Hypothetical - does McDavid win the Conn Smythe even if Oilers lose the cup? Assuming he has an above average finals

[TooManyHumans]

There is no such thing as padding stats in the playoffs, there's way too much parity in the NHL, what a comically awful take.

Guy's fifth all time in points per game in the playoffs with a reasonable sample (70 games) and people will find the most absurd ways to tear him down.

It's well established that scoring goes down the further you go into the playoffs. If your career in the playoffs is mostly in the first round then you should be expected to have a higher ppg average than someone who routinely goes deep into the playoffs.

 

[Empoleon8771]

2 of McDavid’s 3 points came when the Oilers were already down 4-1, which was absolutely in part due to McDavid and Draisaitl being absolute ghosts in the first 2 periods of that game.

I kinda have a hard time giving McDavid credit for getting 2 points after his early game performance put them in a hole that the 2 points wasn’t enough to get out of. They're still points, but the value of 2 assists to lose 4-3 vs no assists to lose 4-1 doesn’t seem to be all that different to me.

 

[Offtheboard412]

Imagine having Chris Osgoode in nets against you

/s

But seriously, what was wrong with Chris Kunitz at the time? He was as legit a top 6 player as anyone in the league at the time.

Kunitz was a good player, but he wasn't there for the first finals the Pens made, and he struggled offensively in the 09 playoffs. He really didn't develop any chemistry with Crosby until the year after they won their first Cup. He only scored one goal that entire playoffs, though he did manage to pick up 13 assists and was solid in other areas.

 

[bobholly39]

2 of McDavid’s 3 points came when the Oilers were already down 4-1, which was absolutely in part due to McDavid and Draisaitl being absolute ghosts in the first 2 periods of that game.

I kinda have a hard time giving McDavid credit for getting 2 points after his early game performance put them in a hole that the 2 points wasn’t enough to get out of. They're still points, but the value of 2 assists to lose 4-3 vs no assists to lose 4-1 doesn’t seem to be all that different to me.

I think there's too much over-analyzing that happens.

Your team is down 4-1 in the third period of such a critical game...and you get 2 key points in the 3rd ot cut the lead to 4-3. How is that not important/valuable?

 

[Empoleon8771]

I think there's too much over-analyzing that happens.

Your team is down 4-1 in the third period of such a critical game...and you get 2 key points in the 3rd ot cut the lead to 4-3. How is that not important/valuable?

Because they still lost 4-3, so the end result would have been identical had McDavid had 0 points in the 3rd period. It would be different if those points happened early in a game because it would change the entire story of the game. But they happened late when the Oilers had effectively already lost.

Either way, the expectation for McDavid’s performance should be higher than 3 points in 3 games. That’s not even touching on the value of those points being put up while down 4-1.

 

[22Brad Park]

Bob is taking Conn Smythe for my money

 

[Goose]

It's well established that scoring goes down the further you go into the playoffs. If your career in the playoffs is mostly in the first round then you should be expected to have a higher ppg average than someone who routinely goes deep into the playoffs.

Fair argument if you can prove the decrease is statistically significant, which I'm highly doubtful of.

Also extremely doubtful that it's so significant that you can call scoring playoff points in the first two rounds "padding." It's m-er-f-ing hard to win playoff series in the NHL.

 

[Sasha Orlov]

Ooooof.

I was right all along. Draisaitl has proven nothing beyond the second round.

Can't call a player one of the best performers when they're just padding stats in the worst division in the league for the first two rounds.

LMAO you are pathetic

 

[DingerMcSlapshot]

Looking like a big fat no.

 

[VivaLasVegas]

Looking like a big fat no.

Generational NO

 

[MCR74]

McDavid has one game left to turn it on and show us he's truly the world's best. Unfortunately he has to play the Panthers. There will be no Conn Smythe for him this year.

 

[kevsh]

How is that not important/valuable?

In the same way a goalie gives up two soft goals in the first but makes two huge saves in the third, in a loss.

His two points in the end are only "valuable" if they win the game. They didn't.
Of course if Edmonton were to come back and win the series with McD leading that charge, then certainly those two points will help him a little - because in the end they won.

Overanalyzing? Sure, but it's actually pretty simple = It's valuable when you win.

 

[TooManyHumans]

Fair argument if you can prove the decrease is statistically significant, which I'm highly doubtful of.

Also extremely doubtful that it's so significant that you can call scoring playoff points in the first two rounds "padding." It's m-er-f-ing hard to win playoff series in the NHL.

I don't have the data but I have seen it in the past and it shows a pretty clear trend of scoring going down as you get deeper into the playoffs. Save percentage tends to go up as well.

 

[bambamcam4ever]

2 of McDavid’s 3 points came when the Oilers were already down 4-1, which was absolutely in part due to McDavid and Draisaitl being absolute ghosts in the first 2 periods of that game.

I kinda have a hard time giving McDavid credit for getting 2 points after his early game performance put them in a hole that the 2 points wasn’t enough to get out of. They're still points, but the value of 2 assists to lose 4-3 vs no assists to lose 4-1 doesn’t seem to be all that different to me.

This is not uncommon in his playoff career. Game 1 vs Chicago he makes some terrible plays in his own zone and is the biggest reason they are losing 3-0. Later puts up 3 points in garbage time but they still lose by 2.

 

[Trade]

Two garbage points tonight from McD won’t change the fact that he and Leon have been a major disappointment in the Finals so far.

A win for McDavid would almost certainly discredit the award entirely.

 

[GreatGonzo]

Because they still lost 4-3, so the end result would have been identical had McDavid had 0 points in the 3rd period. It would be different if those points happened early in a game because it would change the entire story of the game. But they happened late when the Oilers had effectively already lost.

Either way, the expectation for McDavid’s performance should be higher than 3 points in 3 games. That’s not even touching on the value of those points being put up while down 4-1.

What are you talking about?

So you would rather him go pointless in a 4-1 loss than try to get the game back in hand with two assists in a 4-3 loss? What sort of logic is this?..Either way, you will find a reason to trash McDavid regardless…

McDavid hasn’t been playing that great, but in case you haven’t noticed, their top talent hasn’t done ANYTHING. Their goaltending has completely shit the bed and their defense has been bleeding goals.

That’s the problem though isn’t it? Is “expectations.” But the facts are McDavid could have 10 points in this series and you would still find a reason to hate on him.

 

[GreatGonzo]

In the same way a goalie gives up two soft goals in the first but makes two huge saves in the third, in a loss.

His two points in the end are only "valuable" if they win the game. They didn't.
Of course if Edmonton were to come back and win the series with McD leading that charge, then certainly those two points will help him a little - because in the end they won.

Overanalyzing? Sure, but it's actually pretty simple = It's valuable when you win.

Once again, people would have rather the Oilers lose 4-1 than 4-3…how dare McDavid try to get his team back in the game!!

People simply love to hate on McDavid no matter what. He has to score all the goals, make all the plays, make all the saves, and play stellar defensively….if he doesn’t do ALL these things at once, he’s no real “winner”

 

[Neil Racki]

Once again, people would have rather the Oilers lose 4-1 than 4-3…how dare McDavid try to get his team back in the game!!

People simply love to hate on McDavid no matter what. He has to score all the goals, make all the plays, make all the saves, and play stellar defensively….if he doesn’t do ALL these things at once, he’s no real “winner”

I WANT to love McDavid .. I want to feel like Im watching the Michael Jordan of hockey

This Finals was supposed to be his coming out party for non-hockey fans to see

McDavid looks like a power play merchant and nothing more. Zero defensive zone impact, good 5 v 5, amazing on the PP.

McDavid is screwing the pooch right now

hes f***ing Scottie Pippen at this point

 

[GreatGonzo]

I WANT to love McDavid .. I want to feel like Im watching the Michael Jordan of hockey

This Finals was supposed to be his coming out party for non-hockey fans to see

McDavid looks like a power play merchant and nothing more. Zero defensive zone impact, good 5 v 5, amazing on the PP.

McDavid is screwing the pooch right now

hes f***ing Scottie Pippen at this point

Again, it’s ALL McDavids fault? He’s literally the only one putting in any offense while the rest of his team isn’t doing shit. His goaltending and defense is a wreck too, but I guess that’s all him too?

Scottie pippen? The guy with ZERO scoring titles or MVPs…sure bud.

 

[MCR74]

I WANT to love McDavid .. I want to feel like Im watching the Michael Jordan of hockey

This Finals was supposed to be his coming out party for non-hockey fans to see

McDavid looks like a power play merchant and nothing more. Zero defensive zone impact, good 5 v 5, amazing on the PP.

McDavid is screwing the pooch right now

hes f***ing Scottie Pippen at this point

The "hate" also comes from OIlers fans shoving him down our throats at every opportunity and reminding us that there is no greater player. McDavid has been a non-factor so far. I hope his team flames out in 4.

 

[AvroArrow]

Unless there's an epic collapse, Bob is winning the Smythe

 

[Neil Racki]

Again, it’s ALL McDavids fault? He’s literally the only one putting in any offense while the rest of his team isn’t doing shit. His goaltending and defense is a wreck too, but I guess that’s all him too?

Scottie pippen? The guy with ZERO scoring titles or MVPs…sure bud.

No dude. Geez .. stop trying to interpret any comment as a diss to mcdavid. McDavid is the best player in hockey. FFS do I have to write that every time before I make a personal observation on McDavid?

Oilers down 0-3 is not his fault. This is a McDavid thread so Im talking McDavid.

my comment and opinion is limited to the confinement of "mcdavid had this chance in the Finals to showcase to the world that he is the MJ of hockey .. and so far he is disappointing."

even the biggest mcdavid/oilers fan has to admit that.

 

[Hockeyville USA]

Evan Rodrigues: 4 points in the Final, 3 goals

McSpeedSkater: 3 points in the Final, 0 goals

 

[Artemi Panarin]

I think it's safe to say that he doesn't. You hate to see it, but it's true.

 

[Empoleon8771]

What are you talking about?

So you would rather him go pointless in a 4-1 loss than try to get the game back in hand with two assists in a 4-3 loss? What sort of logic is this?..Either way, you will find a reason to trash McDavid regardless…

McDavid hasn’t been playing that great, but in case you haven’t noticed, their top talent hasn’t done ANYTHING. Their goaltending has completely shit the bed and their defense has been bleeding goals.

That’s the problem though isn’t it? Is “expectations.” But the facts are McDavid could have 10 points in this series and you would still find a reason to hate on him.

Maybe if McDavid wasn't playing terrible relative to the expectations for how he should be playing, he wouldn't be receiving criticism?

Crazy thought: he's being criticized because of threads like these hyping him up to crazy levels, only for him to be a complete dud when the games actually start.

McDavid has been invisible for his standards for most of the series. He finally looked alive in the 3rd period after the Oilers were down 4-1, but that was too late and they still lost that game. They're down 3-0 in the series and have been utterly dominated by the Panthers. How do you think it's somehow not fair game to criticize McDavid for that?