Post-Game Talk: Jets crown a new Vezina King 4-0 loss

[DRW204]

Laine has a 6.22 SH% his past 75 gp.

 

[tbcwpg]

Poster feels Jets are ruining him? I am not sure that is what he is saying

Post #86 you directed me to says the Jets should trade Laine because they don't know what to do with him. The post you quoted doesn't advocate trading Laine away. It's a post critical of Laine, sure, but doesn't say trade him. Laine is not a perfect player.

 

[Jets 31]

h He worked hard offensively, but was disinterested coming back through the middle of the ice and in his own end. His two way game has gone to hell, uncommitted down low, cheats up high, drive by‘s in the neutral zone. MacKinnon’s back pressure and tenacity down low was impressive at times. Scheifele used to be much more similar in that regard.

Agreed , he needs to get back to that 2 way game . Maybe he needs Wheeler .

 

[Duke749]

I thought Scheifele worked his butt off last night. I like his work along the boards and behind the net.

It would be helpful if the Jets caused more chaos in front of the net and in the slot. The book on the Jets seem to be that they play on the perimeter, either passing it back to the points or across ice. The other goalie almost always sees the shots (when they get through).

Didn’t work too hard on that second Avs goal. Too much reaching for the puck and just waving his stick. His work rate outside of the offensive zone leaves a lot to be desired for a player of his caliber.

 

[Duke749]

h He worked hard offensively, but was disinterested coming back through the middle of the ice and in his own end. His two way game has gone to hell, uncommitted down low, cheats up high, drive by‘s in the neutral zone. MacKinnon’s back pressure and tenacity down low was impressive at times. Scheifele used to be much more similar in that regard.

Yeh Mack schooled him when it comes to work rate last night.

 

[DRW204]

I thought Scheifele worked his butt off last night. I like his work along the boards and behind the net.

It would be helpful if the Jets caused more chaos in front of the net and in the slot. The book on the Jets seem to be that they play on the perimeter, either passing it back to the points or across ice. The other goalie almost always sees the shots (when they get through).

he needs to work harder defensively. if he put effort defensively as he did along the boards/behind the net he'd be back to a top 10 C in the league.

 

[Jets 31]

I know it's not his true position but i would like Wheeler with his size to get to the front of the net more , same with Lowry . They would be a handle to move from there .

 

[tbcwpg]

Well the other 2 people who see the game so well dont agree with this they say he was pushed. Either way that's the second goalie he destroyed cause he didn't move.

You can be pushed and stay on your feet.

 

[surixon]

h He worked hard offensively, but was disinterested coming back through the middle of the ice and in his own end. His two way game has gone to hell, uncommitted down low, cheats up high, drive by‘s in the neutral zone. MacKinnon’s back pressure and tenacity down low was impressive at times. Scheifele used to be much more similar in that regard.

Yeah I don't know what the heck happened to his d game.

Another reason why a new voice wouldn't be such a bad idea. Our star players are too comfortable and complacent and Maurice won't hold them accountable for poor play.

 

[pucka lucka]

Not disagreeing with that but at the same time it doesn't matter how well you shoot you aren't beating many NHL quality goalies from outside the slot with any regularity. That is where the bulk of our shots are coming from this year and according to the coach a lot of that is by design.

Last night I though Laine ripped a few hard shots and had a few duds. Sometimes when your focus is on improving other areas you aren't able to work on the other one as much. I'm more concerned about his accuracy then power.

Short answer. Laine needs to get his shot dialed in but our coach at the same time isn't incorporating a system that puts our shooter in the optimum spot to succeed.

This is so obviously a coaching and personnel issue. Laine is constantly getting open near the slot waiting for quick passes. Connor is completely incapable of making plays he doesn't create. Scheifele is generally good at it, but he's forced into a constant cycle playing with Wheeler and Connor.

Perreault is the only current Jet who plays makes those kind of plays on our roster outside of Scheifele(who has been sucked into the endless cycle). Stastny also was capable of this. Ovechkin has had Backstrom. A coach should be doing everything he can to find a fit for Laine. He does the exact opposite. PoMo is killing this team. We are a top skill team playing like a bottom skill team

 

[FFHockey]

Post #86 you directed me to says the Jets should trade Laine because they don't know what to do with him. The post you quoted doesn't advocate trading Laine away. It's a post critical of Laine, sure, but doesn't say trade him. Laine is not a perfect player.

Ok, so the bold below does not advocate trading him? Never mind the rest of it that says he's overrated and does not do what "stars" do. I guess end of the day you don't see it and I do...agree to disagree.

I happen to think Laine is a good player, with a great shot sometimes, but he's overrated. If I could pick up a good forward and proven D-man for him, I would make the deal as GM. Laine does not show the speed and stick handling ability that "stars" do. With Connor and Ehlers you get speed and good stickhandling, and great shots -- but with Laine you get someone with just a great shot, and developing game. I would seriously think of trading him, and add more balance to the team by way of defenseman.

 

[LowLefty]

Short answer. Laine needs to get his shot dialed in but our coach at the same time isn't incorporating a system that puts our shooter in the optimum spot to succeed.

What system did you have in mind that would "put" Laine in a better shooting position?
Laine was all over the ice last night - which spots should the coach tell him he can go to and which ones is he not supposed to go to?
Laine had plenty of opportunity in this game - what do you want the coach to do???

 

[tbcwpg]

Ok, so the bold below does not advocate trading him? Never mind the rest of it that says he's overrated and does not do what "stars" do. I guess end of the day you don't see it and I do...agree to disagree.

It does advocate it, you're right. I'm on mobile so I don't see post numbers. I also focused on the part you bolded in your initial post.

I'd still argue that it's one poster, not "a bunch of people", and two, it says to trade him if the right deal came along.

Calling him overrated and not a superstar is fine. The NHL agreed with him last year when he was voted one of the most overrated by the players, and his numbers this year don't scream "star player" yet either. I don't think he's overrated but his strength is goals and he's on pace for under 20 this year.

Anyway, this isn't the Laine thread but it does say what you said it does.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I guess I’m the only one here who thinks the Jets actually played well against a VERY good team. The Avs look like the real deal.
I think the Jets ran into a hot goaltender more than they played poorly.

The Jets have a history of making goalies look good. Were Jets shooting at his crest? Or was he doing a good job of getting square to the shooter? I'd bet on some of each.

There was some good play by the Jets. Scheifele looked more like the old Scheifele. That whole line played pretty well. But they couldn't finish. They weren't there for rebounds or deflections.

 

[Howard Chuck]

This is so obviously a coaching and personnel issue. Laine is constantly getting open near the slot waiting for quick passes. Connor is completely incapable of making plays he doesn't create. Scheifele is generally good at it, but he's forced into a constant cycle playing with Wheeler and Connor.

Perreault is the only current Jet who plays makes those kind of plays on our roster outside of Scheifele(who has been sucked into the endless cycle). Stastny also was capable of this. Ovechkin has had Backstrom. A coach should be doing everything he can to find a fit for Laine. He does the exact opposite. PoMo is killing this team. We are a top skill team playing like a bottom skill team

The bold is what I see every game. Laine is finding open ice near the slot and if he can't find it, he's muscling people away from him. I have seen him completely open with his stick cocked and ready, and the puck goes to the point or behind the net. It must be completely frustrating to create space and opportunity, only to have no one look there.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I agree, but if you read this thread we apparently only lost because of laine

I've read this whole thread to this point. Must have missed that.

I've seen that we lost because of playing a perimeter game. I've seen that we lost because of Maurice quite a few times. I didn't see a single post that said we lost because of Laine.

 

[Duke749]

This team is just not all that fun to watch this year even when winning.

This game was just a microcosm of our issues this year.

-Dumb decisions by players. Two terrible defensive changes gave one of the most dangerous players in the league two clear cut breakaways. Laine makes a great play and sets up Morrissey to walk in and where are Connor and Scheifele, off to the side of the net and behind the goal offering zero chance at any potential rebound.

- The team is awful at supporting the puck. I don't know how often I saw a lone player with the puck in the nz with zero options to move the puck. In the offensive zone there is also terrible support.

-Our PK is brutal, just passively collapse on the net and let other teams pick us apart.

- I am saddened by how neutered our offense is. For such a talented team there is very little creativity. Just low risk perimiter crap and point shots with no one infront because our coach is too afraid to give up chances against.

As paying fan this product on the ice is dull and boring. I really think this team is stale and needs a reset.

Well said surixon. Well said.

 

[Howard Chuck]

I've read this whole thread to this point. Must have missed that.

I've seen that we lost because of playing a perimeter game. I've seen that we lost because of Maurice quite a few times. I didn't see a single post that said we lost because of Laine.

Not that we lost because of Laine, just that 21 year old Laine isn't as good as 24 year old Mac

 

[surixon]

What system did you have in mind that would "put" Laine in a better shooting position?
Laine was all over the ice last night - which spots should the coach tell him he can go to and which ones is he not supposed to go to?
Laine had plenty of opportunity in this game - what do you want the coach to do???

The same data driven system that the Boston Bruins (Stanley cup finalists) offense uses. It a system that is built around seam passes and making the goalie move. Start crafting a dangerous layered rush system that utilizes a lot of seam passes. Allow our players to pass into the slot with regularity. Right now we cycle on the perimeter and pass to the point.

Go listan to Maurices interview from a few days ago. He clearly outlines how he wants the team to play in the offensive zone. He stated his preference for point shot driven offense and states his apprehension towards seam passes due to the potential risk of it coming back the other way quickly. It should be pretty clear that the coach wants a low risk low event offensive system that minimizes the risk of turnovers.

It's a poor use of our forward talent if you ask me.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Cale Makar is very, very good.

(So is MacKinnon, but you already knew that. )

 

[Howard Chuck]

Cale Makar is very, very good.

(So is MacKinnon, but you already knew that. )

Yes, great player!

 

[ffh]

The bold is what I see every game. Laine is finding open ice near the slot and if he can't find it, he's muscling people away from him. I have seen him completely open with his stick cocked and ready, and the puck goes to the point or behind the net. It must be completely frustrating to create space and opportunity, only to have no one look there.

What are you saying. They found him plenty. They can't get it to him every time. He had like a 10 shots on net. He cant shoot straight anymore. He either shoots it into the Crest or misses the net all together.

 

[KCjetsfan]

The same data driven system that the Boston Bruins (Stanley cup finalists) offense uses. It a system that is built around seam passes and making the goalie move. Start crafting a dangerous layered rush system that utilizes a lot of seam passes. Allow our players to pass into the slot with regularity. Right now we cycle on the perimeter and pass to the point.

Go listan to Maurices interview from a few days ago. He clearly outlines how he wants the team to play in the offensive zone. He stated his preference for point shot driven offense and states his apprehension towards seam passes due to the potential risk of it coming back the other way quickly. It should be pretty clear that the coach wants a low risk low event offensive system that minimizes the risk of turnovers.

It's a poor use of our forward talent if you ask me.

But it probably protects the terrible defense that he chooses to dress I guess.

Off topic but I was on board with this being a disastrous (standings wise) season but one which was gonna be fun to watch with the skill this team has. Instead it's gonna be a mediocre to disastrous season that is boring as hell.

 

[LowLefty]

The same data driven system that the Boston Bruins (Stanley cup finalists) offense uses. It a system that is built around seam passes and making the goalie move. Start crafting a dangerous layered rush system that utilizes a lot of seam passes. Allow our players to pass into the slot with regularity. Right now we cycle on the perimeter and pass to the point.

Go listan to Maurices interview from a few days ago. He clearly outlines how he wants the team to play in the offensive zone. He stated his preference for point shot driven offense and states his apprehension towards seam passes due to the potential risk of it coming back the other way quickly. It should be pretty clear that the coach wants a low risk low event offensive system that minimizes the risk of turnovers.

It's a poor use of our forward talent if you ask me.

We have used the seam pass and it did result in a lot of turnovers - it's higher risk.
The top line drove the play last night and they got their shots - the problem wasn't system.
What were our high danger shots (1st line) vs the opposition last night? Does anyone have this?

 

[jepjepjoo]

The "coach" has nothing to do with Laine forgetting how to put a little zip into his shots - that is all my post was about.
Eight shots and nothing that looked like it gave this rookie goal tender any trouble what so ever.
He needs to get his shot going - regardless of how well he is playing over all.

But, TBH, I'm not surprised that the "coach" is blamed - it's an easy way to slide over the shortfalls.
Laine played a good solid game but his shot is not what it used to be - he needs to get it back on track.

That's not what you thought in the GDT:

Stop with the excuses - he had a bad night