Kadri discussion thread after his 30th goal - now featuring 60 points!

[diceman934]

Find it interesting that we can trade captains like Clark, Gilmour, Sittler, Vaive, Keon or let Sundin walk for nothing or let Lanny MacDonald go ... yet we have this one player on this little corner of the internet that can't be moved.

Weird.

Anyways, he had a good season on and off the ice.

Keep it up

Just an FYI we never traded Keon.....

and no one said never, just not very likely any time soon.

One last thing....please do not mention Vaive along with those other Leafs....does not belong in that group....Vaive was amomg the worse captains we had along with Ramage..

 

[Gary Nylund]

It is not weird. This list only reinforces the original desire to not trade Kadri.

Keon is before my time.

The other guys, Wendel was traded for Sundin. Viave for Alan Secord who career went straight down in Leafs land. Lanny MacDonald for Wilf Paiement who turn into Mirosav Frycher.

Do not even remember who they traded Sittler and Gilmour for? Anybody remember?

Even last year, who did they trade Dion Phaneuf for? That I don't remember either. Phaneuf is still better in his own zone than anyone the Leafs got right now. Even coach Babcock acknowledged that the other day.

Look at all those trades. Only one of them can be considered to have turn out good.

And Keon, Sittler and MacDonald were driven out of town by an owner who was basically a nutcase. Anyone using those examples as some sort of argument for trading Kadri is um, I don't even know what to say.

If you're reading this Nazem, congrats on hitting 30! I can only hope you keep up this level of play for a few more years. And just ignore these guys who keep talking about trading you, it's mostly the same people posting the same nonsense for years now.

 

[Bluelines]

LOL....

Kadri is not going aware soon....maybe in the last 2 years of his contract. We have no one to replace his role and his contract is cheap.

The rest of your post has nothing to do with Kadri....

So no opinion on what a 30 goal scorer is on the trade market?

 

[Wendelstache]

He was right when he said he can be on the level of Tavares...

In fact I'd say he took it another level and went above Tavares this year.
Shutdown role with 30G, that is Gilmour like.

 

[Apotheosis]

A potential 30-35 goal a season defensively elite (I think he's bordering on it) centre who plays on the third line is crazy value.

 

[Byron Bitz]

Kadri is also on a pretty good contract. If he went on the open market this offseason he would prob get about 2 mill more per year.

 

[LeafFever]

Kadri is also on a pretty good contract. If he went on the open market this offseason he would prob get about 2 mill more per year.

It's better than pretty good.

 

[Pookie]

Kadri is also on a pretty good contract. If he went on the open market this offseason he would prob get about 2 mill more per year.

Market pays for performance.

Increase in value indicative of better performance this year vs contract year.

Too bad he didn't bet on himself.

Completely agree.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Market pays for performance.

Increase in value indicative of better performance this year vs contract year.

Too bad he didn't bet on himself.

Completely agree.

Hmm, 2m more than his current contract is 6.5m.

When I was speculating a few months ago on what Kadri might be worth if he kept up his level of play and threw out 7m as a number to get the conversation started you made about 18 posts ridiculing me. "Gary wants to pay him 7m" you kept saying over and over again as if it was the most ridiculous thing you had ever heard. Mind you I never said that I "want" to pay him 7m, I'm thrilled to have him at 4.5 so why in the world would I want to pay him more? But I digress ...

Anyhow, if you "completely agree" that he could get 6.5 on the open market, then I guess 7m isn't worthy of ridicule now is it? I congratulate you on your progress Pookie. Maybe the day will come when you can post about Kadri without taking sarcastic shots at him or talking about trading him.

 

[Pookie]

Hmm, 2m more than his current contract is 6.5m.

When I was speculating a few months ago on what Kadri might be worth if he kept up his level of play and threw out 7m as a number to get the conversation started you made about 18 posts ridiculing me. "Gary wants to pay him 7m" you kept saying over and over again as if it was the most ridiculous thing you had ever heard. Mind you I never said that I "want" to pay him 7m, I'm thrilled to have him at 4.5 so why in the world would I want to pay him more? But I digress ...

Anyhow, if you "completely agree" that he could get 6.5 on the open market, then I guess 7m isn't worthy of ridicule now is it? I congratulate you on your progress Pookie. Maybe the day will come when you can post about Kadri without taking sarcastic shots at him or talking about trading him.

Maybe the day will come when you actually review history correctly.

I said I would absolutely pay more for him if the contract was signed this year. High 5 or 6 was my guess.

You did you thing saying he was this good all along.

Later, you slipped and said you'd pay $8m.

Called you out on that, highlighting that we were in agreement. Whatever the salary increase, we both felt that the market would reward his improved performance.

You back peddled claiming you never said $8m.

It's ok Gary, you and I can agree that he had a good season. Better than the one before and better than his career.

His offseason dedication is paying dividends.

Now as for trading, he's an asset. You consider what you need and take calls. End stop.

 

[Gramsci]

Kadri hits 30 goals and emerges as an outstanding value contract and the debate here is ... what can he get in a trade?

Good grief.

 

[Wafflewhipper]

Pretty funny seeing people whine last season and the year before.

Kadri's a beast!

A veteran that leads by example. Its funny how things all the sudden just click for players. He is much stronger on his skates but draws penalties less now. Main thing is he drives more North south right to the net. He has refined his game alot. We have a solid veteran.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Maybe the day will come when you actually review history correctly.

I said I would absolutely pay more for him if the contract was signed this year. High 5 or 6 was my guess.

You did you thing saying he was this good all along.

Later, you slipped and said you'd pay $8m.

Called you out on that, highlighting that we were in agreement. Whatever the salary increase, we both felt that the market would reward his improved performance.

You back peddled claiming you never said $8m.

It's ok Gary, you and I can agree that he had a good season. Better than the one before and better than his career.

His offseason dedication is paying dividends.

Now as for trading, he's an asset. You consider what you need and take calls. End stop.

Trying to re-write history again I see.

The figure I threw out (with a question mark behind it) as a way of getting conversation started was a range 7-8m. You in your thirst for dramatics changed that to 8m which you repeated over and over again and after being called out by several people, you finally back peddled.

His season isn't over yet but so far it's more than just "good". Where we disagree is that you seem to hold the viewpoint that he came out of nowhere and emerged as a good player this season. Some of us having been saying for years that he's a very good player and with a better team around him his point totals will reflect that which is exactly what is happening. He's a better player now sure, he's improving every season. But his improvement has been gradual, the team as a whole is what has improved dramatically almost overnight and point totals are up across the board.

Please take your tiresome talk about trading Kadri to the other Kadri thread. Have a look at this thread title and you'll see why you're in the wrong place.

 

[Bluelines]

Kadri hits 30 goals and emerges as an outstanding value contract and the debate here is ... what can he get in a trade?

Good grief.

Nope NOT Kadri, just any old average run of the mill a 30 goal scorer... Kadri cant never ever be traded, its umpossible to trade a player who bleeds blue and white, its never happened before never happen ever ever.

I guess the question is framed aound assessing a value to a 30 goal scorer, the value of a 2nd pairing Dman was Hall, who scored 27 goals twice and, 26 once, not a 30 goal scorer but close.

People tend to be a little sensitive about Kadri, not sure why but they can be, so the original question was asked what is the value of a 30 goal scorer, not what is the value of Kadri, we already know Kadri has no trade value because he will never ever ever be traded... the experts on this forum have already stated that, never ever, so its fruitless to suggest Kadri is trade bait...but an unnamed 30 goal scorer (not Kadri) brings up an interesting question, what is Player X worth?

So I think a 30 goal scorer is worth a mid to late 1st rounder and a couple of decent prospects or a mid first rounder plus an upper end talent like Kapanen.

 

[Pookie]

Trying to re-write history again I see.

The figure I threw out (with a question mark behind it) as a way of getting conversation started was a range 7-8m. You in your thirst for dramatics changed that to 8m which you repeated over and over again and after being called out by several people, you finally back peddled.

His season isn't over yet but so far it's more than just "good". Where we disagree is that you seem to hold the viewpoint that he came out of nowhere and emerged as a good player this season. Some of us having been saying for years that he's a very good player and with a better team around him his point totals will reflect that which is exactly what is happening. He's a better player now sure, he's improving every season. But his improvement has been gradual, the team as a whole is what has improved dramatically almost overnight and point totals are up across the board.

Please take your tiresome talk about trading Kadri to the other Kadri thread. Have a look at this thread title and you'll see why you're in the wrong place.

I congratulated him twice in my first posts here.

Let's not pretend that you didn't get what you wanted. Time to fish for someone else I guess.

As for your version... It's BS. I didn't back peddle anything. I would pay more for him this year because of his excellent performance. Even just said it above, again.

Nothing good comes from interactions with you aside from infractions.

So, indeed. Enjoy your weekend.

 

[Menzinger]

What an odd path this 30th goal appreciation thread has taken

 

[Bluelines]

I congratulated him twice in my first posts here.

Let's not pretend that you didn't get what you wanted. Time to fish for someone else I guess.

As for your version... It's BS. I didn't back peddle anything. I would pay more for him this year because of his excellent performance. Even just said it above, again.

Nothing good comes from interactions with you aside from infractions.

So, indeed. Enjoy your weekend.

Pookie its a shame when a select few continue to misrepresent your words in an effort for them to save face. Continue to fight the good fight and eventually your resolve will force them to be to be honest with themselves.

So NOT Kadri but where would you put a 30 goal scorers value on the open trade market?

 

[leafsfuture]

Well deserved by Naz! He has been terrific this season.

I will follow up by saying I think there is a 0% chance he hits 30 goals next year. Expect a regression in goals that is hopefully offset by an increase in assists.

 

[Bluelines]

Well deserved by Naz! He has been terrific this season.

I will follow up by saying I think there is a 0% chance he hits 30 goals next year. Expect a regression in goals that is hopefully offset by an increase in assists.

I dunno, he's scored a lot of easy goals on the PP in the dirty area, if he continues to play the same as this year, next year, there is no reason why he wont score as many.

With hands like his, taking out the garbage goals is like picking off fish in a barrel. #niftymittens #nazmittens

 

[Gallagbi]

Pookie its a shame when a select few continue to misrepresent your words in an effort for them to save face. Continue to fight the good fight and eventually your resolve will force them to be to be honest with themselves.

So NOT Kadri but where would you put a 30 goal scorers value on the open trade market?

So many variables. Position, age, contract, reputation of player, reputation of GM, motivation to move, etc.

Look at Hall's return, that was brutal. Look at Lucic's return and the B's got great value.

None brought immediate help that outweighs a guy like Kadri's (or Hall's) contribution IMO.

I doubt he stays as a 30 goal scorer and I don't think that's what he is valued as on the market. Likely a 50-55 point C who is fiesty and can play well defensively. Similar to what many said about him last year.

 

[Bluelines]

So many variables. Position, age, contract, reputation of player, reputation of GM, motivation to move, etc.

Look at Hall's return, that was brutal. Look at Lucic's return and the B's got great value.

None brought immediate help that outweighs a guy like Kadri's (or Hall's) contribution IMO.

So that is a great answer , all 100% true, if you were the GM and coveted goals, with your reputation and you desire to acquire a 30 goal player, where would you put the value range?

 

[Gary Nylund]

I congratulated him twice in my first posts here.

Let's not pretend that you didn't get what you wanted. Time to fish for someone else I guess.

As for your version... It's BS. I didn't back peddle anything. I would pay more for him this year because of his excellent performance. Even just said it above, again.

Nothing good comes from interactions with you aside from infractions.

So, indeed. Enjoy your weekend.

Yes I got what I wanted, Kadri signed long term for considerably less than he would get on the open market. Don't worry, you'll get your wish for him to be gone eventually one way or the other, it probably won't be for quite some time though so try to be patient is all I can suggest.

My version?

No "version" Pookie, just facts. If your memory is really failing you, go look it up in the archives, it's all there. Have a great weekend my friend.

 

[1specter]

Well deserved by Naz! He has been terrific this season.

I will follow up by saying I think there is a 0% chance he hits 30 goals next year. Expect a regression in goals that is hopefully offset by an increase in assists.

I'm a pretty big Kadri fanboy and I agree that he likely won't hit 30 next year, his PP shooting % was pretty high this season. That being said, he's shown he's capable of at least 20 goals no problem, and with better linemates he could improve his 5v5 goal scoring to offset the likely decrease in PP goals. ~25 goals is not unrealistic at all for him.

 

[Gary Nylund]

I'm a pretty big Kadri fanboy and I agree that he likely won't hit 30 next year, his PP shooting % was pretty high this season. That being said, he's shown he's capable of at least 20 goals no problem, and with better linemates he could improve his 5v5 goal scoring to offset the likely decrease in PP goals. ~25 goals is not unrealistic at all for him.

Probably 25 is more realistic than 30 but it really doesn't matter to me, not one whit. Now that he has a good team around him for the first time, he'll put up more points than he has in the past, I've been saying that for years. I speculated a few months ago on how he'll produce over the course of his contract, 6 years is a lot of time but I believe I said that for the first 4/5 years I would expect him to average 55-60 points depending on his usage. I still think that's fair and if he hits those numbers while continuing his stellar defensive play than I couldn't care less how many goals he scores.

 

[1specter]

Probably 25 is more realistic than 30 but it really doesn't matter to me, not one whit. Now that he has a good team around him for the first time, he'll put up more points than he has in the past, I've been saying that for years. I speculated a few months ago on how he'll produce over the course of his contract, 6 years is a lot of time but I believe I said that for the first 4/5 years I would expect him to average 55-60 points depending on his usage. I still think that's fair and if he hits those numbers while continuing his stellar defensive play than I couldn't care less how many goals he scores.

For sure, I mean he's about to hit 60 and the team is still very raw. Just imagine over the next couple of years as the team continues to mature and the spare parts are continuously replaced with good talent.