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Confirmed with Link: Is Glen Sather Stepping Down? [UPDATE: Yes]

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SnowblindNYR said:
Leader as a player doesn't equal leader as a front office guy. Also, big picture as a front office guy doesn't equate to being a player. Just admit that this is you thinking with your heart and not your head.
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A lot of organizational culture comes from the top, so leadership skills I would think are a must for that. Oh... and leadership skills are practically universal. I've never met someone who was a good leader in one environment but not another.

Not saying that a good leader is going to be a good front office guy, but the leadership part of it wouldn't be an issue. It'd be the other non-leadership things.
 
Messier should be nowhere near this position, period. It was rumored that Neil Smith let him walk the first time in part because he wanted or had too much influence over personnel moves. They wanted to let him walk in Vancouver because he wanted influence even as his skills as a player were eroding. Messier was a great leader when his play on the ice backed up his rhetoric. He played with great will and was a bull in a china shop on the ice. But there's a reason Glen has never brought him into management.

I think Gorton, Bobrov and Clark are the three guys we want steering the ship. It's possible JD comes in and melds with that group and is more of a facilitator like Glen was.

That said, I wouldn't mind someone coming in and helping the organization be a little more wholistic in its approach to the pipeline. I'd like us to invest more and more in development and in the AHL and if possible the ECHL. We've never replaced Barb Underhill directly. Maybe that's Prentiss Academy now. I dunno. But the team needs to maximize our young assets as they enter the organization. N0t just when they get to Quinn.
 
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Edge said:
I've always gotten the sense that unless the Rangers get someone who is religious about analytics, it would never quite be enough for fans of that approach.
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i think it will take us not having a single player that analytics say is a bad player. even though many analytic 'darlings' are terrible players it will make their charts and graphs prettier
 
Tawnos said:
A lot of organizational culture comes from the top, so leadership skills I would think are a must for that. Oh... and leadership skills are practically universal. I've never met someone who was a good leader in one environment but not another.

Not saying that a good leader is going to be a good front office guy, but the leadership part of it wouldn't be an issue. It'd be the other non-leadership things.
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Fine, but as you say it's not the only part of the job. Not like Messier is the only leader on this planet, get someone with experience.
 
The challenge with Messier is that any conversation about him for any position always comes down to the theoretical.

Good or bad, we can project what we like or don't like about him because there's not a hell of a lot of track record there.

It's almost like political candidate without a detailed voting record. We can essentially project what we want or don't want, and how we feel onto that candidate and there's nothing really there to back it up or discredit it.
 
Tawnos said:
A lot of organizational culture comes from the top, so leadership skills I would think are a must for that. Oh... and leadership skills are practically universal. I've never met someone who was a good leader in one environment but not another.

Not saying that a good leader is going to be a good front office guy, but the leadership part of it wouldn't be an issue. It'd be the other non-leadership things.
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The Canuck and their fans would probably say they have met someone who fits that description.
 
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JHS said:
I'm fairly certain being a good leader would be a quality I'd be interested in if I was looking to fill a role as a president. If the person has any business knowledge I'd consider almost a benefit. Do you really think Glenn Sather was sitting there balancing accounts and making sure the Rangers stick budget was correctly accounted for??? I'd imagine the role is more of a "sit in meetings that are about big picture stuff." I'm sure they have an accounting department to focus on the business aspect of the team. I'd rather have someone in that role where everyone in the meeting respects the guy as a hockey man than someone who knows how to run a balanced budget.
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Is actively throwing out names of people with infinitely more front office experience than Mark Messier really how you want to make your case?

"Stanley Cup captain" is about as valid of a qualification on an executive's resume as "Team player, works hard, close attention to detail".

I would never hire you to run my multi billion dollar sports franchise.
 
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JHS said:
If this is a shot at me you really are way off base. Mess is a leader who proved more than his worth during his time here. I'd be more embarrassed to be promoting Chris Drury to a place of leadership because the guy was a giant nothing during his time as a Ranger and has only a few years in a front office which has done nothing but dismantle the franchise and currently has almost no pressure on it at all to create results since lots of people seem content with just sitting around waiting for this rebuild to somehow all come together.

How is Drury or any others any more a logical choice than Mess to take this job? Drury has essentially been a "yes" man for the past few seasons serving as assistant GM. That does not somehow make him more suited for a role like this one. Have you completely forgotten his time as a player on this team? His tenure in the NHL as a player is nothing compared to Messier's and since that's really all I have to go on because I'm not in these meetings to see if Drury is actually involved in anything, I'll stake my argument on suitability to be a president of an organization on qualities of the person as a player.
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Sure. The Harvard guy isn't qualified for an administrative job. Not only that he has got a tremendous in road with USA NDTP. But you know, "we'll win game 6" probably means more now. This choice is a no brainer.
 
SnowblindNYR said:
Leader as a player doesn't equal leader as a front office guy. Also, big picture as a front office guy doesn't equate to being a player. Just admit that this is you thinking with your heart and not your head.
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I'm not thinking with my heart. I started off saying I don't think Mess is a good fit for this role. My issue is how many so called fans of this organization seem to hate the very idea of him being in a role in the organization. We should, as fans, at least show some level of respect for the franchises most impactful captain in the past 30 years. The level of disdain I was reading where some people just throw Mess out of the discussion because "he has no experience" is awful to me. Again I don't think he is the only choice for this job-- but please show the guy some respect, at least more respect than Chris Drury seems to get around here.
 
Am I crazy or isn't it all but certain Yzerman is/was going to Detroit? I remember that being the explanation when he decided to leave TB, no?
 
JHS said:
I'm not thinking with my heart. I started off saying I don't think Mess is a good fit for this role. My issue is how many so called fans of this organization seem to hate the very idea of him being in a role in the organization. We should, as fans, at least show some level of respect for the franchises most impactful captain in the past 30 years. The level of disdain I was reading where some people just throw Mess out of the discussion because "he has no experience" is awful to me. Again I don't think he is the only choice for this job-- but please show the guy some respect, at least more respect than Chris Drury seems to get around here.
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The difference between Drury and Messier, and the reason why Drury gets more respect in this regard, is that Drury has been an active part of the hockey ops of a pro team for several years now and he keeps getting promoted. Messier might be a great leader, and was a superior leader to Drury (who was a great Captain, if a disappointing acquisition), but Messier's experience with this stuff is definitely far inferior to Drury's.
 
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haveandare said:
Am I crazy or isn't it all but certain Yzerman is/was going to Detroit? I remember that being the explanation when he decided to leave TB, no?
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His reason to step down from GM with Tampa was to spend more time with his family. I think his name is just out there until he (or someone in the Rangers) says no
 
JHS said:
I'm not thinking with my heart. I started off saying I don't think Mess is a good fit for this role. My issue is how many so called fans of this organization seem to hate the very idea of him being in a role in the organization. We should, as fans, at least show some level of respect for the franchises most impactful captain in the past 30 years. The level of disdain I was reading where some people just throw Mess out of the discussion because "he has no experience" is awful to me. Again I don't think he is the only choice for this job-- but please show the guy some respect, at least more respect than Chris Drury seems to get around here.
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But why is "he has no experience" not a legit argument? Also, Messier was paid handsomely by the Rangers and had his number retired. How many favors do we have to do for him at the expense of the team to pay him back for 94?
 
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JD makes the most sense just in terms of connection and experience. Yzerman seems like he just wants to go home but if he would come to NY he's definitely worth inquiring.
 
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JHS said:
I'm not thinking with my heart. I started off saying I don't think Mess is a good fit for this role. My issue is how many so called fans of this organization seem to hate the very idea of him being in a role in the organization. We should, as fans, at least show some level of respect for the franchises most impactful captain in the past 30 years. The level of disdain I was reading where some people just throw Mess out of the discussion because "he has no experience" is awful to me. Again I don't think he is the only choice for this job-- but please show the guy some respect, at least more respect than Chris Drury seems to get around here.
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I don't think people hate the idea of him being in a role, they hate the idea of him leapfrogging the entire ladder and going straight to the top based on his very impressive, but largely irrelevant (in this context) skills as a player and captain.

If he wants to be a scout, start as AGM or something else relatively minor for someone like him and learn the ropes, climb the ladder, that's great. I'd bet very few people would complain or care much at all. I don't think he has any business being president, but I'd be downright happy if he wanted to start at a reasonable entry level for someone with his history with the hopes of climbing to a top job. But he shouldn't get to just cut the entire line and go from nothing to president of a huge business and franchise without putting it any time at a lower level. Nobody should.
 
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haveandare said:
I don't think people hate the idea of him being in a role, they hate the idea of him leapfrogging the entire ladder and going straight to the top based on his very impressive, but largely irrelevant (in this context) skills as a player and captain.

If he wants to be a scout, start as AGM or something else relatively minor for someone like him and learn the ropes, climb the ladder, that's great. I'd bet very few people would complain or care much at all. I don't think he has any business being president, but I'd be downright happy if he wanted to start at a reasonable entry level for someone with his history with the hopes of climbing to a top job. But he shouldn't get to just cut the entire line and go from nothing to president of a huge business and franchise without putting it any time at a lower level. Nobody should.
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Speaking for myself, I don’t want that egomaniac anywhere near this team, in any capacity.

I just can’t forsee anything but diasaster for Messier in any sort of prominent role.
 
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My preference

1st, Just let Gorton be both, he can dole out some responsibility to others need be, hire someone(s) to assist.

2nd, JD, yet not to put above Gorton, to put with him. I don't care what titles they give, if they have to go with "interim" or whatever, yet in no way should anyone have an equal or the overriding vote concerning roster related moves other than Gorton.

Clean up the AHL. let the rebuild continue, give it until at least after expansion and into the next CBA, then re-evaluate.
 
JD stepped out of the broadcast booth and directly into St. Louis' President's role, so it wouldn't be unheard of for Messier to jump into the role with little managerial experience.
 
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