Proposal: Free agency edition Trade Rumours/Proposals [MOD - Stay on Topic] 5

[Joeyjoejoe]

I seriously don’t have any attachments to any of the core players here. Especially the ones that have been here 4-5 years.

In other times I would be up and arms about trading a core player as I was when Karlsson, Stone, Spezza, Zibenejad, or even Heatly back then were traded. The difference between those core players and this core is that they actually somewhat had a resemblance of winning hockey, even though it was inconsistent season to season and not a lot of deep playoff runs, they still provided us with memorable winning moments.@ and got themselves into the playoffs every other season.

These dudes have been a perennial basement dwellers since they got into the league, a lot of that is circumstances out of their hands like terrible coaching, management and ownership, but this core has never shown the ability to overcome those shortcomings like the previous cores have. So based on this losing, I have no strong connection to these players, what’s the worst that can happen, we lose even more? Cool I am used to it by now.

 

[Relapsing]

The challenge with trading a core piece is that you don’t have a ton of options.

Unless there’s truth to Brady/team being unhappy with each other, I don’t think it makes any sense to move him. No real logic behind trading Stützle, Sanderson, Pinto or Greig.

Norris isn’t movable if he has another shoulder injury. Chabot can’t go if you’re moving Chychrun which is inevitable. I suppose you can move Batherson in a hockey deal to fill a need, but I don’t think that would be wise.

It’s easy to say trade a core piece. When you break it down I’m not sure who you would trade.

Team is better off just finding a goalie and RD this summer and hoping for the best - it’s the quickest way to a turnaround. I don’t think they’re too far off here. If they suck again next season, the core is going to come undone anyway. Both team and some players will want to move on. I don’t really buy that you’re losing value by keeping them around one more year and letting things play out.

I cannot at this point fathom running it back with 90% of the players Dorion assembled and expecting a quick turnaround.

This team has at no point shown that they are capable of finding that level of success as a group.

Yes, they have had stretches of dominant play, but it's never sustained, is it? They have, in the back half of this season alone, proven to themselves and us that they understand what it takes to win, only to falter spectacularly immediately afterwards.

Whatever the reason (bad makeup, bad habits from DJ they can't shake, a lack of buy in to JMs preaching), this team as assembled just isn't finding enough success on a week to week basis for us to be a good team.

Idk what the answer is anymore, but I cannot believe it lies in trying this group out again next year with only a handful of roster changes.

 

[branch]

There is something weird going on with the team, and these reports of some players not being happy and management not being happy with some young players has a certain ring of truth to it to me.
Even when they were winning there was a muted body language, weird vibes, that I found a bit odd.

Honestly I think G is hard to work with. You can see him barking at them on the bench and between whistles. He is too demanding for the frat boys club and caused a lot of friction

 

[Gil Gunderson]

Is this team bad because the goaltending is terrible? Or is the goaltending terrible because this team is bad?

It's the Korpisalo and the Egg.

There's improvement to be made on the team but they are nowhere near this bad with average goaltending. Korpisalo isn't a good goalie. He had 30 good games last year and has been terrible for 90% of his career.

I wonder if Staios or JM thinks Brady isn't delivering as a captain, and has either challenged him or said that they think the captaincy is up for grabs.

No insider info here at all, and I don't want to contribute to the Brady friction rumours from Twitter.

They can blame him all they want. Leadership isn't going to repair the RD void we have and subpar goaltending.

 

[Big Muddy]

Not sure about the need to make massive moves. A RD & a goaltender are the definite needs. Also, getting a coach that will institute the structure and team D that will be required is the other important move. No idea if the latest news about Brady has any substance. Might just be speculation - who knows?

As for last night, you could see they were out of gas with the back-to-back. They had no push back in the late 2nd period and 3rd period.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

Is there really much more to fixing this team than getting a goalie? I don't see how moving any core pieces does anything if it doesn't result in average goaltending coming our way.

Is it the only issue? No, but we're probably in the playoff race with a .905 save percentage.

Yes. We're very shallow at RD. We also need more guys who actually like playing a 200 foot game, and don't have to be badgered into giving that effort on both ends of the ice.

That's the big problem...they all want to pad their stats and play a fun game, and have to have their arm twisted to play a complete game. That is why the team is so inconsistent. You can't make a player enjoy throwing bodychecks consistently, and you can't make a player play a complete game consistently. That's something that has to come from within.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

It truly is incredible how atrocious goaltending can sink your team.

Going to be devastating if we dismantle the core and our goaltending is still like .750

Not sure about the need to make massive moves. A RD & a goaltender are the definite needs. Also, getting a coach that will institute the structure and team D that will be required is the other important move. No idea if the latest news about Brady has any substance. Might just be speculation - who knows?

As for last night, you could see they were out of gas with the back-to-back. They had no push back in the late 2nd period and 3rd period.

When goaltending is this bad it warps everyone idea of everything.

Yes. We're very shallow at RD. We also need more guys who actually like playing a 200 foot game, and don't have to be badgered into giving that effort on both ends of the ice.

That's the big problem...they all want to pad their stats and play a fun game, and have to have their arm twisted to play a complete game. That is why the team is so inconsistent. You can't make a player enjoy throwing bodychecks consistently, and you can't make a player play a complete game consistently. That's something that has to come from within.

They’ve been playing consistent two way hockey for a while now.

 

[Big Muddy]

It truly is incredible how atrocious goaltending can sink your team.

Going to be devastating if we dismantle the core and our goaltending is still like .750


When goaltending is this bad it warps everyone idea of everything.


They’ve been playing consistent two way hockey for a while now.

Sure, the goaltending was weak, although there were screens on the first two goals. Not letting the goalie off the hook, just adding detail.

There were definitely some weak plays & break downs in the 1st period that put them behind the eight-ball. I would not put this game into the consistent 2 way play category.

The team just ran of gas after that 3rd goal late in the 2nd period. They didn't even have a shot in the 3rd period.

You can't win with just one goal and we've been able to push back after getting behind in previous games. But, not tonight because the energy level wasn't there. Not too surprising of course, but the post game analysis from some will be pretty shallow.

 

[HSF]

He was sucking before Hamonic on his pairing. JBD suddenly looking great when not paired with Chychrun.

he hasnt been that bad this year but hasnt been amazing.

hopefully it lets us sign him to a cheaper contract in the summer

 

[Burrowsaurus]

Sure, the goaltending was weak, although there were screens on the first two goals. Not letting the goalie off the hook, just adding detail.

There were definitely some break downs in the 1st period that put them behind the eight-ball. I would include this game in the consistent 2 way play category.

The team just ran of gas after that 3rd goal late in the 2nd period. They didn't even have a shot in the 3rd period.

You can't win with just one goal and we've been able to push back after getting behind in previous games. But, not tonight because the energy level wasn't there. Not too surprising of course, but the post game analysis from some will be pretty shallow.

I’ll give them the third period. Clearly their minds were elsewhere.

Okay on the goalie. I see goalies we play and goalies I watch in other games save pucks that are screened. 2 goals on first 7 3 on first 14 or whatever is no acceptable and it happens to us often. Stats show our goalies are failing to stop the easy shots and if they did we would be in a respectable position. It’s a discussion that’s been had a hundred times now. They’ve been brutal. Truly.

Nashville has some horrendous breakdowns too lol.

We are playing games at a disadvantage because of our goalies

The level of our goaltending has us critiquing every single move our players make. I mean technically on every shot against a player didn’t do their job

 

[HSF]

I dont know how you watch that game and dont critisize Chychrun. He didnt skate back when he got caught pinching on a 2 on 1. Was insane to see, I see guys in beer league back check harder. I actually cant wrap my head around it at this level.

Sure Hamonic was bad but they were both individually horrid.

Chychrun hasnt been great but playing with Hamonic has thrown everyone who plays with him off.

Also Stuztle should take a lot more heat for that 2 on 1.

 

[Philadelphia Collins]

Excited to see what Staios is cooking up for the deadline, have zero idea what this new management thinks after watching the same team we’ve watched on ice since October lol

The real interesting part for me is the draft. Dorion, Mann and crew always seemed like they went off the board with their picks in an effort to seem like the smartest guys in the room/pure incompetence. With the prospect pool being as shallow as it is they need to hit on at least one of their 1sts this year.

Competitive teams like Dallas always seem to find a solid NHLer with those mid first and second rounders (Johnson and Stankoven in ‘21) and it would be cool if Ottawa invested heavily in amateur scouting under Andlauer

 

[Burrowsaurus]

Chychrun hasnt been great but playing with Hamonic has thrown everyone who plays with him off.

Also Stuztle should take a lot more heat for that 2 on 1.

Chychrun strikes me as a very emotional guy.

 

[HSF]

I think Ottawa should get rid of Forsberg and add a goalie (no chance anyone takes Korpi).

Add a mid tier RD who can push Hamonic out. Keep Chychrun. Add a heavy/faster winger and get rid of Senko and Kubalik.

We just need a buzzsaw type winger. a Cousins, Bunting Hyman type. Does not need to be overly offensively talented. Just a heavy player on the wing. Start building around Brady play style.

Huge branny fan and think he will do great elsewhere. Might be a piece to use to get a winger

Chychrun strikes me as a very emotional guy.

Ya play went down once the trade rumours started

I still sign him

 

[BondraTime]

he hasnt been that bad this year but hasnt been amazing.

hopefully it lets us sign him to a cheaper contract in the summer

Why would we want to sign him? He's a completely redundant piece and not needed on the roster whatsoever

Actually creates a very bad build for the roster

 

[Big Muddy]

I’ll give them the third period. Clearly their minds were elsewhere.

Okay on the goalie. I see goalies we play and goalies I watch in other games save pucks that are screened. 2 goals on first 7 3 on first 14 or whatever is no acceptable and it happens to us often. Stats show our goalies are failing to stop the easy shots and if they did we would be in a respectable position. It’s a discussion that’s been had a hundred times now. They’ve been brutal. Truly.

Nashville has some horrendous breakdowns too lol.

We are playing games at a disadvantage because of our goalies

The level of our goaltending has us critiquing every single move our players make. I mean technically on every shot against a player didn’t do their job

Bolded - LOL.

Doubt if we win that game the way the team played even if the goalie made a couple more stops in the 1st period. JMHO.

As a general comment, better goaltending would definitely help us though

 

[TheNewEra]

Yup
Everybody loved EK in spring 2017
We've moved on
And its ok
Big changes are needed
Vancouver acquired Lindholm not because he is friend with Hughes or blabla
Because they needed him
Our roster was built by an idiott

Only reason we moved on from ek is because we got stupidly lucky and got the 3rd overall pick out of it

 

[BankStreetParade]

It truly is incredible how atrocious goaltending can sink your team.

Going to be devastating if we dismantle the core and our goaltending is still like .750

When goaltending is this bad it warps everyone idea of everything.

It's funny, when I was saying this back in late October/early November, I got a ton of push-back saying I was making excuses for DJ, that I was a shill for management, and whatever other usual bullshit. Here we are months later still talking about the same damn thing. Jacques Martin is a better coach than DJ, yet the goalies still have the same goddamn stats they did under DJ.

Goalie	GP w/ DJ	Sv% w/ DJ	GAA w/ DJ	GP w/ Martin	Sv% w/ Martin	GAA w/ Martin
Korpisalo	17	.892	3.50	22	.882	3.34
Forsberg	11	.876	3.23	10	.902	3.27

Slight regression in sv% for Korpisalo with a slight improvement in GAA.
Good improvement in sv% for Forsberg with a slight decrease in GAA.
More or less, almost identical stat lines.

The teams head-to-head under the 2 coaches:

Coach	Games Played	Wins	Losses	P%	Goal Differential	GF/GP	GA/GP	PP%	PK%
DJ	26	11	15	.423	-2	3.35	3.42	17.8	72.4
Martin	31	14	14	.500	-13	3.26	3.68	15.2	75.0

Worth noting that DJ didn't have Pinto in his lineup, Chabot only played 9/26, Zub missed 7, Greig missed 10.
Under Martin, Chabot played 26/31, Zub missed 6.
And yet across the board, this team is worse in most categories under Martin. Healthier lineup, more defensively focused, longer stretch of games than DJ and somehow stats are down in most major categories. No, this is not an indictment of Martin or a validation of DJ. This is an introspection of a season that couldn't be more f***ing confusing.

 

[Mark Stones Spleen]

If the plan is to trade Chych, pair him with Zub (if he comes back) for a bit.

 

[Relapsing]

Only reason we moved on from ek is because we got stupidly lucky and got the 3rd overall pick out of it

Uhhh... No, it isn't. That's not true at all. One of the oddest revisionist history takes I've seen

 

[Burrowsaurus]

Why would we want to sign him? He's a completely redundant piece and not needed on the roster whatsoever

Actually creates a very bad build for the roster

It’s not very bad. Not every team that makes the playoffs has this perfect build.

A top 4 of Sanderson Zub chabot chychrun can make the playoffs while being well coached and well goaltended. I believe that. Heck we made the conference finals! With not that great of a team but coach having a good year and a goalie having a good year

 

[BondraTime]

It’s not very bad. Not every team that makes the playoffs has this perfect build.

A top 4 of Sanderson Zub chabot chychrun can make the playoffs while being well coached and well goaltended. I believe that. Heck we made the conference finals! With not that great of a team but coach having a good year and a goalie having a good year

Chychrun is very, very bad on the right. He's not needed for offense, and not needed for defense. There is no role, or need, for him in Ottawa. Spending 7.5+ on a guy who is being put in the wrong position, not on PP1 or PK1, and not relied on at even strength makes very little sense.

If we sign him longterm with the thought of putting him on the right side, we may as well pack it in. That's a ton of money, for a player not suited for the role, and not needed. It makes so little sense

 

[Wallet Inspector]

What's f***ed up is that if we suck AGAIN next year we can't even blow it up due to needing to forfeit a 1st in 2025 or 2026(maybe Andlauer can try to appeal it, but good luck).

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Sens will have to do a bit of a reset , a step back to do a retool to mold the roster.

A Goalie and a top 4 RD are priorities.. Likely off season
We do need more jam up front ; Tarasenko will be moved ; Its possible he comes back .. but the horizon is in question. If they are bringing in 30+ vets He is definitely a strong option.
I was thinking Norris may be a guy they could move in a hockey trade to bring in an important piece. We'll see but he may be off the table completely
I have no faith in the goal tending. As unpalatable as it may be .. If we can pick someone up I would buy out Korpisalo. Forsberg has 1 more year.. keep him as a backup
Buy out Hamonic. Get a ufa RD. Offer them extra but they have to have some runway left in them.
Trade if possible but Don't offer Brannstrom a contract. Let him become a UFA .. Possible revisit but unlikely
Waive Kubalik or move him for a bad contract UFA that offers something different
Use Belleville callups to run out the season. Moving Tank or Norris LTIR provide the space.
Move Chychrun

Not on the table for me
Sanderson
Tkachuk
Stutzle
Batherson -- good pts/$ contract; more in him
Zub
Pinto
Greig

If only we had some Draft capital we didn't desperately need after 3 years of wasting our top 1st round picks. The board should have handcuffed Dorion with the sale being imminent. The first mistake of new ownership was giving Dotion his head last off season would have resulted in firing him even without the loss of the 1st in the Dadonov trade, They all underestimated the damage he could do

 

[TheNewEra]

Uhhh... No, it isn't. That's not true at all. One of the oddest revisionist history takes I've seen

People were pissed at the return since Norris was projected to be a 2nd liner, demelo was a throw in and the first was supposed to be a late one. The deal and moving on became a lot easier when demelo worked with Chabot, Norris did better than expected and we got stutzle

But yeah I'm the one revising history