Is Bedard more McDavid or Drai/Matthews/Mackinnon level talent?

[Hippasus]

I’m not following. Can you clarify what you mean here?

Daigle had a good NHL rookie season for an all-time rookie talent? I say, 'No'.

 

[TLEH]

Lafreniere missed two games. He led the tournament in PPG as a draft-eligible.

This was also pre-war, so the WJC wasn't as watered down as it's become in recent years. WJC stats for all players post-war deserve an asterisk.

And I'm not even arguing whether Bedard had a better WJC in his draft year. He likely did, but this idea that Lafreniere didn't have a dominant WJC is revisionist history.

People were asking on this website post-tournament whether Lafreniere was a better prospect than Crosby, and there were quite a number that believed it.

Okay he scored 13 less points as Bedard had an unreal tournament. Yeah there was no Russia that but that’s it. There is always lesser countries to beat up on. Laf was never Bedard level dominant. Ever.

 

[Video Nasty]

Daigle had a good NHL rookie season for an all-time rookie talent? I say, 'No'.

What does that have to do with my point? Why did you quote me to begin with?

 

[Hisch13r]

I honestly think Bedard will be a great player, but I don't see what some of posters see, and I've watched a ton of Bedard. He's way, way below a McDavid / Crosby level for me, but we have posters here that act like he's near that level, he's not.


I beg to differ, McDavid losing a step is still a 120-130 point player, the way he thinks the game is completely different. He decided to win the rocket instead of dishing more, he's that great, he does what he wants on the ice. His skating his certainly tiers above the rest but it's not why he's the best in the world.

Him being better on the PP backs up your point

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Okay he scored 13 less points as Bedard had an unreal tournament. Yeah there was no Russia that but that’s it. There is always lesser countries to beat up on. Laf was never Bedard level dominant. Ever.

What's your point?

You questioned if Lafreniere had a dominant WJC. He led the tournament in PPG as a draft-eligible, which hasn't been done that many times over the years. His team won the tournament, he was the captain, and he won player of the tournament. What else do you want?

I'm not sure why it matters if he had as good of a tournament as Bedard did. They both had dominant WJC's. Lafreniere by plenty of metrics could be viewed as in the generational discussion, as was Bedard. Unless you can explain exactly what are the metrics that matter and demonstrate how Bedard unquestionably was the best of the players being discussed, I don't understand how you can say that Bedard is on a different level from others who've been discussed as generational (yet weren't) since McDavid.

 

[McRpro]

What's your point?

You questioned if Lafreniere had a dominant WJC. He led the tournament in PPG as a draft-eligible, which hasn't been done that many times over the years. His team won the tournament, he was the captain, and he won player of the tournament. What else do you want?

I'm not sure why it matters if he had as good of a tournament as Bedard did. They both had dominant WJC's. Lafreniere by plenty of metrics could be viewed as in the generational discussion, as was Bedard. Unless you can explain exactly what are the metrics that matter and demonstrate how Bedard unquestionably was the best of the players being discussed, I don't understand how you can say that Bedard is on a different level from others who've been discussed as generational (yet weren't) since McDavid.

The only player since McDavid that was ever seriously discussed as "generational" was Dahlin and Bedard certainly has more hype than Rasmus did.

 

[Seanaconda]

I mean I'm just not gonna deny the stats . Till he proves otherwise ill have to say he's McDavids level at the same age. I hope he doesn't get to where McDavid is now as an oilers fan but I don't see why he couldn't.

 

[TLEH]

What's your point?

You questioned if Lafreniere had a dominant WJC. He led the tournament in PPG as a draft-eligible, which hasn't been done that many times over the years. His team won the tournament, he was the captain, and he won player of the tournament. What else do you want?

I'm not sure why it matters if he had as good of a tournament as Bedard did. They both had dominant WJC's. Lafreniere by plenty of metrics could be viewed as in the generational discussion, as was Bedard. Unless you can explain exactly what are the metrics that matter and demonstrate how Bedard unquestionably was the best of the players being discussed, I don't understand how you can say that Bedard is on a different level from others who've been discussed as generational (yet weren't) since McDavid.

If we are comparing two WJCs of different caliber then they both aren’t dominant using each others as context.

Also because Bedard has dominated his peers more than others.

 

[BraveCanadian]

We have no idea what he is yet.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

The only player since McDavid that was ever seriously discussed as "generational" was Dahlin and Bedard certainly has more hype than Rasmus did.

I've been on this website for many years and follow the prospect discussions. I can tell you this is very much not correct.

These discussions were had about Eichel, Matthews, Laine, Patrick, Dahlin, Hughes, Lafreniere, and Wright.

Some were longer and more serious than other discussions, but it's not been 1 or 2 players discussed in this light. It's been a lot. It's very year or two, and some years multiple.

 

[Hippasus]

What does that have to do with my point? Why did you quote me to begin with?

Look at post 68 and backtrack from there. I'm responding to *your* claim in post 76, which I took to be a response to the former post.

 

[McRpro]

I've been on this website for many years and follow the prospect discussions. I can tell you this is very much not correct.

These discussions were had about Eichel, Matthews, Laine, Patrick, Dahlin, Hughes, Lafreniere, and Wright.

Some were longer and more serious than other discussions, but it's not been 1 or 2 players discussed in this light. It's been a lot. It's very year or two, and some years multiple.

Then you pay too much attention to what random posters on HFboards think. Just because someone is a highly touted prospect and first overall pick doesn't mean they are considered generational. Lindros, Crosby and McDavid are the 3 consensus generational prospects of the last 35 years. Bedard is the 4th.

 

[SeanMoneyHands]

Bedard is more Greztzky.

 

[Channelcat]

Not on par with any of those guys, but still very good.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Then you pay too much attention to what random posters on HFboards think. Just because someone is a highly touted prospect and first overall pick doesn't mean they are considered generational. Lindros, Crosby and McDavid are the 3 consensus generational prospects of the last 35 years. Bedard is the 4th.

You want Bedard to be the 4th.

I don't know how you can claim that so matter-of-factly.

He could be the fourth, but not everyone agrees. Unless you can explain how it's an open and shut case for him compared to the others, I'm not sure how you've arrived at that position.

 

[McRpro]

You want Bedard to be the 4th.

I don't know how you can claim that so matter-of-factly.

He could be the fourth, but not everyone agrees. Unless you can explain how it's an open and shut case for him compared to the others, I'm not sure how you've arrived at that position.

This isn't my opinion. This is the consensus of the hockey(NHL) community. I don't want Bedard to be the 4th, I'm just echoing what people who get paid to scout hockey are saying.

 

[authentic]

He's probably in between

 

[Hippasus]

Different leagues at draft year, junior level can be compared by points-per-game:

Crosby 2.72ppg (QMJHL)
Daigle 2.58ppg (QMJHL)
Bedard 2.51ppg (WHL).

 

[centipede2233]

It's not just McDavid's skating that makes him special though. He thinks the game better than everybody, it's what he can do with the puck along with warp speed that makes him unique and now he has added elite goal scorer to the list by improving his shot tenfold.

McDavid isn't the physical force that Lemeiux was but he's every bit as talented, he just does his generational things in a different way. McDavid in the 80s with how wide open the play was and how poor the goalies were might have put up 250 points in a season, I truly believe that. It's like Gretzky's vision with Bure's speed.

i understand your take, but mcdavid is the player he is today using todays’s equipment, today’s training. Gretzky didn’t have the tools nhlers have today. For example, when I went to high school and college in the 90’s I used the library for research. Very time consuming and obtaining little info. The internet today houses infinite information. Information at your finger tips, just type in whatever in the search box and voila. mcdavid isn’t the player he is today if he enters the nhl in the 1980’s Cause of the above differences.

 

[Hippasus]

i understand your take, but mcdavid is the player he is today using todays’s equipment, today’s training. Gretzky didn’t have the tools nhlers have today. For example, when I went to high school and college in the 90’s I used the library for research. Very time consuming and obtaining little info. The internet today houses infinite information. Information at your finger tips, just type in whatever in the search box and voila. mcdavid isn’t the player he is today if he enters the nhl in the 1980’s Cause of the above differences.

Libraries are greater than the internet. But yeah, McDavid is probably a different level than the other options, as much as I love Draisaitl.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

This isn't my opinion. This is the consensus of the hockey(NHL) community. I don't want Bedard to be the 4th, I'm just echoing what people who get paid to scout hockey are saying.

The consensus? Check the poll results.

 

[AcerComputer]

Probably will be more of a Debrincat or a Cole Caufield than any of these players.

 

[McRpro]

The consensus? Check the poll results.

Ah yes, the much vaunted HFBoards experts.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Ah yes, the much vaunted HFBoards experts.

Who makes up the consensus you are referring to?

 

[TruePowerSlave]

As a prospect there is no argument that Bedard should be on level with Matthews, Mack and Drai.