it in Pittsburgh” BS.
Sidgeni Malkby
Registered User
Unless the team helps with that decision and either tanks, or gets to a more solid playoff footing, hard to know what to do.
Honestly, a Jake trade actually leads to a bigger question. We do not have any more years left to retool (ie. trade Jake, tank, and come back stronger next year). We're either going for it or not.
Puljarvi....what about Ludvig?
What we should also remember is that Dubas came from dealing with Toronto media. I'm sure he's learned to not show any weakness or ambiguity in putting out fires. The slightest kindling there turns into a media circus blaze for months.
That's probably why his Sully responses are over the top:
"We absolutely wholeheartedly love Sully. We are all on the same page. We will love him until the end of time"....etc etc..
gopens66
Hop in the Cordoba, Baby, we're goin' bowlin!
This is all of Pittsburgh sports journalists/media for all sports outside of Mark Madden. He has zero problem being critical. They want to be friends with the players and/or management. They toss softballs to coaches during pressers and rarely follow up when they are clearly getting stock, canned answers like: "We just need to get to our game." There needs to be some middle ground of the press treatment between what happens in Pittsburgh and Toronto.
Honour Over Glory
Fire Sully
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They literally have him back for interviews and what not. You'd think a coach that lost the room wouldn't get that treatment.
Like if you said that about MJ no one would doubt it. Also Sullivan's seasons after the cups have been worse than Bylsma's tenure and Disco Dipshit also had to endure Sid and his concussion, Geno's knee and Staal and his injuries and foot slice. Yet he still did better after his cup than Sully.
I despise both btw.
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