Value of: Hartnell to Leafs

[major major]

He was offering the 3rd overall and wanted to bundle Hartnell in. That says it all.

Hartnell was worked into some of those trade discussions but not as negative value. Common misconception, I don't think you know what you're talking about.

The team had to move some salary, but that doesn't mean every player that might have been considered for moving was negative value. As it happens they just jettisoned Tyutin and Boll (two players Jackets fans wanted to get rid of) and kept Hartnell (a player we agree the Jackets can use, you know 110 pts in 2 years!)

 

[Monk]

Yes, everything is irrelevant when it opposes your opinion.

About 7 different people told you why your argument is stupid. At this point it's just entertaining, so by all means, carry on, Buttman.

 

[Kamiccolo]

Besides this being terrible for the Leafs when considering what we should be doing (and Hartnells questionable future.. Will he be a healthy 5m+ scratch for the last few years?)

How about the Leafs have no cap space? How do we fit him in?

This makes no damn sense for the Leafs, and if Jackets fas want to defend their cap dump then we're all in agreement.

No from both sides.

 

[Fro]

He was offering the 3rd overall and wanted to bundle Hartnell in. That says it all.

at this point i'm assuming you're just causing a stir for giggles...

That was occurring, as pointed out by many others, when Columbus needed to shread cap space. After buying out Boll and Tyutin, that isn't the case. You'll notice there hasn't been an article, and I'm guessing you already have since every one you posted was pre-draft, stating that they're still looking to move him.

And for "no one" wants him, there sure seem to be a lot of threads started in the last couple of months of fans of other teams (rarely a CBJ fan) started to gauge value to bring him in.

so I'm guessing you might start to realize where you're incorrect

 

[pete goegan]

...the Leafs have no cap space? How do we fit him in?

This makes no damn sense for the Leafs,...we're all in agreement.

No from both sides.

With just a bit of editing, I can agree with you.

 

[34]

JVR - like all trade proposals out of Toronto.

JVR will NOT be traded. He may well be the new Leafs Captain.

Do not want Hartnell anywhere near Toronto anyway.

 

[buttman*]

Hartnell was worked into some of those trade discussions but not as negative value. Common misconception, I don't think you know what you're talking about.

The team had to move some salary, but that doesn't mean every player that might have been considered for moving was negative value. As it happens they just jettisoned Tyutin and Boll (two players Jackets fans wanted to get rid of) and kept Hartnell (a player we agree the Jackets can use, you know 110 pts in 2 years!)

So the dozen or so articles I linked to mean nothing but your speculation is fact?

 

[buttman*]

JVR will NOT be traded. He may well be the new Leafs Captain.

Do not want Hartnell anywhere near Toronto anyway.

NOt to worry the Leafs aren't adding a 34 year old with 3 years left and a no move clause. It will NEVER happen.

 

[Monk]

So the dozen or so articles I linked to mean nothing but your speculation is fact?

Nice job Buttman! Keep this effort level up and you very well may be making valid points in the next few years.

 

[buttman*]

Nice job Buttman! Keep this effort level up and you very well may be making valid points in the next few years.

That's what posters say when they have no logic or reason to add to a comment. Changing the subject is about the only thing that will help you.

 

[Monk]

That's what posters say when they have no logic or reason to add to a comment. Changing the subject is about the only thing that will help you.

Except you're just ignoring reason and logic, so what's the point?

That's a rhetorical question, please don't answer it.

 

[Fro]

So the dozen or so articles I linked to mean nothing but your speculation is fact?

but do you get that linking to a bunch of articles during a time when the CBJ needed to shred cap space vs now where they don't is just as ingenuous?

 

[Crede777]

Yes, Columbus was trying to trade him, and yes they were trying to package him with the 3rd. But the condition was that he wouldn't be negative value in the trade.

Kekalainen essentially was saying "you have to take Hartnell in addition to the 3rd overall and give me full value on both" which obviously nobody did. So that's why Hartnell wasn't traded.

 

[tony d]

Meh, don't see a suitable deal here. Toronto has an abundance of forwards not impact defenseman like Columbus would need.

 

[buttman*]

but do you get that linking to a bunch of articles during a time when the CBJ needed to shred cap space vs now where they don't is just as ingenuous?

I wouldn't say "ingenious" I would say 'obvious'. The Jackets are still up against the cap once they add a couple players to fill out the roster. Hartnell is still 34, still signed for too long and still has a NMC which FORCES protection in the upcoming expansion draft. Those are all fact. None of which have changed. Hartnell has negative value in my opinion and your unbridled love for all things Jackets won't change that. On the plus side -- he has more value than David Clarkson.

 

[buttman*]

Yes, Columbus was trying to trade him, and yes they were trying to package him with the 3rd. But the condition was that he wouldn't be negative value in the trade.

Kekalainen essentially was saying "you have to take Hartnell in addition to the 3rd overall and give me full value on both" which obviously nobody did. So that's why Hartnell wasn't traded.

and why he never will be.

 

[Monk]

I wouldn't say "ingenious" I would say 'obvious'. The Jackets are still up against the cap once they add a couple players to fill out the roster. Hartnell is still 34, still signed for too long and still has a NMC which FORCES protection in the upcoming expansion draft. Those are all fact. None of which have changed. Hartnell has negative value in my opinion and your unbridled love for all things Jackets won't change that. On the plus side -- he has more value than David Clarkson.

Hahahahaha

 

[buttman*]

Hahahahaha

These are the responses you get when said poster has no valid argument. Good job, you give up now?

 

[613Leafer]

This would be your typical Burke/Nonis/Fletcher/any previous regieme move. It's not necessary.

Exactly. Leafs need to have some patience. Trading young cost effective pieces for older players has backfired on us quite a lot.

We just finished dead last in the league, it's not the time yet for this. We have no pressure this season, let's just see how it plays out.

 

[Monk]

These are the responses you get when said poster has no valid argument. Good job, you give up now?

I'm literally just responding so you keep saying stupid ****. Keep 'em coming buttman.

 

[mikeyp24]

I'm assuming buttman is a troll? I've never seen anyone ignore logic this way before. I don't know how a player who has had 0 decline in play that puts up 1st line numbers playing games 2nd and 3rd line minutes is a cap dump. He would have gotten Backes or Lucic style contracts if he were a FA last year.

But hey in the land of Toronto Kadri is a stud and a proven first line producer in Hartnell is a declining cap dump.

 

[buttman*]

I'm literally just responding so you keep saying stupid ****. Keep 'em coming buttman.

"you keep saying stupid ****"" yes, you do. Carry on now son, it's clear you cannot speak with poise or intellect. I'll leave you to your name calling.

 

[buttman*]

I'm assuming buttman is a troll? I've never seen anyone ignore logic this way before. I don't know how a player who has had 0 decline in play that puts up 1st line numbers playing games 2nd and 3rd line minutes is a cap dump. He would have gotten Backes or Lucic style contracts if he were a FA last year.

But hey in the land of Toronto Kadri is a stud and a proven first line producer in Hartnell is a declining cap dump.

What logic? You mean the overpaid 34 year old with 3 years left and a NMC that nobody wanted even with the 3rd overall pick? That logic. Give it a break.

 

[Fro]

What logic? You mean the overpaid 34 year old with 3 years left and a NMC that nobody wanted even with the 3rd overall pick? That logic. Give it a break.

its not logic, b/c you're cherry picking the part of the conversation that suits you and dismissing everything else...or you know, the same thing you're accusing everyone else of...

CBJ fans have stated that yes, in June they were trying to offload him in anyway possible, but once buying out Boll and Tyutin, that became less of a need, and there haven't been articles saying they're still trying to. Some blurbs here and there that if someone asks, they'd listen, but nothing that they're still trying to trade him.

and as far as the "tried to trade him with the 3rd OA", no one has mentioned what they were offering that package up for. Could have been 1OA, maybe RNH and a 1st, maybe for Cam Ward...there has been literally NO SUBSTANTIAL INFORMATION to say what that was for. So you can't say no one wanted him b/c you are only cherry picking the side that no one dealt for him.

so yes, it is disingenuous...

 

[Randy Randerson]

I'm assuming buttman is a troll? I've never seen anyone ignore logic this way before. I don't know how a player who has had 0 decline in play that puts up 1st line numbers playing games 2nd and 3rd line minutes is a cap dump. He would have gotten Backes or Lucic style contracts if he were a FA last year.

But hey in the land of Toronto Kadri is a stud and a proven first line producer in Hartnell is a declining cap dump.

I think you got it right with the first part of this message, why did you have to go and sling mud at the whole leafs fanbase who by the looks of it have been defending Hartnell's value in this thread?

Hartnell doesn't make sense for us because of forward depth, his age/unlikelihood that he's good when our team finally is and the need to start signing bridge deals in a couple of years that his cap hit could inhibit, but we acknowledge that he's still a good player. He'd bring more value from a team that's competing now/soon IMO