Is it time for a rebuild ?

[Majorityof1]

If the rumors about some of our veterans being upset about Kyrou's contract were true, and if RoR was one of those vets, no chance he takes a discount anywhere.

Where were the rumors about vets being upset with contracts? That is ridiculous. They were two of the 4 highest point scorers on the team last year. Thomas was 2nd highest p/gm and Kyrou was 2nd highest p/60. Why would anyone be upset about them making more in a league where the next generation almost always makes more. That sounds more like a crack pot fan theory to explain our slow start than any legitimate source.

 

[BrokenFace]

Where were the rumors about vets being upset with contracts? That is ridiculous. They were two of the 4 highest point scorers on the team last year. Thomas was 2nd highest p/gm and Kyrou was 2nd highest p/60. Why would anyone be upset about them making more in a league where the next generation almost always makes more. That sounds more like a crack pot fan theory to explain our slow start than any legitimate source.

I first heard about online or a podcast, maybe even on HF, and disregarded it as another rumor with a questionable amount of truth behind it. Then they talked about it on 101 ESPN radio and I figured there was at least some truth to it. As bad as the radio guys often are, they don't usually critisize the team or bring up behind the scenes negativity unless they feel it's news worthy. As always with these things, the skeptical approach is best. That's why I included two "ifs" in that post.

 

[bleedblue1223]

I'm sure some vets were probably annoyed at how the Pietrangelo and Perron negotiations went compared to how Thomas and Kyrou got their deals. Players don't view this stuff the same way as fans and front office, these guys are their friends, so it's a lot more personal for them as opposed to a more objective outlook.

 

[Mike Liut]

Years 4-8 will be a bargain with the Thomas and Kyrou contracts. They’ll be 12 million dollar players

 

[DatDude44]

Years 4-8 will be a bargain with the Thomas and Kyrou contracts. They’ll be 12 million dollar players

agreed. That's also wehre I see our next cup window.... I really hope we sell senko, ror and barbs for futures to save the future of our franchise and retool around 18,25,89,63,59 &10 up front

 

[execwrite1]

Couldn't be in a worse position than now at .500. Middle of the pack draft pick, no playoffs.

Come on, boys, time to mount another epic losing streak (sorry to say that).

 

[BlueSeal]

Couldn't be in a worse position than now at .500. Middle of the pack draft pick, no playoffs.

Come on, boys, time to mount another epic losing streak (sorry to say that).

This team isn’t bad enough to tank and the market is in complete parity due to broadcasting future money in the NHL in general, so no one’s making the kind of ‘big money’ moves that we would need to make a trade worth it. So you either hit the playoffs so the franchise can make its money or you don’t and put Army on the hot seat. These are his moves and the effects of them he should be held responsible for it, good or bad.

 

[Thallis]

This team isn’t bad enough to tank and the market is in complete parity due to broadcasting future money in the NHL in general, so no one’s making the kind of ‘big money’ moves that we would need to make a trade worth it. So you either hit the playoffs so the franchise can make its money or you don’t and put Army on the hot seat. These are his moves and the effects of them he should be held responsible for it, good or bad.

Sell ROR and Tarasenko and they are absolutely bad enough to tank. Pretty much all of our metrics show a bottom 10 team as we stand.

 

[BlueSeal]

Sell ROR and Tarasenko and they are absolutely bad enough to tank. Pretty much all of our metrics show a bottom 10 team as we stand.

We won’t get much for them at this moment and ownerships stance is playoffs = profit. It’s not that we couldn’t sell them, we simply won’t.

 

[Bye Bye Blueston]

We won’t get much for them at this moment and ownerships stance is playoffs = profit. It’s not that we couldn’t sell them, we simply won’t.

You are speculating and I think incorrectly. They dealt shatty and stats when they were still in playoff hunt. If army thinks we are not legit contender I expect he will deal them rather than let them walk. He will keep them if he thinks we are. That is what his track record says he will do.

 

[Reality Czech]

If we keep winning, Army is going to be a buyer

Are you disappointed that we're not gonna be 10 games under .500 by the end of December like you predicted? That was you, right?

 

[Mike Liut]

Are you disappointed that we're not gonna be 10 games under .500 by the end of December like you predicted? That was you, right?

It was me and I was wrong. Yes I’m disappointed. I want a top 7 pick and a couple 1st round picks

 

[Xerloris]

It was me and I was wrong. Yes I’m disappointed. I want a top 7 pick and a couple 1st round picks

We still have plenty of time. Don't get all emo just yet.

 

[Mike Liut]

We still have plenty of time. Don't get all emo just yet.

If the Blues are 4 points out of the playoffs at the TDL, can you really see Army trading ROR, Tarasenko and Barbie?

 

[Thallis]

If the Blues are 4 points out of the playoffs at the TDL, can you really see Army trading ROR, Tarasenko and Barbie?

Yes, he traded Stastny when the Blues were in a playoff spot.

 

[Mike Liut]

Yes, he traded Stastny when the Blues were in a playoff spot.

True, but he may feel this is the last cup run for a while.

 

[Brockon]

True, but he may feel this is the last cup run for a while.

Run? I don't see how we creep into a divisional playoff spot with the roster as built. I have trouble seeing us claw our way into a wildcard spot, but conceed it could happen...

But run? This team might not get swept but isn't going to make it past either of the division leaders in round 1. I'd be very surprised if we managed to force a game 6 to give the owners 3 home games of playoffs revenues...

If there was a season to sell, it's this one. We Blues fans have been gifted with a playoff team for a long time - but we definitely don't want to be the next Detroit, getting to the playoffs for years when it was clear their window was overvat the expense of setting up a dark decade before having a shot at relevance again. We already have a handful of comparable traits, we don't need more. We need to pivot into a rebuild with some assets that will help from the potential ROR and Tarasenko trades.

 

[Majorityof1]

Yes, he traded Stastny when the Blues were in a playoff spot.

We were also trending downwards when he traded Stastny and Armstrong made a big deal about that in the press. If we had a bad start and were playing good hockey at the TDL that is one thing. That year he gave the team a chance to start playing better and they were losing.

So I really think if we are borderline on the playoffs this year, whether we sell or not will depends on which team we are getting at the time, Jekyll or Hyde. If we win a bunch of games, get into a playoff spot and then are sliding out at the deadline, we sell. If we keep playing .500 hockey, but then are surging into the playoffs come TDL, we might not sell.

If there was a season to sell, it's this one. We Blues fans have been gifted with a playoff team for a long time - but we definitely don't want to be the next Detroit, getting to the playoffs for years when it was clear their window was overvat the expense of setting up a dark decade before having a shot at relevance again. We already have a handful of comparable traits, we don't need more. We need to pivot into a rebuild with some assets that will help from the potential ROR and Tarasenko trades.

A better comparable is Dallas, who only won the one cup, and then missed the playoffs for years. The other reason it is such a good comparable? Armstrong was also their GM.

 

[BlueSeal]

You are speculating and I think incorrectly. They dealt shatty and stats when they were still in playoff hunt. If army thinks we are not legit contender I expect he will deal them rather than let them walk. He will keep them if he thinks we are. That is what his track record says he will do.

I don’t think so. WE want to tank. THEY (Stillman, et all) have money invested in this and want to see a profit, which happens if we make the playoffs. Tanking doesn’t help the bottom line that keeps them in the STL.

We were also trending downwards when he traded Stastny and Armstrong made a big deal about that in the press. If we had a bad start and were playing good hockey at the TDL that is one thing. That year he gave the team a chance to start playing better and they were losing.

So I really think if we are borderline on the playoffs this year, whether we sell or not will depends on which team we are getting at the time, Jekyll or Hyde. If we win a bunch of games, get into a playoff spot and then are sliding out at the deadline, we sell. If we keep playing .500 hockey, but then are surging into the playoffs come TDL, we might not sell.



A better comparable is Dallas, who only won the one cup, and then missed the playoffs for years. The other reason it is such a good comparable? Armstrong was also their GM.

And this is why i worry and why I don’t like Army but can’t hate him: we got a Cup. His moves after might have set us back years just like Dallas. It’s why I bring up Dallas as much as I do.

 

[Bye Bye Blueston]

I don’t think so. WE want to tank. THEY (Stillman, et all) have money invested in this and want to see a profit, which happens if we make the playoffs. Tanking doesn’t help the bottom line that keeps them in the STL.

And this is why i worry and why I don’t like Army but can’t hate him: we got a Cup. His moves after might have set us back years just like Dallas. It’s why I bring up Dallas as much as I do.

They don’t want to tank but that doesn't mean he won’t sell If things don’t look good. He has in past.

 

[Mike Liut]

With a pretty weak west this year, I just don’t see him selling if we are in contention and playing well.

 

[Frenzy31]

True, but he may feel this is the last cup run for a while.

I don’t buy this at all. If Dougs contract was up at the end of the season maybe. But it isn’t. Historically he has shown he takes both the short and long term view.

He will do what is right by the franchise, which is what he has always tried to do.

 

[Mike Liut]

I don’t buy this at all. If Dougs contract was up at the end of the season maybe. But it isn’t. Historically he has shown he takes both the short and long term view.

He will do what is right by the franchise, which is what he has always tried to do.

Hopefully. But can you remember any sports team in recent memory who sold off 3 or 4 UFA’s being in playoff contention? I understand selling off one like he did with Stastny and then Shatty, but to sell off 3 or 4 would be unprecedented.

I hope he sells off ROR, Tarasenko, Barbs, Acciari and Mikkola. I’d also like to move one bigger contract too.

imagine going into the draft with this :

1st - top 10
late 1st - Tarasenko
late 1st - ROR
2nd - Barbs
2nd - Acciari
3rd - ours
3rd - Mikkola
3rd - Greiss

 

[LogosBlue]

Hopefully. But can you remember any sports team in recent memory who sold off 3 or 4 UFA’s being in playoff contention? I understand selling off one like he did with Stastny and then Shatty, but to sell off 3 or 4 would be unprecedented.

I hope he sells off ROR, Tarasenko, Barbs, Acciari and Mikkola. I’d also like to move one bigger contract too.

imagine going into the draft with this :

1st - top 10
late 1st - Tarasenko
late 1st - ROR
2nd - Barbs
2nd - Acciari
3rd - ours
3rd - Mikkola
3rd - Greiss

I'm good with that with the exception of Barbs. Think we need to keep him. If we can get a 2nd for Acciari that would be great! A third for Greiss is a bit of a stretch though.

 

[PocketNines]

The Blues aren't in playoff contention. They're tied for 11th in the conference with Vancouver. They have five expiring contract players each with desirable deadline attributes and they should sell these players for the best price and reload in a strong draft.

The Blues could reload their offense relatively quickly, but none of it matters without a better defenseman than is in the org now. This likely has to be a young prodigy because we've seen vets in that category asking for NMCs, ruling out the Blues. We need a prodigy on an ELC who has no contract leverage. If they draft the right defenseman in 2024 then by the 26-27 season we should start to watch that player emerge and by 27-28 (five years) they could be regular contenders again. They will have to also replace the rest of the defense gradually but it boils down to having that special defenseman whose top end is Cup run capable.