How can the culture be changed with Dubas still in charge?

[Dekes For Days]

@PromisedLand, @JimmyFirecracker, @ToneDog, @axlrose87, @Lumberg all understood it. It's ok if you don't get it Dekes, not everyone has the ability to be able read something and understand the intent when they don't have the background or experience to reference.

None of those individuals even commented on the discussion/post being referenced, so not sure how you came to that conclusion. Perhaps one of them could explain the secret hidden message that you actually meant, since despite repeated request for clarification, you're so unwilling to provide anything but deflections and personal attacks?

 

[hamzarocks]

Tampa got swept after winning the President's Trophy. I didn't see them trading Kucherov away for being stupid and selfish and getting suspended in that series or Point, Stamkos etc.

They kept the core, and added to it. What's wrong in backing your players?

Tampa had Tyler Johnson, Alex Killorn, Ondrej Palat, Yanni Gourde, Anthony Cirelli as their best 5 best forwards after their big 3. Those 5 are elite supporting depth players who helped them be a very deep team and helped them make the finals in 2015, and ECF in 2016 and 2018

Leafs have 4 guys than no one comparable to even the worst of those 5 (2019 TJ). They added Coleman and Goodrow as they already had elite offensive depth along with elite defensive depth.

Tampa was built to win and built very well. The leafs are shallow offensively, with a unproven goaltending tandem for next year and a defense which isn't as good as Tampa's was.

2021 Leafs are nothing like 2019 Tampa. 2021 Leafs would have came 3rd in the Atlantic and fallen to the Bruins in the 1st round if the divisions were normal.

2019 Tampa ran the league in the regular season before choking

 

[Bomber0104]

@PromisedLand, @ToneDog, @Jimmy Firecracker @axlrose87, @Lumberg all understood it.

It's ok if you don't get it Dekes, not everyone has the ability to be able read something and understand the intent when they don't have the background or experience to reference.

You're very good at understanding expected goals, so don't feel badly.

Don't know about that but copy-and-pasting them, definitely..

 

[PromisedLand]

Yeah, you have to wonder when the Big 4 becomes someone else’s adversity instead of always running into speed bumps.

they might go individually and fit in with another club as a last piece BUT together they are not pieces that will give success. they are just not a good fit IMO for a "TEAM" that will get it done!

 

[myleafs]

Advancing deep in the playoffs before this season I would argue was an unrealistic expectation by fans. This year is the first we can be legit disappointed. I do think the freak accident that took out JT was the difference. When I saw the injury happen, after concern for his health, I quickly realized any hope of a cup died with that hit. We weren't winning with that gaping 2C hole and the moral loss of our captain.

You would think with 3 other players taking up 30 milly in cap that they would be able to get er done regardless.

 

[PromisedLand]

“It ain’t what you don’t know that gets you into trouble. It’s what you know for sure that just ain’t so. “ – Mark Twain

 

[ALine]

To the 'blow it up' crowd, there is no path to even being where we are today without another decade of watching leafs headlined by the Bozaks and Gardiners of the world. I for one, am not ready for that. The plan all along was to ride this core until Matthews needs a new contract. I can live with that. I'd bet dollars to donuts that if Dubas was fired today, any new GM would do exactly that as well.

 

[JT AM da real deal]

Nothing can change with a guy who wants to be everyone's friend .. business and hockey is not for da weak of heart .. people will respect tough decisions and straight talk no BS .. people on here don't like Lou but that's what it takes to win .. it started with Willy and all downhill since

 

[Bomber0104]

Based on the vibe of the past few pages here, it sounds like Dubas should have just stayed home and not talked to the media today

 

[ULF_55]

I don't see what's wrong with this. Keeping the morale high for your current roster is management 101. What do people want him to say? This group sucks, I don't believe in them?

IMO they have 2 choices:

1. Continue on with this company of men with a few tweaks
2. Trade marner or Matthews

I'd actually prefer 2, and it isn't like I'd expect immediate dividends or grand success, but I find the current version kind of unlikeable, and I've got 54 years of watching mostly lovable losers (since watching the last successful team).

Not much love for this group, it is all about winning and not emotional attachment.

 

[Pi]

It is the TORONTO MAPLE LEAFS but he freeking is getting away with it. Is everybody asleep down at the cash box ?? Seriously somebody wake up already.

You talk as if the Toronto Maple Leafs are some franchise who doesn't even know what losing is like the San Antonio Spurs. We're shit and haven't won a playoff series for 17 years.

The team Dubas has built literally had it's best season in forever. They were good defensively, they were good offensively. They played well in front of their goalie.

It's not his fault if they choked. He's willing to bet his job that soon they will break through. He knows he's a goner if that doesn't happen. I don't see anything wrong in backing the group. I would want to trade Marner simply out of rage because he's f***ing sucked but what do you actually even get in return that will make the team better not only in the short term but also long term? I doubt very much.

At some point, the players need to look in the mirror and play to their capabilities and he's betting it will happen this season.

Like or hate Dubas, if you were a player on the Leafs right now, you would want to run through a wall for him (if you give a single shit about winning).

What Dubas is doing right now is exactly what you would want from a leader.

 

[showtime8]

look at his life man.... he has been "lucky" all his life....

- never had to work his ass off for the Soo job
- never had to work his ass off for the Leafs job
- neevr had to work his ass off for the Leafs AGM job
- never had to work his ass off for the Leafs GM job

things just fell on the silver platter for him; his game plan is "everything will work out" because in his experience he never had to work hard for anything.

He is entitled and has found kinship with entitled brats of the Leafs

So he just had to show up to the interview and they just gave it to him?

You know they didn't have to hire him, right? There's no one within the Leafs organization that he's related to. At least that I know of.

He won the Calder Cup as the Leafs Assistant GM.

 

[Dreakmur]

The results do not suggest that.

Play-off losses are a result.

 

[Michael HOMERUNing]

Cute that people think Marner or Matthews or any one really prioritizes winning a Cup over getting paid. At the end of the day, these guys are sleeping well, and why shouldn't they? Their great grandchildren are guaranteed a lavish lifestyle

 

[Trapper]

they might go individually and fit in with another club as a last piece BUT together they are not pieces that will give success. they are just not a good fit IMO for a "TEAM" that will get it done!

This is it exactly.
We were never winning with Kessel but Kessel as part of Pittsburgh is something different.
Marner with Bergeron/Marchand is something different.

These 4 together, there comes a time after watching the years and saying the sum of the parts isn’t it. Not bad as individual players, just not great as a playoff whole.

 

[ToneDog]

You talk as if the Toronto Maple Leafs are some franchise who doesn't even know what losing is like the San Antonio Spurs. We're shit and haven't won a playoff series for 17 years.

The team Dubas has built literally had it's best season in forever. They were good defensively, they were good offensively. They played well in front of their goalie.

It's not his fault if they choked. He's willing to bet his job that soon they will break through. He knows he's a goner if that doesn't happen. I don't see anything wrong in backing the group. I would want to trade Marner simply out of rage because he's f***ing sucked but what do you actually even get in return that will make the team better not only in the short term but also long term? I doubt very much.

At some point, the players need to look in the mirror and play to their capabilities and he's betting it will happen this season.

Like or hate Dubas, if you were a player on the Leafs right now, you would want to run through a wall for him (if you give a single shit about winning).

What Dubas is doing right now is exactly what you would want from a leader.

They won the North which was made up of 7 shitty teams and they lost to the 4th best team in said division. This core has now shown that they are not willing to go through a cardboard box for Dubas, let alone a wall. Dubas has created a mess that I do not see him being able to get himself out of. I am confident that it won't take long for all to see once this season starts and they have to play the American teams.

 

[showtime8]

Based on the vibe of the past few pages here, it sounds like Dubas should have just stayed home and not talked to the media today

"I'm just here so I won't get fined"...

 

[Pi]

This is it exactly.
We were never winning with Kessel but Kessel as part of Pittsburgh is something different.
Marner with Bergeron/Marchand is something different.

These 4 together, there comes a time after watching the years and saying the sum of the parts isn’t it. Not bad as individual players, just not great as a playoff whole.

3 of the 4 guys you're talking about aren't even ~25 years old. It's way too quick to put a label on them.

 

[Pi]

They won the North which was made up of 7 shitty teams and they lost to the 4th best team in said division. This core has now shown that they are not willing to go through a cardboard box for Dubas, let alone a wall. Dubas has created a mess that I do not see him being able to get himself out of. I am confident that it won't take long for all to see once this season starts and they have to play the American teams.

The North was one of the highest scoring divisions and they were still very good defensively.

 

[Stephen]

they might go individually and fit in with another club as a last piece BUT together they are not pieces that will give success. they are just not a good fit IMO for a "TEAM" that will get it done!

That’s why I want to recycle 1-2 of them and rebuild it better with the remaining core guys.

 

[Pi]

That’s why I want to recycle 1-2 of them and rebuild it better with the remaining core guys.

I am surprised that we aren't in on Eichel to be honest. It makes no sense. It's the perfect time to trade Marner+ to get Eichel while saving a bit of cap space.

It seems like a no brainer for both sides. Eichel wants out and I don't think there is a single team that can offer a talent close to Marner in return for him and I am sure that the Sabres are tired with shiny prospects and picks that turn into nothing and would much rather have a sure superstar from that same draft.

That's the one move I would make right now if I was GM.

 

[PromisedLand]

Hall (4 years for 6 AAV); Goodrow (6 years 3.6 AAV)


still waiting for another team in the league to have 3 players making 11 AAV

 

[ToneDog]

The North was one of the highest scoring divisions and they were still very good defensively.

The North was playing regular season shinny which the Leafs love to play. Only the Habs were built for the playoffs and hence why they were able to dust the Leafs and Jets off in 7 straight games once they got their shit together. Sorry I am not optimistic Dubas can fix this over the summer. This team needs to take a step back in order to take two steps forward but they are in win-now mode so it won't happen.

 

[Pi]

The North was playing regular season shinny which the Leafs love to play. Only the Habs were built for the playoffs and hence why they were able to dust the Leafs and Jets off in 7 straight games once they got their shit together. Sorry I am not optimistic Dubas can fix this over the summer. This team needs to take a step back in order to take two steps forward but they are in win-now mode so it won't happen.

That's BS and you know it.

The Habs were built for the playoffs?

Were you willing to say that after Game 4 when the Leafs were up 3-1 and allowed a total of 4 goals in those 4 games?

The Leafs choked. It's really as simple as that. The Habs aren't built for shit. They just got lucky and it sucks that this team isn't even able to luck their way into winning a round or two right now.

 

[ToneDog]

That's BS and you know it.

The Habs were built for the playoffs?

Were you willing to say that after Game 4 when the Leafs were up 3-1 and allowed a total of 4 goals in those 4 games?

The Leafs choked. It's really as simple as that. The Habs aren't built for shit. They just got lucky and it sucks that this team isn't even able to luck their way into winning a round or two right now.

I said Bergevin was building a team for the playoffs when they acquired Edmunson, Allen, Anderson, Toffoli and Perry last summer. Look it up if you like.

As for the Leafs choke, perhaps the play of the Habs had something to do with it ??